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Wolverine
05-19-2009, 11:28 AM
It's not a joke. I am serious, Jiraiya would win because of his sealing an barrier knowledge as well as his insight in sage mode. That is why base Jiraiya wouldn't fist fight sage mode Naruto like Pein did, but Hermit mode Jiraiya would have the speed and endurance to endure a close fight with sage Naruto. Get it?

That barrier technique can be useless if it catches a Kage Bunshin and not the real Naruto. If anything, Naruto will locate Jman's location instead of the opposite happening. Also, Naruto can sense chakra, so he could locate Jman's location and take the necessary safeguards to ambush him without getting into trouble himself. Jman couldn't sense chakra so thats another big difference between the two - possible a MASSIVE difference....

Naruto has perfected SM, so his attributes are much better than Jman, since the latter hasn't perfected SM. Another big difference...

You say that Jman has the speed and endurance to endure a close fight with Sage Naruto ?? If he couldn't endure a fight with 3 Pain bodies, that too when Deva - who's atleast 10 times stronger than all other bodies - never fought, then how could he endure a fight with Sage Naruto ?? Its not how much damage you can inflict, but how much damage you can endure that decides the outcome of the fight. And Jman didn't fare half as good as Naruto against the other Pain bodies...

Naruto has clearly surpassed Jman. If its a SM vs SM fight, Naruto clearly wins. If its a base fight, then its Jman. Overall Naruto > Jman...

lamps123
05-19-2009, 01:28 PM
naruto can go back into sage far quicker than jman.
that should make a difference,

Wolverine
05-19-2009, 01:30 PM
naruto can go back into sage far quicker than jman.
that should make a difference,

Actually Jman will never run out of Sage Mode unless he himself wishes to do so, since the frogs are continuously collecting natural energy for him...

So that is actually a disadvantage for Naruto...

lamps123
05-19-2009, 01:52 PM
Actually Jman will never run out of Sage Mode unless he himself wishes to do so, since the frogs are continuously collecting natural energy for him...

So that is actually a disadvantage for Naruto...
seriously i taught he had a limit too.

Dagoro
05-19-2009, 02:01 PM
A fight between HM Jiraya and SM Naruto wouldn't last long, since both use nuclear lvl techs. Naruto has FRS and that puts him over the top, they're pretty much evenly matched on everything else.

Wolverine
05-19-2009, 03:24 PM
seriously i taught he had a limit too.

No... the frogs fuse on Jman's shoulders and collect natural energy for him required for him to go Sage Mode... They even suggested the same thing to Naruto, but Kyubi didn't allow it...

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-19-2009, 06:37 PM
Yeah i agree with you man. Great points /sarcasm.

You know what.

Sasori > Sound Team > Faggots and KYF

Okay? Good. The sound shinobi are mere pawns. Got that? Orochimaru minions ARE PAWNS

New fight - Jiraiya v. Sage Naruto

Handicaps ~ No Kyuubi and Jiraiya can use Ma/Pa for natural energy. Nothing else.

Seperatly theyre pawns, but together theyre a force to be recon with or has everyone gone crazy? Ones a taijutsu monster, the others an intelligent medical nin with prior knowledge of sasori and his abilites and the last one is a long range fighting strategist who can conceal himslef and pick his opponent apart with traps and super arrows.

Lol, but poison and Iron sand makes him the better man though, right. And whoever said sasori cant be effected by genjutsu when he has senses like seeing and hearing is wrong.

Seriously, An old lady with puppet master skills and sakura beat this guy. Lol, and I dont even see those two beating any one of these three in a fight.

And has everyone forgot that theyre fighting in the woods like where neji and kido faguht before? Woods! Meaning not in the open and surrounded by rocks, trapped. So, sasori cant see that well and kido,kabuto can hide while watching kimi fight sasori. And Kimis a freaking taijutsu monster. Kyuubi juiced naruto "like the one that fought sasuke and neji" and his 100 kyuubi juiced KBs couldnt touch the guy so how sasori and his many puppets going to do any better?

And you do realise your one of the faggots thinking naruto beat sasuke, lol. Seriously, thats retartedly bias.

And Jman would rape naruto in a one on one fight with no favoring circumstances.

Although naruto has the supirior SM, Jman still has the speed and endurance advantage against naruto in HM because while naruto has to dispell KBs to gain sage chakra, Jman can just keep fighting while Ma and Pa gather the NE for him.

TheSixthHokage
05-19-2009, 08:47 PM
How about Sasuke (before Hebi powers) versus Orochimaru (before bed-ridden)?

Location: Open field;
Handicaps: Sasuke's abilities at the time of his betrayal of Orochimaru, that's it;

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-19-2009, 08:51 PM
How about Sasuke (before Hebi powers) versus Orochimaru (before bed-ridden)?

Location: Open field;
Handicaps: Sasuke's abilities at the time of his betrayal of Orochimaru, that's it;

Oro and sasuke go at it for a while, but after Oro realises sasukes been hiding his true strength, he tries his recarnation jutsu on sasuke. but, sasuke rapes him with genjutsu so its just the same outcome, different place.

liondemon
05-19-2009, 08:55 PM
Sasuke waited for that moment to kill Orochumaru when he was at his weakest for a good reason. Orochumaru's "body" never got a chance to literally fight Sasuke. Orochumaru would give him what he wanted. Can u picture Sasuke going up against a 4 tails Naruto and living? Orochumaru was a 50 year old genius that was spoken of with respect as a "ninja" by all who referred to him, except when Itachi and Sasuke were acting bad. Sasuke would hold his own, but Orochumaru is too wise, and too much of a true natural genius, not because of a Sharingan, for Sasuke to beat him. I think Orochu may have even been able to put up a half decent fight against Itachi, but still be brutally murdered. No eternal seals.

Dagoro
05-19-2009, 08:56 PM
Oro and sasuke go at it for a while, but after Oro realises sasukes been hiding his true strength, he tries his recarnation jutsu on sasuke. but, sasuke rapes him with genjutsu so its just the same outcome, different place.

Ahh, i just came.

Fixed for ya.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-19-2009, 09:00 PM
Sasuke waited for that moment to kill Orochumaru when he was at his weakest for a good reason. Orochumaru's "body" never got a chance to literally fight Sasuke. Orochumaru would give him what he wanted. Can u picture Sasuke going up against a 4 tails Naruto and living? Orochumaru was a 50 year old genius that was spoken of with respect as a "ninja" by all who referred to him, except when Itachi and Sasuke were acting bad. Sasuke would hold his own, but Orochumaru is too wise, and too much of a true natural genius, not because of a Sharingan, for Sasuke to beat him. I think Orochu may have even been able to put up a half decent fight against Itachi, but still be brutally murdered. No eternal seals.

It still comes down to Oro trying to take over sasukes body during or at the end of theyre fight when he gains the upper hand. However, sasuke would just beat Oro with genjutsu like he did in their real fight.

I know Oros strong, but he just cant stand up to SG genjutsu.

@Dagoro:

So sasuke would still win because of genjutsu and all you can do is personally insult me like a true narutard. You go around the forum all day everyday riding narutos dick and I dont say anything so stop being bitter pric because sasuke beat naruto twice.

liondemon
05-19-2009, 09:34 PM
U may be right about Orochu not being able to handle his genjutsu. If it came down to that, orochu would probably lose.

Myth
05-19-2009, 11:04 PM
Orochimaru would fucking obliterate sasuke any person to say otherwsie is a tool when sasuke himself said he only beat oro cause oro was already weak...

Nothing to argue here at all... Oro knows everything about sasuek having taught him for 2 years and we all know oro isn't the type to reveal anything to you about his own skills...

Edo Tensei and its a wrap... hell even without edo tensei its a wrap.. elementally wise he rapes sasuke wind and earth both are stronger then lighting nd earth over fire... in terms of speed oro takes him in terms of skill jutsu experience POWER durability taijutsu oro takes him.. hell oro is even a monster in genjutsu defense the only person to ever get a good grip on him was itachi and oro broke from that but itachi sliced off his arm before he can make a seal.

Oro>sasuke in everything going by what the manga showed.. hell sauske himself admits that he only beat orochimaru because orochimaru was weakened...

edit:sasuke's genjutsu is nowhere near the level of itachi's which is the only person that ever trapped oro successfully.. and oro broke from that genjutsu as well.. i can provide evidence for the noobs who want it...

liondemon
05-19-2009, 11:08 PM
I almost brought up the fact that Orochumaru got out of Itachi's genjutsu, so definitely Sasuke but I'm not sure if he broke it or Itachi let him leave after showing him that he couldnt overtake him, not against "these eyes"

Dagoro
05-19-2009, 11:14 PM
http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-363/page015.html

From Sasfag's own mouth.

Lol and KYF has the nerve to scream bias. What a nudge.

Myth
05-19-2009, 11:18 PM
I almost brought up the fact that Orochumaru got out of Itachi's genjutsu, so definitely Sasuke but I'm not sure if he broke it or Itachi let him leave after showing him that he couldnt overtake him, not against "these eyes"

he broke it he started to form seals but itachi reacted quick n cut his hand off http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-345/page009.html
.... itachi's genjutsu >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>sasuke..

Plus oro's genjutsu stat is 5 he has already shown the ability to cast very powerful genjutsu before... and his defense is great as well.... so yeah sasuke's genjutus=fail against oro...

redexploit
05-19-2009, 11:21 PM
hell oro is even a monster in genjutsu defense the only person to ever get a good grip on him was itachi and oro broke from that but itachi sliced off his arm before he can make a seal.

I totally didn't remember that. Would you mind telling me the chapter in which it occurs? I'd love to read it.

Thanks!

Myth
05-19-2009, 11:22 PM
I totally didn't remember that. Would you mind telling me the chapter in which it occurs? I'd love to read it.

Thanks!

it wasn't a chapter a flashback its in this link
http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-345/page009.html

liondemon
05-19-2009, 11:24 PM
He is just saying that he wasnt all beat up like that against Orochu because Orochu was weakened, meaning had he not been, he wouldnt hae come to Karin looking like he had just woke up from a good night sleep. Doesnt necessarily mean Orochu would hae beat him. Karin saw him beat up against whover and was like how the hell did u even beat Orochu if u end up so beat up against whoever it may have been. I think Orochu could have beat him, but if Orochu couldnt or didnt break the genjutsu Itachi had him in, he wouldnt have broken Sasuke's, even at full strength, especially if Sasuke really did see what Itachi used against him and did the same thing. To me, the deal breaker is whether or not Itachi released Orochu or if Orochu got out by himself. I think Itachi released it because it was Orochu's genjutsu but Itachi didnt want Orochu's powers, so unlike Sasuke, he would just break the genjutsu and Orochu would no that Itachi was too talented to overcome in genutsu and run away.

Dagoro
05-19-2009, 11:32 PM
He is just saying that he wasnt all beat up like that against Orochu because Orochu was weakened, meaning had he not been, he wouldnt hae come to Karin looking like he had just woke up from a good night sleep. Doesnt necessarily mean Orochu would hae beat him.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/363/14/
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/363/15/

"My opponent was aka, he was stronger then i thought"

"Weakling. You're even the man who beat Orochimaru"

" Orochimaru was already weak, that is all there is to it"

Seriously, if your interpretation skills are so bad, that you can't even put 2 and 2 together from such a simply written dialogue, grab a pointy hat and go sit in the corner with KYF.

Good god, there should be a penalty for multiple nonsensical posts.

liondemon
05-19-2009, 11:39 PM
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/363/14/
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/363/15/

"My opponent was aka, he was stronger then i thought"

"Weakling. You're even the man who beat Orochimaru"

" Orochimaru was already weak, there is all thereis to it"

Seriously, if your interpretation skills are so bad, that you can't put 2 and 2 together from such a simply written dialogue, grab a pointy hat and go sit in the corner with KYF.

Good god, there should be a penalty for multiple nonsensical posts.

Get off my nutz. That's all it is to it. Sasuke never said I would not have beat Orochu if he wasnt already weak. Sasuke was questioned after seeing him so beat up. His excuses were, he was Akatsuki and that he underestimated him. She basically, ho can the man who beat Orochu appear to be a "weakling" by getting so beat up. To them and many others, Orochu was a Lord. Sasuke said, he was already weak, and that's all ima say bout that. That's all it is to it. Get off my nutz Boi

Dagoro
05-19-2009, 11:45 PM
^

I can honestly say, that a blueberry muffin makes more sense than you.

Everyone and their pets know that Sasuke ambushed Oro in his death bed because he would have been defeated at the hands of a 100% Oro.

It has been canon for lord knows how long, but the airheads, like you anf KYF insist on making ridiculous arguments brought forth from the deepest parts of your asses.

liondemon
05-19-2009, 11:56 PM
Sasuke ambushed him on the death bead because he knew there was no gurantee that he could beat a 100% Orochu. Sasuke was determined not to "risk his life unncessarily" until he killed Itachi. He as smart instead of cocky as usual. He told Orochu that he was stronger than Orochu now. He didnt mean no that u are about to "die" i am stronger. He meant in general whether he believed it or not. Itachi said against Sharingan Orochu didnt stand a chance.I was with Orochu. KYF said the genjutsu thing which made me reconsider since Itachi "defeated" him with the same genjutsu Sasuke saw and used. Orochumaru wouldnt have dared try Itachi when he was anything less than 100% . Read what's going on first. I hope u dont continue these 3rd grade, man crush unsults. I wont be your NF arch nemesis so keep looking. U sound stupid saying shit like blueberry muffin and everyone and their pets. Grow up Boi and dont make me tell u again to get off my nutz. u should get off KYF nutz while u at it. Take that BS u bringing back to 3rd grade where it belongs. Done playing this gay ass back and forth game with u that uve been trying to start for a while now.

Dagoro
05-20-2009, 12:03 AM
Sasuke ambushed him on the death bead because he knew there was no gurantee that he could beat a 100% Orochu. Sasuke was determined not to "risk his life unncessarily" until he killed Itachi. He as smart instead of cocky as usual.

This = pussy move.

He told Orochu that he was stronger than Orochu now.

He gave a gay self gradizing speech about how before the Uchiha, all others were shit. Then he got rocked by a drunk rapper.

I wont be your NF arch nemesis so keep looking. U sound stupid saying shit like blueberry muffin and everyone and their pets. Grow up Boi and dont make me tell u again to get off my nutz. u should get off KYF nutz while u at it. Take that BS u bringing back to 3rd grade where it belongs.

Please, you have been getting ripped to shreds on other threads as well not only this one. I don't need to bother with you when the rest of the members already spank you so effortlessly.

Don't get butt hurt though, its only the internet.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-20-2009, 12:26 AM
^

I can honestly say, that a blueberry muffin makes more sense than you.

Everyone and their pets know that Sasuke ambushed Oro in his death bed because he would have been defeated at the hands of a 100% Oro.

It has been canon for lord knows how long, but the airheads, like you anf KYF insist on making ridiculous arguments brought forth from the deepest parts of your asses.

Whinny as ever when even you know no matter how powerful Oro is at 100 percent, sasukes SG genjutsu would bring him down like itachis did before so get over it. now, Im not saying sasuke could win a physical battle against Oro even though he has the elemental advantage. Just that Oro was beat by a basic SG genjutsu from itachi and then beat again by sasukes. So, wether Oros body is 100 percent his mind is still as strong yet sasuke beat him so get over it.

LMAO, you insult us yet you would dare state Oro could beat sasukes genjutsu "by saying Oro would win". Lol, as hypocritical as ever I see dagoro.



This = pussy move.

He gave a gay self gradizing speech about how before the Uchiha, all others were shit. Then he got rocked by a drunk rapper.



Please, you have been getting ripped to shreds on other threads as well not only this one. I don't need to bother with you when the rest of the members already spank you so effortlessly.

Don't get butt hurt though, its only the internet.

Lol, more personal attacks to show how frustrated you are that naruto cant beat the so called loser you insist on pointlessly hating for no other reason then you love naruto so much. Why?

And sasuke ambushing Oro just shows strategy, not cowardice. Sasuke had a more important fight to have so why should he risk his life when he can beat his opponent easily. Of course being a shinobi is cowarly, right:rolleyes:. Maybe sasuke shouldve charged at Oro head on yelling how hes going down. IDK, hows a shinobi suppost to act?

Myth
05-20-2009, 12:34 AM
orochimaru>sasuke nuff said... there's no he is saying this he is saying that he said 1 thing orochimaru was already weak after karin told him "u even beat oro n got beat up"...

Im sure a bunch of noobs can think of ways to see that he said this but didn't say that sorry.. no assumptions allowed only cannon stuff which is sasuke said he beat oro when oro was weak the way that sentence soudns is the way its interpreted there are no hidden meanings.. even if u find them they don't matter since they aren't cannon but rather some fantasy u though up in ur head..

Orochimaru>sasuke in every single thing.. skill,ninjutsu,taijutsu,elemental adv on both elements,experience and knowledge.. also not break it to u sasuke tards he can bend anyone with the cs to his will at any time...

Oro >sasuke.. orochimaru partially healthy took on 4 tails sasuke would have been killed.... ZZzzz

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-20-2009, 12:56 AM
orochimaru>sasuke nuff said... there's no he is saying this he is saying that he said 1 thing orochimaru was already weak after karin told him "u even beat oro n got beat up"...

Im sure a bunch of noobs can think of ways to see that he said this but didn't say that sorry.. no assumptions allowed only cannon stuff which is sasuke said he beat oro when oro was weak the way that sentence soudns is the way its interpreted there are no hidden meanings.. even if u find them they don't matter since they aren't cannon but rather some fantasy u though up in ur head..

Orochimaru>sasuke in every single thing.. skill,ninjutsu,taijutsu,elemental adv on both elements,experience and knowledge.. also not break it to u sasuke tards he can bend anyone with the cs to his will at any time...

Oro >sasuke.. orochimaru partially healthy took on 4 tails sasuke would have been killed.... ZZzzz

LMAO! Blah blah blah, my oppinion blah blah. Myth, please shut up. All you did was insult and give your oppinion, no facts as usuall. Sasuke only said Oro was weak, not he couldnt of won otherwise so get over it.

Physical skill such as strength, speed, endurance sasuke has, but Oro has better technical skills which come from alot more years of training though.

Ninjutsu, Oro has a great replacement hendge, edo tensai, earth style summons and snake jutsu. Sasuke has three fire jutsu, five raiton jutsu and the only S class raiton jutsu, summon. Oro has this one.

Taijutsu, oro has the grass sword and good taijutsu. Sasuke has a sword which can use raiton to cut anything and his taijutsu is faster, stronger then Oros so sasuke gets taijutsu.

Elemental advantage, lol. Earth is weak against Raiton fool! Seriously, did you even think about that one?

Exspirience and knowledge Oro does have the advantage, but physical skill, taijutsu and genjutsu sasuke has the advantage so suck it.

And for crying out load, 4tail naruto just sits still and attacks with extenable arm or big chakra blast. All which can be avoided by super speed and super fast reflexes that a SG offers so more BS.

Seriously, I thought you were going to meet up with a member for a fight or something so why are you bothering us?

Silverblade
05-20-2009, 01:05 AM
If Orochimaru fought Shippuden Sasuke with his powers before the third then.

Orochimaru > Sasuke. He could of obliterate his lightning jutsu with fuuton. However Orochimaru lost his ninjutsu ability.


But Sasuke > Orochimaru. No Orochimaru > Sasuke. SINCE HE CANT USE NINJUTSU. He got the sword, snakes and his fists. Sasuke has much more, Lightning, fire, sharingan, etc.

Sasuke attacking Orochimaru in the bed = Some faggot shit and very low. That's like someone scrawny like Napolean Dynamite beating up a Pro boxer in the hospital bed.

Sasuke wins because he has Kirin and that could level down Orochimaru huge snakes. Like Manda and the hydra technique. Sharingan can see through everything since it's fully developed so yeah.

Myth
05-20-2009, 01:20 AM
LMAO! Blah blah blah, my oppinion blah blah. Myth, please shut up. All you did was insult and give your oppinion, no facts as usuall. Sasuke only said Oro was weak, not he couldnt of won otherwise so get over it.

Physical skill such as strength, speed, endurance sasuke has, but Oro has better technical skills which come from alot more years of training though.

Ninjutsu, Oro has a great replacement hendge, edo tensai, earth style summons and snake jutsu. Sasuke has three fire jutsu, five raiton jutsu and the only S class raiton jutsu, summon. Oro has this one.

Taijutsu, oro has the grass sword and good taijutsu. Sasuke has a sword which can use raiton to cut anything and his taijutsu is faster, stronger then Oros so sasuke gets taijutsu.

Elemental advantage, lol. Earth is weak against Raiton fool! Seriously, did you even think about that one?

Exspirience and knowledge Oro does have the advantage, but physical skill, taijutsu and genjutsu sasuke has the advantage so suck it.

And for crying out load, 4tail naruto just sits still and attacks with extenable arm or big chakra blast. All which can be avoided by super speed and super fast reflexes that a SG offers so more BS.

Seriously, I thought you were going to meet up with a member for a fight or something so why are you bothering us?

I have no proof lol....http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/363/15/ that's my proof... are u really that dumb lol here is what is said..

Karin"Ur even the man that beat Orochimaru" - meaning she thinks how could he have been injured if he beat a guy like oro which is feat in itself.

Sasuke"Orochimaru was already weak that's alll there is to that" - meaning he replied with yes i beat him but he was already weakened..

Sure u can say he never said he couldn't beat a full healthy orochimaru, there's only 1 problem thats called assuming without actual proof.. my proof is that link where's urs to say he could beat oro... dur durrrrr...

edited:....... in a nutshell oro>sasuke.... arguing with u is like arguing with a mentally challenged person.. u still wont get it

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-20-2009, 01:59 AM
I have no proof lol....http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/363/15/ that's my proof... are u really that dumb lol here is what is said..

Karin"Ur even the man that beat Orochimaru" - meaning she thinks how could he have been injured if he beat a guy like oro which is feat in itself.

Sasuke"Orochimaru was already weak that's alll there is to that" - meaning he replied with yes i beat him but he was already weakened..

Sure u can say he never said he couldn't beat a full healthy orochimaru, there's only 1 problem thats called assuming without actual proof.. my proof is that link where's urs to say he could beat oro... dur durrrrr...

edited:....... in a nutshell oro>sasuke.... arguing with u is like arguing with a mentally challenged person.. u still wont get it

Lol, even you should be able to grasp such an easy interpritation as this. Karins confused to how sasuke could get so beaten up after hed beaten Oro and without a scratch to show for it. And sasuke replies Oro was weak, obviously saying that if Oro wasnt weak he wouldnt have been unscathed and fully healthy, but Oro was weak and easy pickens to SG genjutsu.

LMAO! You put up a link where sasuke stated he beat Oro when he was weak, not he couldnt have otherwise. Yet you tell me not assume, lmao:rolleyes: Seriously, thats creepy Myth.

And since Oro was so weak against SG genjutsu, it should be obvious who would win in a one on one, everybody at full health fight.

Sasuke>Oro! Lol, Oro admitted himself itachi was stronger than he is which is why Oro wanted the SG in the first place. However, come to find out Oro was beat by just SG genjutsu. The same SG genjutsu sasuke has so by Oros own words and manga fact sasuke raped Oro with the same genjutsu itachi did. Sasukes stronger!

Lol, too bad there isnt another uchiha Oro can get his hands on to become stronger than sasuke.

Proof!

The reason Oro needed sasukehttp://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/344/003/
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/345/page-09/

But Oro ended up getting beat again by the same genjustu while in his own deminstion just proving whos strongerhttp://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/345/page-10/


So, sasuke has the same level of SG genjustu as itachi did, thus by Oros own words sasuke, like itachi is also stronger.

superninja
05-20-2009, 07:55 AM
How about Sasuke (before Hebi powers) versus Orochimaru (before bed-ridden)?

Location: Open field;
Handicaps: Sasuke's abilities at the time of his betrayal of Orochimaru, that's it;

If Orochimaru is fighting to kill Sasuke then I would give him bigger chances of winning. It's true Oro is vulnerable to sharingan genjutsu though, that and Sasuke also has kirin. Orochimaru has his secret that he is in fact a giant snake, so Sasuke wouldn't know that. Even if Sasuke catches Oro in genjutsu Sasuke would have to finish him off. And so, Oro has a chance to survive Sasuke's finishing attack.

Vengeance
05-20-2009, 05:08 PM
OMFG!!!!!!! Ok.... ok..... ok.... listen carefully Mr. Jelly man..... At that point Sasuke fully acknowledges that Orochimaru was better then him. The proof was shown to you yet you're still arguing the issue. I mean really now we all know Orochimaru was half dead when Sasuke ambushed him. The fight was in no way shape or form fair. I as a Sasuke fan fully accept this so why can't you? That's not to say that Sasuke wouldn't stand a chance now. However back then when it actually happened Sasuke would have gotten merced if he challenged Orochimaru head on while Orochimaru was still healthy. This is fucking canon man get with the program.

Wolverine
05-20-2009, 05:15 PM
OMFG!!!!!!! Ok.... ok..... ok.... listen carefully Mr. Jelly man..... At that point Sasuke fully acknowledges that Orochimaru was better then him. The proof was shown to you yet you're still arguing the issue. I mean really now we all know Orochimaru was half dead when Sasuke ambushed him. The fight was in no way shape or form fair. I as a Sasuke fan fully accept this so why can't you? That's not to say that Sasuke wouldn't stand a chance now. However back then when it actually happened Sasuke would have gotten merced if he challenged Orochimaru head on while Orochimaru was still healthy. This is fucking canon man get with the program.

LOL!! JELLY MAN!!!

Sasuke was inferior at that point of time. Plus Oro at his peak would have crushed him.

Myth
05-20-2009, 05:20 PM
@kyf HAWT...

Oro>sasuke there is no grasping i go by what i read there's many things i can interpret as well but they remain my assumptions and not facts.. whats fact is karin was shocked to how sasuke could be injured when he beat a guy like orochimaru meaning she knew oro's power and to see that sasuke beat him nd nearly died here is weird for her... sasuke replied with oro was already weak... meaning "i took him down when he was already weakened"..

did i mention oro>sasuke

poolangya
05-20-2009, 05:21 PM
orochimaru, full health, tons of forbidden jutsus, edo tensei
>
Sasuke

maybe except genjutsu, and i doubt orochimaru is stupid enough to be caught twice if he is in full health. if genjutsu connects, sasuke will win, otherwise, accept it, orochimaru pwns sasuke, orochimaru 8-2 sasuke

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-20-2009, 05:27 PM
Lol, oro admits himself that Itachi is stronger than him, but come to find out its just because of itachis SG genjutsu abilites. Which is also why Oro wanted the SG so bad in the first place. However, sasuke had developed his SG to the same level itachi had used on Oro before so sasukes stronger by Oros own accounts.

And Oro wasnt just beaten by sasukes genjutsu. He was beaten in his own demintion of soul transfer just proving how badly sasuke raped Oro. Honestly, wether oros 100 percent or not. He cant stand up to SG genjutsu which is why sasuke was and could beat Oro in this fight.

However, without SG genjutsu, sasuke cant win.

poolangya
05-20-2009, 05:34 PM
it is true, Orochimaru has a big fault with the sharingan, and sharingan is his biggest weakness because of his obsession over it. but will sasuke be able to cast it successfully? how many sharingan genjutsu styles does sasuke know? it would be his trump SG genjutsu against the many varied Jutsus of Orochimaru which would be far more superior than what sasuke ordinarily has. Sasuke has a chance of winning no doubt about it, but a very small chance. Sasuke 2-8 Orochimaru.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-20-2009, 05:52 PM
it is true, Orochimaru has a big fault with the sharingan, and sharingan is his biggest weakness because of his obsession over it. but will sasuke be able to cast it successfully? how many sharingan genjutsu styles does sasuke know? it would be his trump SG genjutsu against the many varied Jutsus of Orochimaru which would be far more superior than what sasuke ordinarily has. Sasuke has a chance of winning no doubt about it, but a very small chance. Sasuke 2-8 Orochimaru.

Your forgetting that sasuke SG wil also read oros every hand sign allowing sasuke to anticipate Oros attacks, thus making Oros many ninjutsu rather useless. So, Oros ninjutsu are useless and is severly weak against SG genjutsu which sasuke showed in the fight with deidara, hes capable of casting it from a good distance away.

Look how far away deidara wa when sasuke caught him in a genjutsuhttp://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/360/06/
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/360/15/

Myth
05-20-2009, 07:20 PM
Orochimaru > sasuke when oro is at full health.... sasuke>oro when oro's is sick plain and simple that what the manga shows and says... nothing to argue..

edit:rofll at sasuke developing his sharingan to itachi's level.. guess what neji developed his speed to yondaimes level

Silverblade
05-20-2009, 07:28 PM
I thought Sasuke would see through Orochimaru like Deidara. I still don't see how Orochimaru wins against Sasuke after the third removed his arsenal of ninjutsu.

Seriously. Orochimaru was just tossed to the side and we didn't see what he was really capable of. So i'm kind of iffy about Sasuke or Orochimaru being the victor for this match-up.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-20-2009, 07:34 PM
Orochimaru > sasuke when oro is at full health.... sasuke>oro when oro's is sick plain and simple that what the manga shows and says... nothing to argue..

edit:rofll at sasuke developing his sharingan to itachi's level.. guess what neji developed his speed to yondaimes level

Manga fact that Oros jutsu were nothing before the SG meaning ninjutsu and taijutsu arent going to help Oro in such a fight.

And sasukes SG genjutsu was competeing with itachis in their fight. Lol, itachi had to use the MS genjutsu to beat sasukes SG gen so what are you talking about? Sasuke showed he was fully capable of competeing with itachi when it comes to standard SG genjutsu.

Myth, go get pwned in the spam zone and quit trolling me like you dont have a life.

TheSixthHokage
05-20-2009, 07:44 PM
I agree with Silverblade, more or less. It seems way too questionable to call, in my eyes, which is partly why I suggested it.

Sasuke has fantastic raiton ninjutsu, in fact, he is practically a grand master in that element, and has above average taijutsu (though his stamina is not that great, in comparison to Lee at least). He also possesses skill in kenjutsu (as well combining it with his raiton ninjutsu) and advanced genjutsu.

Orochimaru has lots of forbidden techniques and near invulnerability, so long as his chakra holds out basically. He has decades more experience and taught Sasuke everything he knows pretty much.

I think the entire battle revolves around whether Orochimaru could defend against Sasuke's genjutsu in his non-incapicated state. I would say yes, but this is a grand assumption, but I'd still consider it a 7-3, Orochimaru victory.

Next battle: Karin and Hinata versus Sakura and Ino! (P.S. Karin deserves more attention, her short shorts are awesome :P).

maddog
05-20-2009, 07:54 PM
Next battle: Karin and Hinata versus Sakura and Ino! (P.S. Karin deserves more attention, her short shorts are awesome :P).

If it's a beauty contest, i'd give the battle to Hinata and Karin. it would have been hands down had you paired Ino and Hinata. but Hinata>Ino in beauty for me... so i'll go for Hinata anyday... :D:D:D

Dagoro
05-20-2009, 09:30 PM
Karin and Hinata versus Sakura and Ino!

Sakura dominates. That dude is strong.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-20-2009, 10:15 PM
Gai vs Kimimarro?

TheSixthHokage
05-20-2009, 10:19 PM
I'll never understand why Karin is never shipped, she's kinky, wears short shorts and has glasses... c'mon people!

Kimimaro'd take it, he fought off Lee and Bijuu-powered Gaara.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-20-2009, 10:32 PM
Agreed^! Although Kimi would win because not even releasing all eight gates would give Gai enough power to break through Kimis super dense bones while in C2, it would still be an awesome taijutsu fight IMO.

How about Gaara vs Animal, HG and human realm? Location: in the desert with no people around to get in the way.

TheSixthHokage
05-20-2009, 11:38 PM
Agreed^! Although Kimi would win because not even releasing all eight gates would give Gai enough power to break through Kimis super dense bones while in C2, it would still be an awesome taijutsu fight IMO.

How about Gaara vs Animal, HG and human realm? Location: in the desert with no people around to get in the way.

First question, is this before or prior to the extraction of the Ichibi?

Second question, HG is who exactly? Forgive me, I've been up since early this morning.

Myth
05-21-2009, 12:27 AM
sasuke vs kyf....

sasuke has only the mks techniques along with his regular moves...

kyf has all the elements neji's kaiten the ability to break from steel water prisons etc etc...

Silverblade
05-21-2009, 01:57 AM
Sasuke will kick him in the balls of course. > KYF

Seriously. ALL the elements, Steel water prisons, etc.. Sasuke could just unleash his emo powers to trample him. But seriously no more Sasuke fights. This guy is annoying as it is. He is worst than power rangers and those planeteers from captain planet. Sasuke make pokemon look like gods and make Yugioh a greater god than pokemon.

Sasuke: EMO POWERS ACTIVATE!!!! Some random Forbidden ranked jutsu shoots out from nowhere and the opponent is defeated. This happened in almost every fight with Sasuke in it.

BUT ON TO Gaara v. Animal Realm, Hungry Ghost and Human Realm.

Gaara with or without bijuu. (HE IS STILL STRONGER WHATSOEVER) Will trash Animal realm and it's summon with the sand of course. Who knows. He might use a jutsu of a wide radius to devour the Realms. Hungry Ghost would suck the chakra from it, but then the sand could just immobilze him if Gaara regains control of it.

Gaara takes the win here.

Wolverine
05-21-2009, 02:35 AM
Ino and Sakura vs Hinata and Karin (beauty contest)... Hinata is fighting a handicap match if Karin appears in a swimsuit!!!


In terms of fighting skills, Hinata is the most skilled, but Karin hasn't shown anything worthy of being a challenge to Sakura, so she might take out Ino. In the end, it comes out to Sakura vs Hinata. Sakura may have brute strength, but I don't think she can match the Hyuga fighting skills... so I'd say Hinata wins this one...


Gaara vs those 3 Pain realms... Gaara without a doubt. If Naruto was able to beat them so effortlessly, Gaara might not have it so easily, but I don't see anyway those 3 could beat him and his sand defence, especially if you put them in a desert!!! That is a blatant disadvantage to those 3 and I don't think they could beat Gaara in a desert...


Gai vs Kimimaro... I'd have to say Kimi, because not even Gate Mode taijutsu would be strong enough to overcome Kimi's bone covering technique... If he goes CS2, then its just making the inevitable sooner...

poolangya
05-21-2009, 12:29 PM
Hinata+Karin vs Ino+Sakura

real fight, 2 medic nins vs 1 hyuga and 1 sensor.i havent seen the full capability of Karin but just basing on her potential (being a member of team hawk and now akatsuki) she should be one hell of a nin. ino is useless here unless she can catch her enemy off guard and use their body instead. it will boil down to a taijutsu match between the gentle fist of hinata vs the brute strength of sakura, and to fangirl match between karin vs sakura for sasuke. so in short, sakura will have 2 enemies against. she is very well disadvantaged. i give this to hinata+karin 7-3 sakura+ino.

beauty contest: no doubt, hinata+karin wins.

gaara vs. HG+Animal+human realms

HG is hungry ghost right? the one that can eat up chakra? this realm will pose the greatest challenge for gaara. Animal realm can keep gaara busy with her summons. human realm is just pawn but gaara can easily avoid him. but HG is a different matter, especially if he is capable of absorbing the chakra that flows through gaara's sand. tough choice, but i think gaara gets away here with the win. gaara 6-4 HGR+HR+AR

Gai vs Kimimaru

gai has 8 gates, technically he will only use until 6 if im not mistaken or else he dies. kimimaru is a taijutsu monster capable of manipulating his bones for offense and defense. it will boil down to the question of, "Does Kimimaru drink lots of milk?" you know, for calcium content. if he does, then his bones will not easily shatter, and gai, as powerful his punches and kicks are, will eventually succumb to kimimaru's pelvic bone.
Kimimaru 7-3 Gai. Kimimaru wins

Sasuke vs KYF

first of all, is this a legit battle? where is the battle location? so no CS2 for sasuke since he has MKS. i will give this battle to sasuke because i believe KYF doesn't stand a chance to sasuke's sharingan genjutsu. sasuke will win but not very easily because KYF sometimes can believe in something so impossible,even all manga facts are against it. so sasuke will be in trouble once KYF decides that chouji is far more superior to sasuke because sharingan will not have any effect on chouji because he almost always fights with his eyes closed. Sasuke 8-2 KYF. sasuke wins.

Wolverine
05-21-2009, 12:47 PM
Sasuke vs KYF...

KYF forfeits the match because he's too busy admiring Sasuke to fight him...

superninja
05-21-2009, 05:39 PM
Gai vs Kimimaru

Gai can win this. Kimimaru's cs2 form is very anti Gai coz Kimimaru becomes shielded with some kind of bone armor right? So Gai wouldn't be able to break it since Gara wasn't able with his earth pressure. But cs2 doesn't last forever, if Gai doses his gate releases then Kimimaro might lose. The fight would be a long one, first Gai and Kimimaro would fight in their base forms, if Gai opens three gates he should be able to put Kimimaro at disadvantage. That would lead Kimimaro to activate his cs2. Then Gai would go to six gates and it depends then who can last longer. Gai would lay the smack on Kimimaro but Kimimaro's defense would probably endure. In any case Gai can open all the gates so it becomes a draw.

lamps123
05-21-2009, 05:54 PM
why does eveyone think guy and lee would just go into a fight and BAMM!!!!! open gates.

Myth
05-21-2009, 06:03 PM
why does eveyone think guy and lee would just go into a fight and BAMM!!!!! open gates.

he can't beat kimmi without gates because his bones are like steel. not even garras sand was able to break him...

kimicey
05-21-2009, 06:22 PM
I personally think Gai can still put up a very good fight with kimimaru even without opening gates. When we saw kimimaru fight lee, lee was in a weakend state and couldnt open gates while kimimaru's speed was one of gaara's few weaknesses. Gai also has other abilities other than taijutsu that have yet to have been seen and he most likely has more stamina than kimimaru. Even itachi who is probably far stronger than kimimaru warned kisame not to underestimate gai. Gai would probably still have to open gates but he can do damage without them.

On another note how about Tenzo + Sai vs Gaara

Dagoro
05-21-2009, 06:55 PM
Tenzo + Sai vs Gaara

Gaara stomps. Sai is a non-factor and Yamato is no match.
( I'm not factoring in post ext. Gaara since we have yet to see him. )

poolangya
05-21-2009, 07:32 PM
gaara vs sai+yamato

kazekage vs a root anbu + an inferior copy of the first hokage. gaara wins this.not with ease coz i dont know how wood element will fare against sand.but gaara will win because of his sand. gaara 8-2 yamato+sai

maddog
05-21-2009, 07:39 PM
sasuke vs kyf....

sasuke has only the mks techniques along with his regular moves...

kyf has all the elements neji's kaiten the ability to break from steel water prisons etc etc...


^i'll give this one to KYF. no one wins over him... :D :D :D

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-21-2009, 10:28 PM
sasuke vs kyf....

sasuke has only the mks techniques along with his regular moves...

kyf has all the elements neji's kaiten the ability to break from steel water prisons etc etc...

IDK, I could use the manly YMCA shotocan you taught me and flip him.

Anyways, your being a douche and I dont even care this time because Mibs raped you in the spam zone and you ran away like a pussy, LMAO!

Good times:cool:

And all the rest of you conformist narutards can kiss the fatest part of Myths ass!

EDIT: TSH:

HG is hungry ghost.

Wolverine
05-22-2009, 12:30 AM
Tenzou vs Sai + Gaara

Gaara wins. Sai is just a reconnaissance ninja, I don't see him playing a crucial part in this fight. Yamato's wood element may help him, but I'd have to give his to Gaara because his sand capabilities far surpass Yamato's wood capabilities. It also depends where this fight is fought. Because, in most places, Gaara can manipulate large amounts of sand, created from the minerals and rocks in the ground. So he'd actually be overwhelming the two of them who'd have nothing much to do other than run like Kimimaro did, though he had better defensive capabilities than them...

IgnisV
05-22-2009, 04:09 PM
Anko v. Sakura

TheSixthHokage
05-22-2009, 04:14 PM
Anko and Sakura, good match-up.

I'd give it to Anko, she seems more blood-thirsy and wields a wider range of ninjutsu, while Sakura is a taijutsu/medical ninjutsu spammer. Out of 10, I'd give Anko 7, Sakura 3.

poolangya
05-22-2009, 04:14 PM
Anko vs sakura

err, i forgot what jutsus are in anko's arsenal, and how she even fights if she even did. but based on accomplishments, i give this one to sakura simply because she is already a mini-tsunade (including mini boobies) and i don't think anko comes close. sakura 7-3 anko. but if they are fighting a beauty contest, sakura loses,big time.

Myth
05-22-2009, 05:03 PM
@kyf HWAT LMFAOOO

Kyf>naruto section;)

superninja
05-22-2009, 06:29 PM
Anko vs Sakura

I will give this to Anko only because Anko is a jounin and that means she is more versatile than Sakura. Sakura is great but she lacks a wider array of jutsus.

Now tell me who would win: Old Chiyo vs 30 percent Kisame clone that fought team Gai

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-22-2009, 09:38 PM
Lol, Myth<<<<<spam zone!

Quit crying because mibs and madness show how big a pus you are!

Anko vs Sakura?

Anko does attack at long distance with percision needles so sakura and all of her strength cant get close. That and anko has Oro hax like shadow snake ect even if sakura does get close. So, unless sakura can get close to anko to deliver that massive power shes boned.

@superninja:
And old choiy would be overwhelmed by 30 percent kisame.

Myth
05-23-2009, 12:39 AM
Lol, Myth<<<<<spam zone!

Quit crying because mibs and madness show how big a pus you are!

Anko vs Sakura?

Anko does attack at long distance with percision needles so sakura and all of her strength cant get close. That and anko has Oro hax like shadow snake ect even if sakura does get close. So, unless sakura can get close to anko to deliver that massive power shes boned.

@superninja:
And old choiy would be overwhelmed by 30 percent kisame.

LOLOLOL!!! KY-JELLY trying to hard at making lulz.....

The Madness
05-23-2009, 12:48 AM
You misspelled 'too' and I lol'd.

Myth
05-23-2009, 01:23 AM
You misspelled 'too' and I lol'd.

oh shit ... seems like u got a new fc...
.

If Anko can dodge sakuras attacks she can win because she actually uses ninjutsu... oro taught her his snake techniques as well as other shit...

TheSixthHokage
05-23-2009, 01:53 AM
Kabuto versus Yamato?

maddog
05-23-2009, 04:05 AM
Kabuto versus Yamato?

Yamato. wide array of ninjutsu for defense and offense. has Suiton, Doton, and Mokuton.

Yamato > Kabuto

Kabuto good at deception and Medical ninjutsu. close range fighter, and sleep genjutsu, not too much in his arsenal. basically just good at assisting Oro...

Myth
05-23-2009, 11:12 AM
Yamato will kill kabuto... however i don't know about now that kabuto has a part of orochimaru if he is able to use his ninjutsu along with kabuto's own i think he'd be a force.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-23-2009, 04:05 PM
I dont understand how kabuto is suppost to gain Oros jutsu exept super healing which comes from the white snake.

And Kabuto is capable of competing with kakashi and tsunade so he could possibly win against yamato IMO.

EDIT: quit Boo-hooing MouTH. I swear, you get like this every time you dont get your four pounds of tube steak a day.

TheSixthHokage
05-23-2009, 04:07 PM
Kakashi = Kabuto, Kakashi > Yamato, ergo Kabuto > Yamato.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-23-2009, 04:13 PM
Kakashi = Kabuto, Kakashi > Yamato, ergo Kabuto > Yamato.

Not necessarily because yamato is strong enough to compete with kakashi as well. However, yamato just seems like easy pickens for any kind of genjutsu which is why I think kabuto might win.

TheSixthHokage
05-23-2009, 04:16 PM
Not necessarily because yamato is strong enough to compete with kakashi as well. However, yamato just seems like easy pickens for any kind of genjutsu which is why I think kabuto might win.

Kakashi was an ANBU captain, the former lead student of the Fourth and is the undoubted top Jounin of Konoha. His fame is so legendary that Akatsuki and S-class criminals from the Wave knows who he is. Yamato is indeed powerful, but Kakashi is his superior.

poolangya
05-23-2009, 04:17 PM
yamato vs kabuto
kabuto doesn't stand a chance against yamato, he has great med skills and also capable of taijutsu, but yamato's skill far outclasses kabuto's he is long range and i don't quite get how will kabuto reach yamato when all the trees around him tries to rape him. yamato will be wood raping kabuto. yamato 9-1 kabuto. yamato wins this.

old chiyo vs 30% kisame
old chiyo will get raped by the shark man. her skills are not suited to kisame's fighting style and arsenal. chiyo will drown. 30%kisame 10-0 chiyo.

Myth
05-23-2009, 04:19 PM
I dont understand how kabuto is suppost to gain Oros jutsu exept super healing which comes from the white snake.

And Kabuto is capable of competing with kakashi and tsunade so he could possibly win against yamato IMO.

EDIT: quit Boo-hooing MouTH. I swear, you get like this every time you dont get your four pounds of tube steak a day.

the same way sasuke gained all of oro's trademark techniques that is snakes, replacements, etc etc....

Kabuto has never competed on the level of kakashi not once it was commented that he was just as good in part 1 but not part 2.. as for tsunade, kabuto merely beat up a non responding tsunade who was afraid of blood..

TheSixthHokage
05-23-2009, 04:22 PM
the same way sasuke gained all of oro's trademark techniques that is snakes, replacements, etc etc....

Kabuto has never competed on the level of kakashi not once it was commented that he was just as good in part 1 but not part 2.. as for tsunade, kabuto merely beat up a non responding tsunade who was afraid of blood..

Kakashi without MS > Yamato, his Wood Element is not very impressive. He's strong sure, but Kabuto with Orochimaru's healing, his genius, and so forth... I mean, c'mon, the guy is being kept as a major fight for Sasuke down the road... I'd give it 6-4 Kabuto, Yamato has never impressed me. Sasuke showed how useless Wood Element can be and Kabuto is smart enought to be able to manipulate that.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-23-2009, 04:29 PM
the same way sasuke gained all of oro's trademark techniques that is snakes, replacements, etc etc....

Kabuto has never competed on the level of kakashi not once it was commented that he was just as good in part 1 but not part 2.. as for tsunade, kabuto merely beat up a non responding tsunade who was afraid of blood..

Sasuke gained Oros soul which gave him all of Oros jutsu, not just super healing which comes from the white snake. However, kabuto just got some of Oros cells which should just give him the same physcial appearence and super healing and perhaps summons.

And kabtuo out smarted and out maneuvered kakashi in the hospital. That plus kicking tsunades ass before she finally cornered Kabuto so hes more than capable of beating Yamato IMO. He just needs to close the distance and merely touch yamato on the chest, thus severing his heart valves ect.

Or kabuto could just catch yamato in a Genjutsu to win or close the distance to land a deadly shot to one of yamatos vital points.

Myth
05-23-2009, 04:59 PM
Kakashi without MS > Yamato, his Wood Element is not very impressive. He's strong sure, but Kabuto with Orochimaru's healing, his genius, and so forth... I mean, c'mon, the guy is being kept as a major fight for Sasuke down the road... I'd give it 6-4 Kabuto, Yamato has never impressed me. Sasuke showed how useless Wood Element can be and Kabuto is smart enought to be able to manipulate that.

Last I checked this was regular Kabuto.. don't tell me what i already know and stated... I already said if Kabuto is able to use oro's techniques like sasuke was able to along with his own then i doubt yamato could beat him.. If this is regular kabuto then yamato would shit on him all day...

@Kyf - stop using genjutsu in all ur posts kabuto has shown 1 genjutsu that sakura broke out of just stoppp.... as for him outmaneuvering kakashi cool .... whats ur point i already said its been stated kabuto=kakashi in part 1(although that doesn't mean he'd be able to draw with him)

and sasuke didn't have all of oro's techniques he had his trademark moves which are snakes and his replacement technique along with his white snake healing. and if oro's "cell" were able to take over 30% of the body then im sure he can have access just as much as sasuke did...

poolangya
05-23-2009, 05:08 PM
i thought the battle was with yamato vs kabuto? not kabuchimaru

even if it is against kabuchimaru, we dont know up to what extent their fusion will become, it might end in a disaster for all we know. and kabuchimaru hasn't shown any skill yet that is orochimaru-esque. can't conclude yet, so back to kabuto. he is good at close range, taking on kakashi and tsunade almost evenly. yamato hasn't shown any good taijutsu. but his wood jutsu's are meant for long range and that's what he will do. i doubt kabuto has a fair chance of closing the gap between him and yamato, thus i give this fight to yamato.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-23-2009, 05:08 PM
Last I checked this was regular Kabuto.. don't tell me what i already know and stated... I already said if Kabuto is able to use oro's techniques like sasuke was able to along with his own then i doubt yamato could beat him.. If this is regular kabuto then yamato would shit on him all day...

@Kyf - stop using genjutsu in all ur posts kabuto has shown 1 genjutsu that sakura broke out of just stoppp.... as for him outmaneuvering kakashi cool .... whats ur point i already said its been stated kabuto=kakashi in part 1(although that doesn't mean he'd be able to draw with him)

and sasuke didn't have all of oro's techniques he had his trademark moves which are snakes and his replacement technique along with his white snake healing. and if oro's "cell" were able to take over 30% of the body then im sure he can have access just as much as sasuke did...

Yeah and sakura is a genjutsu type "high intelligence", but yamato isnt by what hes shown so far. Not to mention kabuto used that genjutsu on an entire stadium, not just one person so do the math.

All kakashi gain is his MS which he never uses unless a fat kid is being chased by a fat seeking missle, lol.

Also, Sasuke gained Oro essence "soul", but kabuto only gained cells of Oro. And since reaplacements/summonings are ninjutsu kabuto shouldnt be able to do them. Well, probably summons because hes should gain Oros blood which would allow him to summon snakes, but thats all. just super healing and snake summons which comes out to be woppidy doo!:cool: Its not like kabuto will gain CS with Oros white snake abilites.

superninja
05-23-2009, 05:37 PM
Kabuto vs Yamato

Yamato will use his wood jutsus, he probably has more wood attacks than we saw so far. He can create a wood clone, make a wooden house or a prison in a second, sprout unshaped wood to attack long distance. Now, when Yamato goes all out he is bound to make some other shape manipulation with wood that he is keeping a secret. He can also do water attacks.
Kabuto (before Kabuchimaru) has regeneration, he can heal himself from heavy injuries. Kabuto can control dead bodies like he did the first time he confronted Kakashi. He has the chakra scalpel taijutsu style. He can travel underground.
If they are both serious the fight would be good, Kabuto wins by sending a couple of corpses with explosive tags on them as distractions while closing the distance on Yamato by traveling underground plus he cuts through wood with chakra scalpels.

Myth
05-23-2009, 06:18 PM
Yeah and sakura is a genjutsu type "high intelligence", but yamato isnt by what hes shown so far. Not to mention kabuto used that genjutsu on an entire stadium, not just one person so do the math.

All kakashi gain is his MS which he never uses unless a fat kid is being chased by a fat seeking missle, lol.

Also, Sasuke gained Oro essence "soul", but kabuto only gained cells of Oro. And since reaplacements/summonings are ninjutsu kabuto shouldnt be able to do them. Well, probably summons because hes should gain Oros blood which would allow him to summon snakes, but thats all. just super healing and snake summons which comes out to be woppidy doo!:cool: Its not like kabuto will gain CS with Oros white snake abilites.


edited: i sent u a pm

kabuto<yamato

TheSixthHokage
05-23-2009, 06:30 PM
U dnt need to be a genjutsu type to break genjutsu fuckign gai broke out of it as well is he a genjutsu type.. sometimes u say shit before thinking no offense just saying... before saying something think back make sure u dnt miss any details... it doesn't matter on whom he did it in fact the wider the area the stronger the technique needs to be... same with ST he used his biggest to take down the village and it was 10 fold stronger then just his regular... but genjutsu doesn't work the way u think it does read the DB...

Kakshi>kabuto part 2

Oro never had cs lol... point in fact is... if his cells can take over a body then his jutsu should be available as well.. its only logical...

Gai's ability to dispel a sleep genjutsu means NOTHING. Sasuke uses advanced genjutsu that tricked Deidera and I am sure he was schooled in this by Kabuto and Orochimaru... Yamato is an above-average ANBU. That's it.

We do NOT know if Kakashi is greater than Kabuto in Part II, I actually sort of doubt it. Kabuto is meant to be a challenge for Sasuke down the road, therefore he's got to be kage-level at least. So while I don't disagree, I don't agree either. We need more evidence.

Myth
05-23-2009, 07:12 PM
Gai's ability to dispel a sleep genjutsu means NOTHING. Sasuke uses advanced genjutsu that tricked Deidera and I am sure he was schooled in this by Kabuto and Orochimaru... Yamato is an above-average ANBU. That's it.

We do NOT know if Kakashi is greater than Kabuto in Part II, I actually sort of doubt it. Kabuto is meant to be a challenge for Sasuke down the road, therefore he's got to be kage-level at least. So while I don't disagree, I don't agree either. We need more evidence.


You quoted the wrong post after i edited it and deleted it good job... but since we are on the subject..

Sasuke's sharingan is the source of his genjutsu nobody taught him that its a bloodline trait u gain genjutsu when u have a 3 tome sharingan and u practice urself and unlock it as ur eyes progress..(yes kakashi can do sharingan genjutsu as well and no kabuto and oro didn't teach him that lmaoo).

Above Average... yeah i guess this never happened http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-284/page014.html "one of the more skilled.. of the hokage's personal anbu"...

http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-285/page015.html "highest performance of sarutobi's whole anbu"...

edit: i was arguing that if gai and sakura can break a shitty genjutsu then yamato can as well... besides the genjutsu kabuto uses is called "Temple of Nirvana" and its specialty is to effect wide areas.. nd as the data book stated nd i sent the quote to kyf "any experienced shinobi can easily break it".. im just saying genjutsu won't effect yamato who is the highest skilled anbu in the hokages personal squad... its a reference cause kyf thinks it would ply a part...

TheSixthHokage
05-23-2009, 08:59 PM
You quoted the wrong post after i edited it and deleted it good job... but since we are on the subject..

Sasuke's sharingan is the source of his genjutsu nobody taught him that its a bloodline trait u gain genjutsu when u have a 3 tome sharingan and u practice urself and unlock it as ur eyes progress..(yes kakashi can do sharingan genjutsu as well and no kabuto and oro didn't teach him that lmaoo).

Above Average... yeah i guess this never happened http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-284/page014.html "one of the more skilled.. of the hokage's personal anbu"...

http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-285/page015.html "highest performance of sarutobi's whole anbu"...

edit: i was arguing that if gai and sakura can break a shitty genjutsu then yamato can as well... besides the genjutsu kabuto uses is called "Temple of Nirvana" and its specialty is to effect wide areas.. nd as the data book stated nd i sent the quote to kyf "any experienced shinobi can easily break it".. im just saying genjutsu won't effect yamato who is the highest skilled anbu in the hokages personal squad... its a reference cause kyf thinks it would ply a part...

Where's the evidence that you gain genjutsu when you acquire a fully-developed Sharingan? I have never read that or seen that in the anime.

Thanks, you are right, I overlooked that he's the best of ANBU, but regardless, what does that tell you? Do you not think that Kabuto, who was in part I equal to Kakashi, would have been an ANBU captain? He's exactly like Kakashi, a genius of great technical skill. Yamato, while great, is the best of the average.

Kakashi, Kabuto, and particularly Naruto and Sasuke are in the area of the human beings who are not so much shinobi, as monsters.

(That genjutsu that even Sakura took out is easily defeated by anyone who sees it coming, meaning it needs 100% surprise to work, even on Genin; it just affects a huge area -- this does NOT mean Kabuto does not have other genjutsu techniques or more importantly kinjutsu).

Myth
05-23-2009, 10:35 PM
Where's the evidence that you gain genjutsu when you acquire a fully-developed Sharingan? I have never read that or seen that in the anime.Kakashi is able to use it and he had no teacher to teach him shit... idk how it works but trust me oro and kabuto or anyone have nothing to do with sasuke's genjutsu skill as a bloodline these things awake in u in time.. they cannot be taught they are exclusive to you..


Kakashi, Kabuto, and particularly Naruto and Sasuke are in the area of the human beings who are not so much shinobi, as monsters.kabuto has never done anything wow he has never shown any 1 hit kill techniques nor has he shown anything better then basic fighting ability.. im sorry but he just hasn't measured up to what oro said he was... don't forget he was sasori's bitch in akatsuki the same group of members who admire kakashi's skill and see him as a threat including pain.. trust me they aren't afraid of kabuto lol..

(That genjutsu that even Sakura took out is easily defeated by anyone who sees it coming, meaning it needs 100% surprise to work, even on Genin; it just affects a huge area -- this does NOT mean Kabuto does not have other genjutsu techniques or more importantly kinjutsu).I know which is why i said it will never wok on yamato.. as for him having other genjutsu ability sorry no assumptions allowed as for having any kinjutsu just as the first i'll believe it when i see it.. u can only go off by canon stuff u already know that dude.


edit: btw i notice how all of u are saying he was as strong as kakashi well thats incorrect ur all following the anime's words when the manga actually says this

http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-088/page012.html

"about the same level" meaning almost as good as kakashi but no quite as good... so yeah glad i put that to rest.

Dagoro
05-23-2009, 11:13 PM
What is with the Genjutsu crap ??

Unless you happen to be Itachi you ain't shit in Genjutsu, since he is the only nin who has shown true mastery in the area.

Kabuto has no feats that compare to what Yamato has done.

Myth
05-23-2009, 11:59 PM
What is with the Genjutsu crap ??

Unless you happen to be Itachi you ain't shit in Genjutsu, since he is the only nin who has shown true mastery in the area.

Kabuto has no feats that compare to what Yamato has done.

exactly my point everything we have seen from kabuto wouldn't be enough to beat yamato he has no elements and no way of attacking a long rage fighter.. even if u go by stats kabuto is pathetic he is lower then sasuke he's just about 3 level higher then naruto lol... yamato is near kakashi on paper...

poolangya
05-24-2009, 03:36 AM
kabuto: i will attack you with genjutsu!
yamato: mokuton:forest needle shield.(ok i invented this)
As the genjutsu affects yamato, he was pierced by cactuses that emerged from his jutsu thus dispelling the jutsu due to outside interference.
kabuto: i will attack you close range with my chakra scalpel!
yamato: mokuton:forest of life. ( another invention )
Great trees block kabuto's path and tries to ensnare him with its roots and branches, while yamato is moving farther back thus making it harder for kabuto to catch up.
in the end, kabuto will not be able to avoid the trees of yamato because chakra scalpel has no way of cutting down trees. kabuto loses all hope of reaching yamato and fight him with his taijutsu because kabuto is not very well effective against long range fighters. his fight with kakashi and tsunade and naruto were all melee, and thus is not sufficient to say that he can beat yamato who is at best from far away. but if we start the fight at point blank range, i give my two cents to kabuto winning.but unless that's the case, yamato > kabuto.

lamps123
05-24-2009, 04:08 AM
i cant belive people are talking about kabutos genjustu that yamato cant break out of it,gai could break and you cant tell me he is a genjustu type,
but anyway about yamato and kabuto
yamato can use doton,suiton and mokotun
kabuto:ero ninjustu,intelligence,lots of dead bodies (what the manga has shown so far)
yamato would soo rape him and by the way yamato hasnt been in a fight expcept sasuke one which he said ok let me get serious to show he wasnt serious then.
so we havnt seen much of his moves so we dont know.
kabuto has he fought with tsunade well she was shaky then because of fear of blood,
and fought with naruto,who rasenganed his asss.well due to cheer guts.
anyway i dont see kabuto winning against yamato.
tilll manga says moreeeeeee.
arigato..

Dagoro
05-24-2009, 12:42 PM
Tsunade vs Neji

Restrictions: No katsuyo for Tsunade, genesis rebith is fine. Neji can do anything he has shown till now.

State of mind: Bloodlusted.
Location: Forest of death

Starting distance: 20 meters.

TheSixthHokage
05-24-2009, 12:48 PM
Tsunade versus Neji

Tsunade = Greater Power, Chakra, Experience and has healing ability;

Neji = Byakugan, Jyuuken (can hit tenketsu points) and has Hyuuga Clan Techniques (mostly used against range);

I give it 7 - 3 Tsunade, sure Neji can hit her with his Jyuuken but if she just clips him, he's dead. Neji is nowhere near her level of experience or chakra, so I would assume getting ONE hit would be plausible.

lamps123
05-24-2009, 04:17 PM
Tsunade vs Neji

Restrictions: No katsuyo for Tsunade, genesis rebith is fine. Neji can do anything he has shown till now.

State of mind: Bloodlusted.
Location: Forest of death

Starting distance: 20 meters.
of course tsunade.
she is a kage level shinobi.

Myth
05-24-2009, 04:42 PM
of course tsunade.
she is a kage level shinobi.

what's your point garra was a kage and got beat by deidara.... she isn't an actual kage level a true kage level shinobi is jiraiya from the sannin and the 4 hokages and u can throw itachi healthy in as well...

Who would win tsunade she's smarter and more experienced and knows all about the hyugga since she was around before neji was even made...

lamps123
05-24-2009, 04:54 PM
what's your point garra was a kage and got beat by deidara.... she isn't an actual kage level a true kage level shinobi is jiraiya from the sannin and the 4 hokages and u can throw itachi healthy in as well...

Who would win tsunade she's smarter and more experienced and knows all about the hyugga since she was around before neji was even made...
dei is a kage level shinobi too

Myth
05-24-2009, 05:50 PM
dei is a kage level shinobi too

no he isn't he is listed as high jounin as are all the other akatsuki... his skill ain't even enough to be a real kage level shinobi.. real kage level is sarutobi prime minato jiraiya shodaime madara pain and u can give itachi the slip...

everyone else is filler good but filler. naruto can be considered some what kage level now sasuke was too before he was stripped of oro's hax.

superninja
05-24-2009, 06:07 PM
I thought all of akatsukis are kage lvl except for Hidan coz Hidan doesn't have a lot of jutsus. Let's see, Orochimaru was kage level (he competed for hokage position) and he couldn't get Itachi's body because Itachi was too strong for him. So Itachi is kage lvl. Madara definitely kage lvl coz he was stronger than Itachi. Pein kage lvl coz he considered Madara to be his equal plus he defeated Jiraiya who was kage lvl coz he was equal to Orochimaru. Sasori defeated the third kazekage so Sasori is kage lvl. Deidara captured Gaara, I think that makes him kage lvl since Gara is kazekage. Kakuzu I am not sure about him. Kisame, he will definitely be revealed as a kage lvl, he already showed he has more chakra than any hokage so far.

Myth
05-24-2009, 06:24 PM
I thought all of akatsukis are kage lvl except for Hidan coz Hidan doesn't have a lot of jutsus. Let's see, Orochimaru was kage level (he competed for hokage position) and he couldn't get Itachi's body because Itachi was too strong for him. So Itachi is kage lvl. Madara definitely kage lvl coz he was stronger than Itachi. Pein kage lvl coz he considered Madara to be his equal plus he defeated Jiraiya who was kage lvl coz he was equal to Orochimaru. Sasori defeated the third kazekage so Sasori is kage lvl. Deidara captured Gaara, I think that makes him kage lvl since Gara is kazekage. Kakuzu I am not sure about him. Kisame, he will definitely be revealed as a kage lvl, he already showed he has more chakra than any hokage so far.

There is no revealing do u even know what u just said... read the manga before posting.. first off out of all the 5 kages the Hokage were always the strongest meaning the first 4 >all the other 4... this was stated in the manga...

Sarutobi alone >any kage since he was considered to be the god of ninja in his prime...

Jiraiya is kage level because well let's face it after seeing him in the pain fight its all clear..

orochimaru was NOT kage level he was considered for the position way back when.. he could barely beat sarutobi in his old age even with 2 others...

Pain is Kage level he would def be a match for any of the 4 hoakge

Madara is kAGE LEVEL nINJA he was around the same level as shodaime

and itachi could be considered kage level cause from what we have seen if he was healthy.....

thats all there are no other true kage level shinobi...

superninja
05-24-2009, 06:34 PM
There is no revealing do u even know what u just said... read the manga before posting.. first off out of all the 5 kages the Hokage were always the strongest meaning the first 4 >all the other 4... this was stated in the manga...

Sarutobi alone >any kage since he was considered to be the god of ninja in his prime...

Jiraiya is kage level because well let's face it after seeing him in the pain fight its all clear..

orochimaru was NOT kage level he was considered for the position way back when.. he could barely beat sarutobi in his old age even with 2 others...

Pain is Kage level he would def be a match for any of the 4 hoakge

Madara is kAGE LEVEL nINJA he was around the same level as shodaime

and itachi could be considered kage level cause from what we have seen if he was healthy.....

thats all there are no other true kage level shinobi...

Ok, the four hokages in their prime were stronger than most of akatsuki, BUT, we said kage lvl. Hokages were stronger than the other kages, so does that mean that kazekage is not a kage lvl if he is weaker than the hokage? No, it just means hokage is stronger but they are both competing in the same league. I think Minato would pwn Deidara, but that doesn't mean Deidara is not kage lvl. Deidara would defeat the old Sarutobi imo.

Myth
05-24-2009, 06:57 PM
Ok, the four hokages in their prime were stronger than most of akatsuki, BUT, we said kage lvl. Hokages were stronger than the other kages, so does that mean that kazekage is not a kage lvl if he is weaker than the hokage? No, it just means hokage is stronger but they are both competing in the same league. I think Minato would pwn Deidara, but that doesn't mean Deidara is not kage lvl. Deidara would defeat the old Sarutobi imo.

The other kages are kages yes they are the strongest ninja in their village, however compared to the Hokage they aren't much at all...

Any of the 4 hokage would tear a hole in deidara's ass even kakashi would old or not old orochimaru barely beat sarutobi in his old age... Deidara isn't special he is a long range fighter that's all so he would pose a problem for just about anyone who has no long range fighting... they wouldn't be made kage if they weren't good in everything...

I really don't feel like discussing this any more so there it is in a nutshell.

superninja
05-24-2009, 07:33 PM
Now for Tsunade vs Neji, you gave them only 20 meters of starting distance so it's practically already a melee combat as Tsunade is sure to charge at Neji. Neji can see the chakra Tsuande is controlling through her body so he will know the power of her blow. Neji would have to step back so he doesn't get hit with Tsunade's earth shattering punch. Too bad you didn't let Tsunade summon her slug coz then she would win imo. But like this, Neji has a chance. Even though in close combat Tsunade would try to scramble his nerves and Neji would be hurt badly by that. But I think Neji has a chance, he would back down and use his byakugan in the woods to do something. He could set traps through the forest since he can see Tsunade and she can't see him.

Myth
05-24-2009, 07:34 PM
Now for Tsunade vs Neji, you gave them only 20 meters of starting distance so it's practically already a melee combat as Tsunade is sure to charge at Neji. Neji can see the chakra Tsuande is controlling through her body so he will know the power of her blow. Neji would have to step back so he doesn't get hit with Tsunade's earth shattering punch. Too bad you didn't let Tsunade summon her slug coz then she would win imo. But like this, Neji has a chance. Even though in close combat Tsunade would try to scramble his nerves and Neji would be hurt badly by that. But I think Neji has a chance, he would back down and use his byakugan in the woods to do something. He could set traps through the forest since he can see Tsunade and she can't see him.

these fights are all boring lol every 1 has been done already...

superninja
05-24-2009, 07:48 PM
these fights are all boring lol every 1 has been done already...

That is true, this thread has 324 pages. If Kishimoto will let some new characters fight or give the old characters new moves then we could discuss something new.

Dagoro
05-25-2009, 12:19 AM
Lol I thought Tsunade vs Neji would spark a bigger debate since its taijutsu heavy. I nerfed her on purpose to make it so, otherwise Katsuyo would tip the scale for her too much.

TheSixthHokage
05-25-2009, 12:50 AM
Anyone far above Jounin is kage-level, that includes other Kages and Tsunade... seriously Myth, you think Orochimaru isn't kage-level? What are you on??

Myth
05-25-2009, 01:57 AM
Anyone far above Jounin is kage-level, that includes other Kages and Tsunade... seriously Myth, you think Orochimaru isn't kage-level? What are you on??

not the actual kage level neither is tsunade.. im not on anything im on going off by what i have seen.. he could barely beat a 70 year old sarutobi who was way past his prime even with 2 other bootlegged zombie kage.. 3 on 1 and he still nearly lost...

its more of what r u on for thinking he was an actual kage level ninja..

lamps123
05-25-2009, 08:02 AM
not the actual kage level neither is tsunade.. im not on anything im on going off by what i have seen.. he could barely beat a 70 year old sarutobi who was way past his prime even with 2 other bootlegged zombie kage.. 3 on 1 and he still nearly lost...

its more of what r u on for thinking he was an actual kage level ninja..
myth so you think tsunade isnt a kage level shinobi and she is hokage,
secondly how is orochimaru not a kage level,you are fogetting edotensei is his technique not as if there were his comrades/surbodinnates

Shrike
05-25-2009, 09:58 AM
Orochimaru was playing with Sandaime. What the hell are you talking about. He just didn't expect him to pull something like Death God, is all.
You honestly think that Orochimaru + Shodaime + Nidaime couldn't squash old Sandaime? Give me a break.

maddog
05-25-2009, 11:22 AM
^Shodai and Nidaime will be enough...

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-25-2009, 03:48 PM
Neji vs tsunade "no katsuya"?

One question. Could the rebirth jutsu heal her chakra system or just superficial wounds?

Myth
05-25-2009, 04:03 PM
Neji vs tsunade "no katsuya"?

One question. Could the rebirth jutsu heal her chakra system or just superficial wounds?

just heals wounds it actually kills her chakra to an extent... it's bascially similar to kyuubi's regeneration but not as powerful..

@Shirke do i think that perhaps not i go off by what i see u can say he was playing although the manga suggests differently... U can get thx from every member on the forum. the fact that he was going 3 on 1 nd still barely took it is a done deal... so he used death god boo hoo oro used edo tensei they both used there star techniques and oro still barely did it...

If sarutobi was in his prime he would shit on oro and those 2 zombies... or at best take all 3 down with him.. oro by his own words says that.

@idk who just cause ur made kage doesn't mean ur actually on that level.

Wolverine
05-25-2009, 04:11 PM
Neji vs Tsunade...

I want to know if anyone of you guys think whether Tsunade would be able to counter Neji's Kaiten before I even bother to go on explaining as to who is favourable to win this fight. Tsunade uses hand to hand combat and Kaiten is the worst possible counter to her techniques. That on top of Neji's Juuken....

Tsunade may be Hokage, but Neji's fighting style is the worst match for her kind of person. I think Neji wins.

Just because Tsunade is the current Hokage, doesn't mean that she qualifies for an auto-win. The next gen will surpass the previous gen and this could be a clear case of it...

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-25-2009, 04:16 PM
OK, so if neji hit a chakra point then tsunades rebirth wouldnt help and be useless because she could no longer use chakra?

About sarutobi vs Oro.

Oro was definitly playing with saru. I mean Oro just sat back and watched as saru struggled against the bootleg first and second hokage. Lol, if Oro was serious then he wouldve fought with his summons and wiped saru out in a matter of seconds.

TheSixthHokage
05-25-2009, 04:37 PM
just heals wounds it actually kills her chakra to an extent... it's bascially similar to kyuubi's regeneration but not as powerful..

@Shirke do i think that perhaps not i go off by what i see u can say he was playing although the manga suggests differently... U can get thx from every member on the forum. the fact that he was going 3 on 1 nd still barely took it is a done deal... so he used death god boo hoo oro used edo tensei they both used there star techniques and oro still barely did it...

If sarutobi was in his prime he would shit on oro and those 2 zombies... or at best take all 3 down with him.. oro by his own words says that.

@idk who just cause ur made kage doesn't mean ur actually on that level.

My observations conclude that the Sennin, the Hokages and all members shown thus far of Akatsuki are kage-level. Furthermore, anyone at or beyond the levels of the above are kage-level (e.g. Naruto, Kakashi and Sasuke).

It makes NO sense for Orochimaru not to be kage-level, he was the leader of the Sound and was the favoured candidate for Hokage before Minato was chosen.

TheSixthHokage
05-25-2009, 04:44 PM
OK, so if neji hit a chakra point then tsunades rebirth wouldnt help and be useless because she could no longer use chakra?

About sarutobi vs Oro.

Oro was definitly playing with saru. I mean Oro just sat back and watched as saru struggled against the bootleg first and second hokage. Lol, if Oro was serious then he wouldve fought with his summons and wiped saru out in a matter of seconds.

Neji couldn't defeat Tsunade, I don't even see how people can entertain this thought. He's nowhere near her.

Orochimaru was clearly playing with Sarutobi, I agree 100%. Edo Tensei was a means of demeaning his former sensei, it wasn't about simply winning, it was about winning with "style." If Orochimaru was serious, we would have seen more offensive techniques by him... the Death God jutsu only caught Orochimaru because it was such a technique from nowhere and one with such astounding power .. and such an astounding cost.

Sarutobi could have defeated Orochimaru if they were both in their primes even, but Sarutobi was WAY past his, while Orochimaru was just getting past his own... (I assume Sarutobi could kill Orochimaru if they were both in their primes because Kishimoto once stated that the Third and Fourth Hokages were basically equal in strength as the strongest shinobi of those already deceased -- he then hinted than there were "a few" stronger than these two, who are of course alive).

Wolverine
05-25-2009, 04:49 PM
Neji couldn't defeat Tsunade, I don't even see how people can entertain this thought. He's nowhere near her.

Orochimaru was clearly playing with Sarutobi, I agree 100%. Edo Tensei was a means of demeaning his former sensei, it wasn't about simply winning, it was about winning with "style." If Orochimaru was serious, we would have seen more offensive techniques by him... the Death God jutsu only caught Orochimaru because it was such a technique from nowhere and one with such astounding power .. and such an astounding cost.

Sarutobi could have defeated Orochimaru if they were both in their primes even, but Sarutobi was WAY past his, while Orochimaru was just getting past his own... (I assume Sarutobi could kill Orochimaru if they were both in their primes because Kishimoto once stated that the Third and Fourth Hokages were basically equal in strength as the strongest shinobi of those already deceased -- he then hinted than there were "a few" stronger than these two, who are of course alive).

I don't understand why people overhype Tsunade so much just because she is the Hokage ?? She is a medical nin and not a fighting specialist. Neji is the strongest Hyuga alive and frankly, I don't think Tsunade would be a match for him and not the other way round.

Tsunade has nothing but brute strength to brag about. Nothing. She may have good speed - which is an important requisite for a medical nin - but I've yet to see something incredible yet. She surpasses Neji in experience, but thats it.

You probably didn't pay attention to what I said, otherwise you'd try to make me understand how Tsunade could defeat Neji in a hand-to-hand Taijutsu combat when his Juuken is the worst possible match to her style ? Just please brief me on that one...

TheSixthHokage
05-25-2009, 04:54 PM
I don't understand why people overhype Tsunade so much just because she is the Hokage ?? She is a medical nin and not a fighting specialist. Neji is the strongest Hyuga alive and frankly, I don't think Tsunade would be a match for him and not the other way round.

Tsunade has nothing but brute strength to brag about. Nothing. She may have good speed - which is an important requisite for a medical nin - but I've yet to see something incredible yet. She surpasses Neji in experience, but thats it.

You probably didn't pay attention to what I said, otherwise you'd try to make me understand how Tsunade could defeat Neji in a hand-to-hand Taijutsu combat when his Juuken is the worst possible match to her style ? Just please brief me on that one...

Tsunade is a 50 year old student of the Third, who has been in several wars. Do you really think the Gentle Fist of the Hyuuga Clan would disable her so easily? Sure, Neji could hit some of her tenketsu, but with one stray punch or even a near hit, Neji would be seriously injured.

The Gentle Fist is the most overhyped taijutsu style ever... seriously; standard taijutsu can defeat it...

Furthermore, as Hokage and an experienced Konoha shinobi, surely she knows EVERYTHING about the style or as much as any non-Hyuuga could ever know. Tsunade is a support type sure, but Neji's style didn't even take out a Rasengan-less Naruto...

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-25-2009, 04:55 PM
Neji couldn't defeat Tsunade, I don't even see how people can entertain this thought. He's nowhere near her.

Orochimaru was clearly playing with Sarutobi, I agree 100%. Edo Tensei was a means of demeaning his former sensei, it wasn't about simply winning, it was about winning with "style." If Orochimaru was serious, we would have seen more offensive techniques by him... the Death God jutsu only caught Orochimaru because it was such a technique from nowhere and one with such astounding power .. and such an astounding cost.

Sarutobi could have defeated Orochimaru if they were both in their primes even, but Sarutobi was WAY past his, while Orochimaru was just getting past his own... (I assume Sarutobi could kill Orochimaru if they were both in their primes because Kishimoto once stated that the Third and Fourth Hokages were basically equal in strength as the strongest shinobi of those already deceased -- he then hinted than there were "a few" stronger than these two, who are of course alive).


If tsunades Rebirth could heal her chakra system I would agree. However, because it cant and juuken is the perfect counter for brute force taijutsu plus nejis speed while in close quarters I just dont see tsunade winning without katsuya or an advantageous terrain.

Tsunade uses brute force taijutsu with OK speed.

Neji uses soft taijutsu with great speed.

So, Tsunades taijustu is ineffective because she cant use her great strength because nejis soft style can just disipate it by redirecting her attacks. And neji can also shut her chakra system off with blinding speed.

poolangya
05-25-2009, 05:00 PM
Tsunade vs Neji
battle wits, i give it to tsunade, she can use her environment against Neji ( e.g striking the ground to make the earth crumble beneath neji's feet.) yes, taijutsu heavy, it will be over in a matter of seconds if Tsunade can land a blow on Neji, but neji is expert with gentle fist which theoretically can revert or nullify an enemies powerful taijutsu attack ( redirection) they both have tricks up their sleeve when in melee range, Neji can sever chakra flow through vital points, Tsunade can distort nerve endings such that the user can have a very hard time controlling his muscle movements. if they are in range,whoever does the trick first wins. but if they can inflict it both at the same time. i will give the fight to tsunade because even if her strength is shown as an effect of superb chakra control,it does not necessarily mean that her punches are weak without chakra aid. i give this to tsunade 7-3 neji. tsunade wins

btw, orochimaru is kage level. his skills are wicked sick. if he was the one on the hokage seat when pain attacked, pain will have a harder time dealing with orochi than tsunade. true orochimaru was beaten by sarutobi, but i think he was just playing around even when he summoned the 2 hokages, i mean, sarutobi should have been toast if he has decided to attack alongside the 1st and 2nd.deidara also is a kage level, he can fly and bomb konoha and leave unscathed.his jutsus put him kage level among others.

TheSixthHokage
05-25-2009, 05:01 PM
If tsunades Rebirth could heal her chakra system I would agree. However, because it cant and juuken is the perfect counter for brute force taijutsu plus nejis speed while in close quarters I just dont see tsunade winning without katsuya or an advantageous terrain.

Tsunade uses brute force taijutsu with OK speed.

Neji uses soft taijutsu with great speed.

So, Tsunades taijustu is ineffective because she cant use her great strength because nejis soft style can just disipate it by redirecting her attacks. And neji can also shut her chakra system off with blinding speed.

By releasing her seal, she would heal herself, tenketsu would in theory be repaired. Anyways, while it would take several strikes for Neji to seal out her chakra completely, all it would take is one stray hit for Neji to be decimated. I'd agree that Neji has a gigantic advantage but I am not sure someone of her experience and skill would be caught off guard by it... surely she has studied Hyuuga techniques and knows the weakness her taijutsu has. We're all judging her style based on Sakura's performance with it... against Orochimaru, she got in quite a few quick blows...

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-25-2009, 05:02 PM
Tsunade is a 50 year old student of the Third, who has been in several wars. Do you really think the Gentle Fist of the Hyuuga Clan would disable her so easily? Sure, Neji could hit some of her tenketsu, but with one stray punch or even a near hit, Neji would be seriously injured.

The Gentle Fist is the most overhyped taijutsu style ever... seriously; standard taijutsu can defeat it...

Furthermore, as Hokage and an experienced Konoha shinobi, surely she knows EVERYTHING about the style or as much as any non-Hyuuga could ever know. Tsunade is a support type sure, but Neji's style didn't even take out a Rasengan-less Naruto...

LMAO! Brute force taijustu is ineffective against soft style taijustu because the brute force is redirected and nullified.

And naruto kyuubi juiced couldnt even take out neji because his attack was redirected Which is why naruto had to set a trap and ambush neji to finally beat him. Hard style<soft style taijutsu.

TheSixthHokage
05-25-2009, 05:05 PM
LMAO! Brute force taijustu is ineffective against soft style taijustu because the brute force is redirected and nullified.

And naruto kyuubi juiced couldnt even take out neji because his attack was redirected Which is why naruto had to set a trap and ambush neji to finally beat him. Hard style<soft style taijutsu.

You do realize she could tamper with his nerves using her medical taijutsu and then launch one strong punch to his chest, crushing it, right?? Sure, Gentle Fist beats the standard Taijutsu style in a match of equal or comparable experience and skill. Tsunade is a Kage, is a resident of Konoha and has been in war -- she knows the Hyuuga technique and has had tons of combat experience. She's a 50 year old combat veteran, Neji's a 16 year old Jounin. Seriously... how would he win??

He's been useless since the battle with Kidomaru... at least Tsunade has epic support capabilities. Neji doesn't have that and his combat abilities are very limited.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-25-2009, 05:10 PM
By releasing her seal, she would heal herself, tenketsu would in theory be repaired. Anyways, while it would take several strikes for Neji to seal out her chakra completely, all it would take is one stray hit for Neji to be decimated. I'd agree that Neji has a gigantic advantage but I am not sure someone of her experience and skill would be caught off guard by it... surely she has studied Hyuuga techniques and knows the weakness her taijutsu has. We're all judging her style based on Sakura's performance with it... against Orochimaru, she got in quite a few quick blows...

In theory? rebirth heals wounds by using a massive amout of stored up chakra to regenerate cells super fast, thus healing. However, neji cuts off chakra usage then no rebirth.

And dont forget theyre fighting in the woods meaning neji can use his BG to track tsunade while he hides. So, neji can use his terrain as well to his advantage by setting traps and ambushing tsunade.

And since tsunade is a close combat fighter with no mid or long range attacks shes boned. Neji has the advantage close quarters so how is tsunade going to win such a fight?

You do realize she could tamper with his nerves using her medical taijutsu and then launch one strong punch to his chest, crushing it, right?? Sure, Gentle Fist beats the standard Taijutsu style in a match of equal or comparable experience and skill. Tsunade is a Kage, is a resident of Konoha and has been in war -- she knows the Hyuuga technique and has had tons of combat experience. She's a 50 year old combat veteran, Neji's a 16 year old Jounin. Seriously... how would he win??

He's been useless since the battle with Kidomaru... at least Tsunade has epic support capabilities. Neji doesn't have that and his combat abilities are very limited.

Tsunade would actually have to touch neji to tamper with anything, but neji much faster than she is so hows that going to happen?

How would he win, lol. Seriously, how would she win? Shes a close combat fighter, but neji will kill in close combat. Tsunades brute power is useless and shes too slow so how could tsunade win this fight without katsuya?

lamps123
05-25-2009, 05:18 PM
I don't understand why people overhype Tsunade so much just because she is the Hokage ?? She is a medical nin and not a fighting specialist. Neji is the strongest Hyuga alive and frankly, I don't think Tsunade would be a match for him and not the other way round.

Tsunade has nothing but brute strength to brag about. Nothing. She may have good speed - which is an important requisite for a medical nin - but I've yet to see something incredible yet. She surpasses Neji in experience, but thats it.

You probably didn't pay attention to what I said, otherwise you'd try to make me understand how Tsunade could defeat Neji in a hand-to-hand Taijutsu combat when his Juuken is the worst possible match to her style ? Just please brief me on that one...
can you listen to youself,tsunade is no match for neji.
i dont understand why you are saying that but i mean look at it,tsunade is one of the legendary sanin and the leafs hokage,and i am sure we havent seen all she can do,never the less with her experience she would know the hyuugas fighting style and their byakugan and come up with the fastest way to cut or dismanipulate a nerve system.
nevertheless she has stored up chakra in her forehead which is just like a new chakra source for regeneration and all so if it can heal her vital organs i dont see a problem in it healing a chakra point,i mean come on dont you think you are over underestimating tsunade.

lamps123
05-25-2009, 05:21 PM
In theory? rebirth heals wounds by using a massive amout of stored up chakra to regenerate cells super fast, thus healing. However, neji cuts off chakra usage then no rebirth.

And dont forget theyre fighting in the woods meaning neji can use his BG to track tsunade while he hides. So, neji can use his terrain as well to his advantage by setting traps and ambushing tsunade.

And since tsunade is a close combat fighter with no mid or long range attacks shes boned. Neji has the advantage close quarters so how is tsunade going to win such a fight?


even if neji is able to track her he has no attack to do anything from long range,he would still have to get close to tsunade,
nevertheless tsunade can punch the forest ground and open up the view by tress falling down.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-25-2009, 05:29 PM
even if neji is able to track her he has no attack to do anything from long range,he would still have to get close to tsunade,
nevertheless tsunade can punch the forest ground and open up the view by tress falling down.

True, neji can only use kunai and his energy palm to attack from a distance, but Im thinking he would use the terrain to sneak up on tsunade since he has no real distance attacks.

lamps123
05-25-2009, 05:31 PM
True, neji can only use kunai and his energy palm to attack from a distance, but Im thinking he would use the terrain to sneak up on tsunade since he has no real distance attacks.
yes thats what i am saying,tsunade with her experience would guess thats whats he is up to and punch the forest ground,you know what happens nxt.lol

poolangya
05-25-2009, 05:34 PM
TIIMMMMBBBBEEERRR!!
the shaken Neji tries to gentle palm all the 100 year old trees that begin to fall on top of him. unable to control his panic, tsunade managed to dash in front of neji and gives neji a big Facepalm attack on neji's forehead.
100 year old trees are all over Neji.Tsunade wins over Neji.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-25-2009, 05:35 PM
yes thats what i am saying,tsunade with her experience would guess thats whats he is up to and punch the forest ground,you know what happens nxt.lol

yeah, neji energy pamls her into a ton of sharp debree she made with trees and branches causing her to be impaled by some of it. Lol, now she has to use rebirth to heal those injuries.

superninja
05-25-2009, 05:52 PM
The fight is heating up in the vs thread, I like the idea of Tsunade crushing the trees in the forest to create a plateau so she can have a clear view of the terrain. I totally forgot how strong she is, she can uproot a tree and use it as a bat to increase her range significantly.
Tsunade (swings a huge timber):"may my ancestors watch over me! death to the enemies!"

lamps123
05-25-2009, 05:57 PM
yeah, neji energy pamls her into a ton of sharp debree she made with trees and branches causing her to be impaled by some of it. Lol, now she has to use rebirth to heal those injuries.
she would hit the ground immediately before neji gets close and even though it happens as you say how long do you think it takes for her to regenerate.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-25-2009, 06:01 PM
Thats true tsunade can use a tree to extend her reach, but nejis not going to sit still and let her tee off on him lol. Neji can sneak attack tsunade, hide and repeat.

Also, if tsunade creates debree by knocking over some forest then neji can use his energy plam to shoot debree at tsunade not only attacking, but blocking her vision and keeping her busy while Neji sneaks around for an attack from behind, ect.

poolangya
05-25-2009, 06:02 PM
assuming Neji can hit tsunade with his chakra disrupting pinpoint attacks the same way Tsunade hits Neji with her Nerve muscle disrupting attack.

Neji is paralyzed but still has chakra intact. What can he do?
Tsunade can't use her chakra, but she still got her arms and feet. what can she do? she can kick Neji unconscious while Neji tries to figure out how to stand up using his arms.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-25-2009, 06:08 PM
assuming Neji can hit tsunade with his chakra disrupting pinpoint attacks the same way Tsunade hits Neji with her Nerve muscle disrupting attack.

Neji is paralyzed but still has chakra intact. What can he do?
Tsunade can't use her chakra, but she still got her arms and feet. what can she do? she can kick Neji unconscious while Neji tries to figure out how to stand up using his arms.

Lol, what? Tsunade touched a specific spot on kabuto to disbale his NS, but nejis freaking fast in close quarters so how in the hell is tsunade going to hit, much attack a certain point on neji?

Lol, tsunade reaches out to touch neji but arm gets knokced away by seven attacks that shut off the chakra in her arm.

And tsunade without her chakra equals no massive power.

lamps123
05-25-2009, 06:17 PM
Thats true tsunade can use a tree to extend her reach, but nejis not going to sit still and let her tee off on him lol. Neji can sneak attack tsunade, hide and repeat.

Also, if tsunade creates debree by knocking over some forest then neji can use his energy plam to shoot debree at tsunade not only attacking, but blocking her vision and keeping her busy while Neji sneaks around for an attack from behind, ect.
how many fights have you seen like that lol its not hide and seek lol,sneak up attack and run back to hide dosent look plaubisible.
talking about hiding saying it again,there would be nowhere to hide when tsunade is done punching the ground.lol

poolangya
05-25-2009, 06:19 PM
^ tsunade without chakra = no massive power, yes. but still enough power to put damage. It will have developed into her, strength, although incomparable unless she can use her chakra to its full extent, but still she has strength more than ordinary due to her fighting style.

scenario above is only to compare both their disabling techs. neji has upperhand in speed i agree. but tsunade has advantage over terrain which will give her the victory. let them fight inside a steel cage that tsunade cannot budge and i give the match to Neji anytime.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-25-2009, 06:24 PM
how many fights have you seen like that lol its not hide and seek lol,sneak up attack and run back to hide dosent look plaubisible.
talking about hiding saying it again,there would be nowhere to hide when tsunade is done punching the ground.lol

Lol, there freaking ninjas so theyre going to use advantage and disdavantage. Dont drum up a scenario where nejis stupid and not going to use his surroundings to his advantage.

And if tsunade punches the ground theres still an ass load of forest left, lol. Unless tsunade knocks down every tree, pulls up every bush, ect, then neji can use it to his advantage.

Also, if tsunade puches the ground then some of the ground is going to protrude leaving little spot for neji to hide as well.

^ tsunade without chakra = no massive power, yes. but still enough power to put damage. It will have developed into her, strength, although incomparable unless she can use her chakra to its full extent, but still she has strength more than ordinary due to her fighting style.

scenario above is only to compare both their disabling techs. neji has upperhand in speed i agree. but tsunade has advantage over terrain which will give her the victory. let them fight inside a steel cage that tsunade cannot budge and i give the match to Neji anytime.

Tsunade has the terrain advantage, lol? Seriously? Neji has the 360 degrees BG so he can see her no matter where she is. Meanwhile, tsunade cant see neji unless hes directly infront of her.

And neji inside a cage is at a disadvantage because its small and limits his ability to maneuver, lol. Tsunade could corner him, catch him then beat him mercilessly.

lamps123
05-25-2009, 06:51 PM
Lol, there freaking ninjas so theyre going to use advantage and disdavantage. Dont drum up a scenario where nejis stupid and not going to use his surroundings to his advantage.

And if tsunade punches the ground theres still an ass load of forest left, lol. Unless tsunade knocks down every tree, pulls up every bush, ect, then neji can use it to his advantage.

Also, if tsunade puches the ground then some of the ground is going to protrude leaving little spot for neji to hide as well.
.

when she punches the ground it destroys the terrain and uproot the trees automatically so the surrounding trees are gone so neji hiding far away wont do much because he dosent have any long range justu.

poolangya
05-25-2009, 07:12 PM
Tsunade has the terrain advantage, lol? Seriously? Neji has the 360 degrees BG so he can see her no matter where she is. Meanwhile, tsunade cant see neji unless hes directly infront of her.

And neji inside a cage is at a disadvantage because its small and limits his ability to maneuver, lol. Tsunade could corner him, catch him then beat him mercilessly.

with terrain advantage, i mean she can use the terrain as part of her arsenal. the battle location becomes her weapon.she can knock down trees towards neji, punch ground to crack open the earth underneath neji, etc. Neji having 360 degree vision does not hinder him seeing tsunade, even amongs all the debris and chaos to the surroundings tsunade can inflict, it can also help him see his surrounding clearer, but he cannot put the location to his advantage because sooner or later, tsunade can tear the battle location apart.

inside a cage, yes tsunade can corner neji, but at very close range (my example is inside a cage) neji's gentle fist is way more effective.direct attacks from tsunade can be easily predicted as they would be coming only from straight ahead, thus redirection is easier.

Myth
05-25-2009, 07:31 PM
My observations conclude that the Sennin, the Hokages and all members shown thus far of Akatsuki are kage-level. Furthermore, anyone at or beyond the levels of the above are kage-level (e.g. Naruto, Kakashi and Sasuke).

It makes NO sense for Orochimaru not to be kage-level, he was the leader of the Sound and was the favoured candidate for Hokage before Minato was chosen.

Minato wasn't even old enough to be considered hokage at the time of orochiamru being a candidate.. he was still a kid...

Ur observation is wrong my friend.. cause Tsunade has shown nothing close enough to be kage level... neither has any akatsuki other then itachi and pain and itachi barely......

From everything i have seen... Minato,Shodaime,Sandaime,Nidaime = only true kage level...

Pain,Jiraiya,naruto,itachi = 4 of whom showed to be strong kages and able to defend the village from destruction..

Tsunade has not

Oro is up in air.... for me.

Dagoro
05-25-2009, 07:38 PM
Tsunade isn't a power house when it comes to battle, but she is unrivaled in Med ninjutsu. Got to give her props for saving as many people as she did, no one else would have been able to do that, unless they caught Pein before he used ST.

But it was a surprise attack so not holding that against her.

TheSixthHokage
05-25-2009, 08:21 PM
@ Myth:

I disagree, as usual. A kage-level is someone far about Jounin level, i.e. someone who makes the entire 'elite ninja' rank seem lenient in qualifications. Tsunade, while not a combat specialist, possesses revolutionary medical techniques and regenerative abilities. She is the best medical shinobi in the world and is one of the Legendary Sennin. How is she not kage? Orochimaru, whom you cannot even accept as kage, was not only a candidate for Hokage, but was a master of forbidden techniques and invented the cursed seal. He was a genius who could kill ANBU by the dozens... how is that not kage-level??

Myth
05-25-2009, 09:07 PM
@ Myth:

I disagree, as usual. A kage-level is someone far about Jounin level, i.e. someone who makes the entire 'elite ninja' rank seem lenient in qualifications. Tsunade, while not a combat specialist, possesses revolutionary medical techniques and regenerative abilities. She is the best medical shinobi in the world and is one of the Legendary Sennin. How is she not kage? Orochimaru, whom you cannot even accept as kage, was not only a candidate for Hokage, but was a master of forbidden techniques and invented the cursed seal. He was a genius who could kill ANBU by the dozens... how is that not kage-level??

U don't usually disagree with me but ok.....

Orochimaru was a Candidate for 1 reason because Sarutobi liked him best of course down the line we all found out that Sarutobi actually always liked jiraiya best and wanted him as hoakge not orochimaru... But jiraiya was lazy and would never take it so he wanted oro being his student it would be an honor for him...

Orochimaru's only kinjutsu was and stand edo tensei i have not seen him perform anything else titled "forbidden"... oro's dream was to master every jutsu however his body snatching got in the way...

Killed Anbu by the Dozens i forgot where they showed that unless of course its a figment of ur imagination.. invented the cs how cool but he didn't really invent it now did he.. he took the dna off the guy who had it and injected it in himself thus being able to give it out like a sickness... he didn't actually "invent" it like it was his own thing...

As for kage level in konoha u need to be a power house in all areas to attain such a title... u can argue that not all the kages were genjutsu specialists but they were all masters in defense against it just look at sarutobi's old age stats he's practically perfect in all areas cept for stamina and speed(old age effects that) that is what it means to be a hokage...

Also tsunade isn't actually a hoakge she is a rebound girl because jiraiya said no to the job TWICE... anything else u need cleared up..

FYI i said oro was up in the air for me meaning he has kage level traits but im skeptical about it...

TheSixthHokage
05-25-2009, 09:20 PM
U don't usually disagree with me but ok.....

Orochimaru was a Candidate for 1 reason because Sarutobi liked him best of course down the line we all found out that Sarutobi actually always liked jiraiya best and wanted him as hoakge not orochimaru... But jiraiya was lazy and would never take it so he wanted oro being his student it would be an honor for him...

Orochimaru's only kinjutsu was and stand edo tensei i have not seen him perform anything else titled "forbidden"... oro's dream was to master every jutsu however his body snatching got in the way...

Killed Anbu by the Dozens i forgot where they showed that unless of course its a figment of ur imagination.. invented the cs how cool but he didn't really invent it now did he.. he took the dna off the guy who had it and injected it in himself thus being able to give it out like a sickness... he didn't actually "invent" it like it was his own thing...

As for kage level in konoha u need to be a power house in all areas to attain such a title... u can argue that not all the kages were genjutsu specialists but they were all masters in defense against it just look at sarutobi's old age stats he's practically perfect in all areas cept for stamina and speed(old age effects that) that is what it means to be a hokage...

Also tsunade isn't actually a hoakge she is a rebound girl because jiraiya said no to the job TWICE... anything else u need cleared up..

FYI i said oro was up in the air for me meaning he has kage level traits but im skeptical about it...

Sorry, I've been arguing with KYF for so much, I just start every post with that.

When did Sarutobi ever want Jiraiya as Hokage? He ended up selecting Minato as the Fourth, sure Jiraiya could have become the Hokage, but I don't ever remember learning about Sarutobi or Jiraiya's opinions on that matter. The only time Jiraiya was going to become Hokage, from my memory, was when the Third died and it became time to pick the Fifth.

Well considering Kabuto killed about 4 ANBU agents himself when he went to check up on Sasuke and he was Orochimaru's Lieutenant, let's just assume...

Need to be? Nowhere have I read that. A 'kage' is simply the strongest ninja in the village, the #1 ninja. This has been stated since the beginning of the series, anime or manga. To be kage-level a level of strength, not mastery has to be achieved otherwise you are being very delusional. Itachi was a genjutsu and ninjutsu monster, but his taijutsu was average at best. So he's not a kage-level shinobi? Same goes with Sasuke and Orochimaru. Naruto and Jiraiya have horrendous genjutsu.

The First and the Second APPEAR to have been ninjutsu "super"-masters and the Fourth and Third don't appear much different. Well-roundedness and strength have nothing to do with another. All warriors have weaknesses, but that doesn't mean they can't be legends.

I still stick to my definition of a kage-level shinobi as far above Jounin, and welcome other opinions besides Myth's as we have both rambled on about our perspectives on it.

lamps123
05-25-2009, 09:26 PM
well my point is tsunage is a kage level shinobi.
since she is hokage.
well at first you said clearly oro is not a kage level but if you skeptical about it then thats ok its ones opinion.lol

TheSixthHokage
05-25-2009, 10:03 PM
well my point is tsunage is a kage level shinobi.
since she is hokage.
well at first you said clearly oro is not a kage level but if you skeptical about it then thats ok its ones opinion.lol

She is, at least in my mind. When you are talented enough to make a Jounin seem totally inferior, kage-level is an accurate label. Just my opinion.

Myth
05-25-2009, 10:23 PM
When did Sarutobi ever want Jiraiya as Hokage? He ended up selecting Minato as the Fourth, sure Jiraiya could have become the Hokage, but I don't ever remember learning about Sarutobi or Jiraiya's opinions on that matter. The only time Jiraiya was going to become Hokage, from my memory, was when the Third died and it became time to pick the Fifth.http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-366/page012.html Oro and Tsunade were just rebound people since jiraiya never wanted the job.

Well considering Kabuto killed about 4 ANBU agents himself when he went to check up on Sasuke and he was Orochimaru's Lieutenant, let's just assume...Not saying he can't just saying it was never shown...

Need to be? Nowhere have I read that. A 'kage' is simply the strongest ninja in the village, the #1 ninja. This has been stated since the beginning of the series, anime or manga. To be kage-level a level of strength, not mastery has to be achieved otherwise you are being very delusional. Itachi was a genjutsu and ninjutsu monster, but his taijutsu was average at best. So he's not a kage-level shinobi? Same goes with Sasuke and Orochimaru. Naruto and Jiraiya have horrendous genjutsu.
Itachi's Taijutsu is at the highest possible level which is why he got himself a 5 in the DB with just a tap kick he made Kurenai fly across a lake and with a slap he made sasuke fly across a room... His speed in on level's beyond.. average at best... lolool.. also genjutsu works boths ways offense and defense. Just because u don't have genjutsu talent doesn't mean u cannot defend well against it...

The First and the Second APPEAR to have been ninjutsu "super"-masters and the Fourth and Third don't appear much different. Well-roundedness and strength have nothing to do with another. All warriors have weaknesses, but that doesn't mean they can't be legends. Sarutobi was called the God of ninja in his prime.. he didn't recieve that title by charming a few shinobi with his calmness.. Minato took out armies of ninjas within a blink of an eye shinobi were forced to flee on sightings. Shodaime was the most powerful ninja in his time whom had madara in it.. as well as his younger brother.. Nidaime made a name for himself for using Kinjutsu and being unsurpassed in water jutsu... These are true Kage level shinobi anything else i consider low kage meaning not actual kage...

I still stick to my definition of a kage-level shinobi as far above Jounin, and welcome other opinions besides Myth's as we have both rambled on about our perspectives on it.Agreed everyone has their own perception of what kage is mine follow the first 4...

Dagoro
05-25-2009, 11:20 PM
I rather go by manga feats then hype. The only 2 ninja who transcende this criteria are Shoidai and Madara who fought at ridiculous lvls.

By manga feats this is where i place the shinobi right now. ( includes dead people, no particular order )

Top tier/kage lvl +

Shodai
Madara
Pain

High tier/ Kage lvl

Naruto
Sasuke
Kb
Kisame
Itachi
Deidara
Kazuzu
Sasori
Jiraya
Oro
Sarutobi


The rest.

maddog
05-25-2009, 11:43 PM
@Dagoro: Where is Sandaime, Nidaime, Oro, and Jman?

joining the discussion, i think Kage lvl is not just being the strongest. but being able to fight using ninja skills, and more specially, your head. strength is not the only measure of being Kage. as what sandaime said before, being the strongest doesn't mean you have to master a lot of ninjutsu.

with that description, i can go with Dagoro's list, and add a few more...

Dagoro
05-25-2009, 11:46 PM
Top tier/kage lvl +

Shodai
Madara
Pain

High tier/ Kage lvl

Naruto
Sasuke
Kb
Kisame
Itachi
Deidara
Kazuzu
Sasori
Jiraya
Oro
Sarutobi


The rest.

Fixed. My problem with guys like Shodai's bro is that we have never seen them really fight. His performance wasn't that awesome as a reanimated corpse, Kisame pulled water tech stronger than what he showed.

( Not saying that the real guy was equal to an edo tenseicopy, but we have nothing else to go by. )

maddog
05-25-2009, 11:51 PM
^that's true. no mention of his feats also. Madara only mentioned Shodai's superb fighting skills. but not his brother's...

Myth
05-26-2009, 12:27 AM
Minato tops ur list darago... just hearing people talk about him is enough... not to mention he slapped the kyuubi 2wice...

High tier kage sarutobi lmfaoooo.... as for kisame he isn't anywhere near kage level...


Minato
Shodaime
Madara
Pain
Sandaime
Jiraiya
Nidaime
These shinobi are true kage level meaning they would be strong enough to save konoha from destruction... 3 already have fighting against all odds....zzzzzZZzz

Naruto
Itachi
Could save the people but their technques would destroy the village

Sasuke is to much of a hot shot and thinks to big he would get slapped by a strong foe but only for underestimating them.. not because he is weak...
Kakshi... to low on stamina

edit: in the future if u say something like "i haven't seen one of them fight.. make sure the people on ur list all have fought nd u have seen it.....ZZzzzzz u place madara and shodai going off by what u heard... not what u saw...

maddog
05-26-2009, 12:32 AM
@Myth: it's not SHODAIME man. it's only SHODAI... just correcting man...

Myth
05-26-2009, 12:34 AM
@Myth: it's not SHODAIME man. it's only SHODAI... just correcting man...

It's Shodaime hokage nidaime hokage sandaime hokage yondaime hokage..

in short

shodai,nidai,sandai,yondai.............. .

Dagoro
05-26-2009, 12:36 AM
My list had no particular order, i did forget Minato.

Madara commanded the Kyubi like a pet and Shodai beat both in a fight, thats good enough for me though we have few pannels of them.

Kisame captured a Jinchuriki, which is no small feat. Most people would die right off the bat. Again my criteria is different then whatever you use, so we get conflicting results.

maddog
05-26-2009, 12:42 AM
It's Shodaime hokage nidaime hokage sandaime hokage yondaime hokage..

in short

shodai,nidai,sandai,yondai.............. .

Why is it that in the Anime, when referring to the first, they only say SHODAI-SAMA, and the rest have the "me" at the end??? they never said SHODAIME-SAMA in the anime...

Myth
05-26-2009, 12:44 AM
My list had no particular order, i did forget Minato.

Madara commanded the Kyubi like a pet and Shodai beat both in a fight, thats good enough for me though we have few pannels of them.

Kisame captured a Jinchuriki, which is no small feat. Most people would die right off the bat. Again my criteria is different then whatever you use, so we get conflicting results.

shodaime beat madara never was it said he beat kyuubi.. Minato put kyuubi down he took care off the little fox for good all alone without having some haxed out bloodline he did it all with pure talent..

thats what sets aside sarutobi prime and minato from madara nd shodaime they made a name for themselves without any haxed out bloodlines they weren't born into power they attained it... thats why minato was called the greatest hokage and strongest leaf ninja ever.. shodai and madara are great but lets take away their bloodlines and see what we got..

@maddog idk what ur talking about but when they talk about tsunade they always say godaime -sama meaning 5th..

Dagoro
05-26-2009, 12:46 AM
Meh, you work with what you got. Not penalizing the 2 for Keke genkai.

shodaime beat madara never was it said he beat kyuubi..

Madara used it against him and he came out victorious, he disabled them both. I call that winning.

Myth
05-26-2009, 12:52 AM
Meh, you work with what you got. Not penalizing the 2 for Keke genkai.

im not saying u should lol.. just putting it out there we know the uchiha would be fairly average maybe a bit above without their eyes... thats my problem with bloodlines these shinobi progress throughout their lives relying on 1 thing...

that's why i just a bigger fan of the ninja who have no special luck being born into power but rather make something of themselves and surpass those bloodline shinobi.

edit: how do u know hasirama disabled the kyuubi last i checked nothing was said...

Dagoro
05-26-2009, 12:55 AM
He could bend Bijuu to his will, what else could have happened ??

I don't really have a problem with Keke genkai unless its doujutsu, specially SG. It was cool in the beginning with just being able to copy/analize jutsu, than kishi completely broke it and made the whole damn story revolve around it.

maddog
05-26-2009, 12:56 AM
@myth: although a lot of people always say SHODAIME (there's even a fan site named SHODAIME) here's the proof that in Japanese Kanji, it should only read as SHODAI.

First Hokage
Hashirama Senju, the First Hokage

Main article: Hashirama Senju
Hashirama Senju (千手柱間, Senju Hashirama), the First Hokage (初代火影, Shodai Hokage; Literally meaning "First or Founding Fire Shadow"), was the founder of Konoha, the older brother of Tobirama Senju, the Second Hokage, and the grandfather of Tsunade (the Fifth Hokage), and Nawaki.

here's the link to read the rest of it.

http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Hokage

Myth
05-26-2009, 12:58 AM
@myth: although a lot of people always say SHODAIME (there's even a fan site named SHODAIME) here's the proof that in Japanese Kanji, it should only read as SHODAI.

First Hokage
Hashirama Senju, the First Hokage

Main article: Hashirama Senju
Hashirama Senju (千手柱間, Senju Hashirama), the First Hokage (初代火影, Shodai Hokage; Literally meaning "First or Founding Fire Shadow"), was the founder of Konoha, the older brother of Tobirama Senju, the Second Hokage, and the grandfather of Tsunade (the Fifth Hokage), and Nawaki.

here's the link to read the rest of it.

http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Hokage


lol i really don't care im jus saying they say shodaime as well...

maddog
05-26-2009, 01:05 AM
edit: how do u know hasirama disabled the kyuubi last i checked nothing was said...

Here's where it was said.

The ability Orochimaru most highly praised him for was his unique ability to control Tailed Beasts. Of all his considerable talents, it was this ability in particular that made Hashirama unparalleled in the shinobi world. He at one time had many of the beasts in his possession and was able to defeat the Nine-Tailed Demon Fox during his battle with Madara. This ability was greatly amplified by his crystal necklace, which Yamato suggested was a requirement to control even Naruto's partial lapses into tailed forms.

http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Hashirama_Senju

lol i really don't care im jus saying they say shodaime as well...

^ok. just trying to correct...

Myth
05-26-2009, 01:20 AM
Here's where it was said.

The ability Orochimaru most highly praised him for was his unique ability to control Tailed Beasts. Of all his considerable talents, it was this ability in particular that made Hashirama unparalleled in the shinobi world. He at one time had many of the beasts in his possession and was able to defeat the Nine-Tailed Demon Fox during his battle with Madara. This ability was greatly amplified by his crystal necklace, which Yamato suggested was a requirement to control even Naruto's partial lapses into tailed forms.

http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Hashirama_Senju



^ok. just trying to correct...


cool link but next time make sure the link u give isn't fan written it sayd and i quote

"Hashirama had been noted by both Madara Uchiha and several Konoha Jonin to be regarded as the most powerful ninja of his time."

Never was it once even pronounced by any konoha ninja that shodaime was the most powerful in his time, oh and the word "jounin" was spelled wrong as well....

Also not even the DB has info on hashirama nor has the manga ever said anything about the kyuubi during his fight against madara other then that madara used it... yet they write "he defeated the kyuubi" lol...

TheSixthHokage
05-26-2009, 01:32 AM
http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-366/page012.html Oro and Tsunade were just rebound people since jiraiya never wanted the job.

Not saying he can't just saying it was never shown...
Itachi's Taijutsu is at the highest possible level which is why he got himself a 5 in the DB with just a tap kick he made Kurenai fly across a lake and with a slap he made sasuke fly across a room... His speed in on level's beyond.. average at best... lolool.. also genjutsu works boths ways offense and defense. Just because u don't have genjutsu talent doesn't mean u cannot defend well against it...

Sarutobi was called the God of ninja in his prime.. he didn't recieve that title by charming a few shinobi with his calmness.. Minato took out armies of ninjas within a blink of an eye shinobi were forced to flee on sightings. Shodaime was the most powerful ninja in his time whom had madara in it.. as well as his younger brother.. Nidaime made a name for himself for using Kinjutsu and being unsurpassed in water jutsu... These are true Kage level shinobi anything else i consider low kage meaning not actual kage...
Agreed everyone has their own perception of what kage is mine follow the first 4...

1) Thank you for finding the evidence, I appreciate it. But by her saying "you were originally slated" doesn't that mean after Sarutobi had broken ties with Orochimaru and allowed him to escape?
2) DB, to my knowledge, measures potential -- not capability. A "5" simply means they are at their greatest level of taijutsu potential, a "5" doesn't mean they have excellent taijutsu, it means it's as good as they are going to get in it.
3) That's quite true but to my knowledge the ways to deflect genjutsu include: having a teammate inject their chakra into you or for you to make a "chakra pulse" and overwhelm them with force (assuming you have no genjutsu to counter theirs of course). So Jiraiya would in theory, be somewhat screwed, if he faced someone with higher chakra levels as his pulse could be suffocate by the genjutsu-caster... to the best of my understanding anyways. Jiraiya is a chakra monster though, thus why he could do senjutsu, but still for argument's sake, genjutsu is a hard thing to defend against without some skill in the offensive capabilities of that art.
4) Again, thanks for saying that. 'Kage-level' is a fan term and really can't be used with any real degree of objectivity... my kage-level determinating factor is Kakashi Part I, anyone who could quite easily thrash him would be considered 'kage-level' to me. Tsunade is probably one that most would disagree with but I feel that she may be a support-centred shinobi, but that doesn't mean her powers aren't WAY beyond Jounin. Again, that's just MY take on it. As subjective as the definition is, I cannot 'prove' anything with my explanation.

On an urelated side note, how the hell are the Senju basically wiped out? Weren't they a clan or at least a noble family if you will?? Tsunade is the only living Senju we know of, how is that even possible?

maddog
05-26-2009, 01:32 AM
^Ok. but still, Shodai is right. and not Shodaime... :D

Dagoro
05-26-2009, 01:35 AM
The Senju weren't wiped out, they just diluted into the population of Konoha. Remember that the Uchiha and Senju founded the village, since the senju didn't have a keke genkai they were probably free to married as they wished.

Only Hashi had Mokuton to be clear.

Unfera Syndrome
05-26-2009, 01:36 AM
I think yamato should be alot mor powerful sincehe has the ablitiy of the first hokage but kishi likes to make him weak

TheSixthHokage
05-26-2009, 01:36 AM
The Senju weren't wiped out, they just diluted into the population of Konoha. Remember that the Uchiha and Senju founded the village, since the senju didn't have a keke genkai they were probably free to married as they wished.

Only Hashi had Mokuton to be clear.

Yes, I know only the First had Wood Element (maybe the rest of the Senju men were impotent? *bada-bing!*). That's a decent theory but even still, wouldn't those people still be among the new Genin or something?? I mean even the Nara Clan, as small as it appears, is still apparent.

TheSixthHokage
05-26-2009, 01:38 AM
I rather go by manga feats then hype. The only 2 ninja who transcende this criteria are Shoidai and Madara who fought at ridiculous lvls.

By manga feats this is where i place the shinobi right now. ( includes dead people, no particular order )

Top tier/kage lvl +

Shodai
Madara
Pain

High tier/ Kage lvl

Naruto
Sasuke
Kb
Kisame
Itachi
Deidara
Kazuzu
Sasori
Jiraya
Oro
Sarutobi


The rest.

What about Kakashi? I could understand leaving out Tsunade, though I wouldn't, but surely MS Kakashi is to be included.

Dagoro
05-26-2009, 01:38 AM
Well not quite. The senju were all ninja, they probably let regular people in to function as a work force etc. They probably vanished as time went by since they were the founders.


What about Kakashi?

I don't consider him Kage lvl, just the top Jounin.

Unfera Syndrome
05-26-2009, 01:39 AM
No love for Gaara

TheSixthHokage
05-26-2009, 01:42 AM
I think yamato should be alot mor powerful sincehe has the ablitiy of the first hokage but kishi likes to make him weak

I think he's an above-average Jounin but he seems to have only a fraction of pwnage that was the First. The First controlled Bijuu's, he was the ultimate badass... only Madara, Pain, Naruto and Sasuke compare. (And only the last two because we all know eventually those two will equal gods).

Myth
05-26-2009, 01:42 AM
1) Thank you for finding the evidence, I appreciate it. But by her saying "you were originally slated" doesn't that mean after Sarutobi had broken ties with Orochimaru and allowed him to escape?
2) DB, to my knowledge, measures potential -- not capability. A "5" simply means they are at their greatest level of taijutsu potential, a "5" doesn't mean they have excellent taijutsu, it means it's as good as they are going to get in it.
3) That's quite true but to my knowledge the ways to deflect genjutsu include: having a teammate inject their chakra into you or for you to make a "chakra pulse" and overwhelm them with force (assuming you have no genjutsu to counter theirs of course). So Jiraiya would in theory, be somewhat screwed, if he faced someone with higher chakra levels as his pulse could be suffocate by the genjutsu-caster... to the best of my understanding anyways. Jiraiya is a chakra monster though, thus why he could do senjutsu, but still for argument's sake, genjutsu is a hard thing to defend against without some skill in the offensive capabilities of that art.
4) Again, thanks for saying that. 'Kage-level' is a fan term and really can't be used with any real degree of objectivity... my kage-level determinating factor is Kakashi Part I, anyone who could quite easily thrash him would be considered 'kage-level' to me. Tsunade is probably one that most would disagree with but I feel that she may be a support-centred shinobi, but that doesn't mean her powers aren't WAY beyond Jounin. Again, that's just MY take on it. As subjective as the definition is, I cannot 'prove' anything with my explanation.

On an urelated side note, how the hell are the Senju basically wiped out? Weren't they a clan or at least a noble family if you will?? Tsunade is the only living Senju we know of, how is that even possible?

u don't need high levels of chakra to dispel genjutsu since sakura's is very low and she was able to dispel genjutsu easily.. that and jiraiya had shit loads of chakra... but like i said u don't need higher chakra then the other to dispel a genjutsu u just have to increase the flow.. basically if ur chakra is going normally just power up a bit thats all.. also jiraiya was able to break that woman out the genjutsu itachi did and was able to see that it was sharignan casted...

a 5 does mean ur fully potential, however u don't get a 5 just like that.. it's also there to show u what the shinobi is capable of on paper.. that and itachi has shown great taijutsu.. trust me he didn't get anbu squad captain at 13 for only having his eyes...

Unfera Syndrome
05-26-2009, 01:44 AM
Im just starting in this posting thing how do you get to see new posts without refreshing the screen

Myth
05-26-2009, 01:44 AM
Im just starting in this posting thing how do you get to see new posts without refreshing the screen

refresh the page

Unfera Syndrome
05-26-2009, 01:45 AM
thats stupid

TheSixthHokage
05-26-2009, 01:45 AM
u don't need high levels of chakra to dispel genjutsu since sakura's is very low and she was able to dispel genjutsu easily.. that and jiraiya had shit loads of chakra... but like i said u don't need higher chakra then the other to dispel a genjutsu u just have to increase the flow.. basically if ur chakra is going normally just power up a bit thats all.. also jiraiya was able to break that woman out the genjutsu itachi did and was able to see that it was sharignan casted...

a 5 does mean ur fully potential, however u don't get a 5 just like that.. it's also there to show u what the shinobi is capable of on paper.. that and itachi has shown great taijutsu.. trust me he didn't get anbu squad captain at 13 for only having his eyes...

Kakashi was an ANBU captain as well and he has above-average taijutsu at best. Well, think of it mathematically:

Say Itachi's maximum capability is 15, that "5" indicates a 100% efficiency in capability, i.e. potential was maximized, so he has a full ability of 15.

Take Maito Gai let's say who for sake of argument has a "4," but his maximum capability is 25, that means his full ability is 20.

Sort of a crappy example, sorry, but my point is the DB simply says how close they are to personal perfection, it's quite subjective. It's not like power-levels, again that's just my understanding of it.

I am sure Itachi became a Captain because of insane maturity, Sharingan mastery and that he was so amazing with ninjutsu and genjutsu.

Myth
05-26-2009, 07:19 AM
Kakashi was an ANBU captain as well and he has above-average taijutsu at best. Well, think of it mathematically:

Say Itachi's maximum capability is 15, that "5" indicates a 100% efficiency in capability, i.e. potential was maximized, so he has a full ability of 15.

Take Maito Gai let's say who for sake of argument has a "4," but his maximum capability is 25, that means his full ability is 20.

Sort of a crappy example, sorry, but my point is the DB simply says how close they are to personal perfection, it's quite subjective. It's not like power-levels, again that's just my understanding of it.

I am sure Itachi became a Captain because of insane maturity, Sharingan mastery and that he was so amazing with ninjutsu and genjutsu.

he was an anbu squad captain at the age of 13 U DON'T GET THAT TITLE for having pretty eyes and a few ninjutsu... u must excel beyond well in all areas to make that... nd ucertainly dnt get that title at 13.

Shrike
05-26-2009, 10:03 AM
Orochimaru was a Candidate for 1 reason because Sarutobi liked him best of course down the line we all found out that Sarutobi actually always liked jiraiya best and wanted him as hoakge not orochimaru... But jiraiya was lazy and would never take it so he wanted oro being his student it would be an honor for him...

Don't be ridiculous, and such a Minato fanboy.
Sarutobi favored Orochimaru over Jiraiya. Orochimaru was his favorite student, it's all over the manga.
He wasn't a candidate when Minato was a kid. When the time came to choose 4th, he chose Minato over Orochimaru, that's all. He said he would rather choose Oro if he wasn't so twisted.
Don't worry, that doesn't mean Orochimaru is stronger.

Orochimaru's only kinjutsu was and stand edo tensei i have not seen him perform anything else titled "forbidden"... oro's dream was to master every jutsu however his body snatching got in the way...

Everything Oro did was forbidden. Curse Seal, experiments, etc.

Killed Anbu by the Dozens i forgot where they showed that unless of course its a figment of ur imagination.. invented the cs how cool but he didn't really invent it now did he.. he took the dna off the guy who had it and injected it in himself thus being able to give it out like a sickness... he didn't actually "invent" it like it was his own thing...

That doesn't mean shit. He still managed to use CS as he wished. He experimented, and got an awesome result. No one else did that.

As for kage level in konoha u need to be a power house in all areas to attain such a title... u can argue that not all the kages were genjutsu specialists but they were all masters in defense against it just look at sarutobi's old age stats he's practically perfect in all areas cept for stamina and speed(old age effects that) that is what it means to be a hokage...

Hokage is the strongest man in the village, usually. Or the most capable of the job.

Also tsunade isn't actually a hoakge she is a rebound girl because jiraiya said no to the job TWICE... anything else u need cleared up..

Doesn't mean she isn't Hokage material. Because she is.

FYI i said oro was up in the air for me meaning he has kage level traits but im skeptical about it...

Orochimaru is Kage level ninja. You just need to read the manga to see that, no amount of speculation will change that. The fact that Kishimoto didn't have him own some instant-kill hax jutsu just shows that he is indeed a great ninja.

Why is it that in the Anime, when referring to the first, they only say SHODAI-SAMA, and the rest have the "me" at the end??? they never said SHODAIME-SAMA in the anime...

Shodaime is correct too. Shodai is short.

@Myth: it's not SHODAIME man. it's only SHODAI... just correcting man...

Myth is right, again. It IS Shodaime, actually. Shodaime, Nidaime, Sandaime, Yondaime. It's all the same.

Meh, you work with what you got. Not penalizing the 2 for Keke genkai.

Madara used it against him and he came out victorious, he disabled them both. I call that winning.

Shodai could control Kyuubi as well. So he may have turned it against Madara. Nothing is certain except that Madara lost that day.

Kakashi was an ANBU captain as well and he has above-average taijutsu at best. Well, think of it mathematically:

Say Itachi's maximum capability is 15, that "5" indicates a 100% efficiency in capability, i.e. potential was maximized, so he has a full ability of 15.

Take Maito Gai let's say who for sake of argument has a "4," but his maximum capability is 25, that means his full ability is 20.

Sort of a crappy example, sorry, but my point is the DB simply says how close they are to personal perfection, it's quite subjective. It's not like power-levels, again that's just my understanding of it.

I am sure Itachi became a Captain because of insane maturity, Sharingan mastery and that he was so amazing with ninjutsu and genjutsu.

Kakashi is not Kage level. Kakashi is an awesome ninja, all around. Almost Kage level, but not there. Someone like Kakuzu trashes him 1 vs 1 easily. Unfortunately he lacks the stamina to compete with the best. He was an ANBU Captain, sure.

Myth
05-26-2009, 05:46 PM
Don't be ridiculous, and such a Minato fanboy.
Sarutobi favored Orochimaru over Jiraiya. Orochimaru was his favorite student, it's all over the manga.
He wasn't a candidate when Minato was a kid. When the time came to choose 4th, he chose Minato over Orochimaru, that's all. He said he would rather choose Oro if he wasn't so twisted.
Don't worry, that doesn't mean Orochimaru is stronger.I already posted a link proving that Jiraiya was sarutobi's true choice always.. he always wanted him to take the job.. As for minato he was a kid when oro was an adult he died young... kakashi is more then 20 years younger then oro and jiraiya if minato died at his age which is 30 the time that oro was offered the title he was a kid.. oro was long gone when minato was chosen...


Everything Oro did was forbidden. Curse Seal, experiments, etc.yes however that doesn't take away from the fact that he only used and showed 1 kinjutsu....



That doesn't mean shit. He still managed to use CS as he wished. He experimented, and got an awesome result. No one else did that. No one else bothered....



Hokage is the strongest man in the village, usually. Or the most capable of the job.Usually....



Doesn't mean she isn't Hokage material. Because she is.If jiraiya was kage konoha would still be around...



Orochimaru is Kage level ninja. You just need to read the manga to see that, no amount of speculation will change that. The fact that Kishimoto didn't have him own some instant-kill hax jutsu just shows that he is indeed a great ninja.
he does a have a haxed out move.. edo tensei

Shrike
05-26-2009, 06:46 PM
If jiraiya was kage konoha would still be around...

How, exactly would anyone survive Chou Shinra? Tsunade was the one who saved herself + the villagers.
If Jiraiya was there, it would be a barren land with dead bodies. Now it's barren land with survivors.
Pain got there to see if Naruto was there. If he knew Naruto wasn't there he could have just did Shinra right away, and not bother with fighting.

he does a have a haxed out move.. edo tensei

It's his jutsu. It isn't anything like a Bijuu or a Mangekyo. It's like Chidori.

Edit: Oh, and Lol about Orochimaru and Minato. Also, Tsunade says FIFTH, not Fourth.

superninja
05-26-2009, 08:41 PM
New fight is Shikamaru and Kakashi vs Yahiko Pein, the location is battlefield Konoha. Pein can't use the chibaku tensei and the massive shinra tensei coz there are other bodies operating elsewhere. Shika and Kaka know about his powers, just to make it fair.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-26-2009, 08:57 PM
Well, IMO kakashi is enough to actually beat deva with such an advantage as knowledge and terrain.

For instance, kakashi set his raiton bushin as a trap for deva, not demon. But demon showed up and got in the way of a good fight "shakes first at Kishi:mad:". So, raiton bushin gets STed into the ground, deva walks over to finish off a defenseless KK, but deva gets electricuted and immobilised by the bushin leaving himself easy pickens for a quick ambush from behind.

Myth
05-26-2009, 09:25 PM
How, exactly would anyone survive Chou Shinra? Tsunade was the one who saved herself + the villagers.
If Jiraiya was there, it would be a barren land with dead bodies. Now it's barren land with survivors.
Pain got there to see if Naruto was there. If he knew Naruto wasn't there he could have just did Shinra right away, and not bother with fighting.



It's his jutsu. It isn't anything like a Bijuu or a Mangekyo. It's like Chidori.

Edit: Oh, and Lol about Orochimaru and Minato. Also, Tsunade says FIFTH, not Fourth.

If Jiraiya was kage along with kakashi he would obliterate pain they would both tap dance all over pains ass all day every dayy.. by the time naruto would get there there would be prob 1 body god realm waiting...

Don't even argue it its fact that if jiraiya was kage in tsunades place he and kakashi would rip pain in half...

there's nothing to lol about its simple math genius... and for u fifth thing not really this is what was said that sarutobi always wanted HIM to succeed him plain nd simple he was offered the job twice cause if u read on she says "but u left cause u wanted to pursue orochimaru":cool:

edit:http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-366/page012.html there's the link for ya... remember he left the village years ago to go after oro...

liondemon
05-26-2009, 09:58 PM
But we know from Sarutobi himself that he always favored Orochumaru and hoped he would take his place. And since cannon is cannon, and Tsunade clearly says 5th Hokage, Jiraiya was only an option after Minato. How can we even interpret Tsunade's phrase about what the third always wanted, to assume she meant ever since Jiraiya was a boy, before the 3rd needed to choose a 5th, as Tsnuade stated.

Why even pay her assumption of the 3rd's intentions any mind when Sarutobi showed us what was on his mind about Orochumaru's once in a ? genius and him someday becoming Hokage. Even Jiraiya as a kid commented on how Sarutobi was always paying more attention to his prize pupil Orochumaru

Myth
05-26-2009, 10:31 PM
But we know from Sarutobi himself that he always favored Orochumaru and hoped he would take his place. And since cannon is cannon, and Tsunade clearly says 5th Hokage, Jiraiya was only an option after Minato. How can we even interpret Tsunade's phrase about what the third always wanted, to assume she meant ever since Jiraiya was a boy, before the 3rd needed to choose a 5th, as Tsnuade stated.

Why even pay her assumption of the 3rd's intentions any mind when Sarutobi showed us what was on his mind about Orochumaru's once in a ? genius and him someday becoming Hokage. Even Jiraiya as a kid commented on how Sarutobi was always paying more attention to his prize pupil Orochumaru

there's nothing to interpret unless u don't know how to read it clearly says..."he wanted you to take over but u went after oro instead".... yes he was also slated to be the fifth but thats because he was alaways sarutobi's original choice... thats why she said "but instead u went after oro" after she said "u were always his choice"...

There's no assuming going on my part lol, I am basically telling u what i understood from what she said..

edit: i mean it clearly seals what i said up when she says "but u resigned to go after orochimaru right?" lol that's cherry on top...

<DaNTe>
05-26-2009, 10:42 PM
I already posted a link proving that Jiraiya was sarutobi's true choice always..

Huh? When did this happen?

I always thought Oro was the thirds choice to be hokage, but his evil ways prevented him from becoming it.

TheSixthHokage
05-26-2009, 10:49 PM
Orochimaru was always the favoured successor of Sarutobi...

<DaNTe>
05-26-2009, 10:56 PM
If Jiraiya was kage along with kakashi he would obliterate pain they would both tap dance all over pains ass all day every dayy.. by the time naruto would get there there would be prob 1 body god realm waiting...

Jiraiya got fucking raped by Pain. You think a Kakashi who has poor stamina would make much of a difference in that fight?








Don't even argue it its fact that if jiraiya was kage in tsunades place he and kakashi would rip pain in half...


Weak argument.



I think your reading some next Naruto manga. Pain is perhaps one of the most strongest characters in Naruto. He raped Jiraiya and would rape him again and again.

Shrike
05-27-2009, 05:13 AM
If Jiraiya was kage along with kakashi he would obliterate pain they would both tap dance all over pains ass all day every dayy.. by the time naruto would get there there would be prob 1 body god realm waiting...

Don't even argue it its fact that if jiraiya was kage in tsunades place he and kakashi would rip pain in half...

there's nothing to lol about its simple math genius... and for u fifth thing not really this is what was said that sarutobi always wanted HIM to succeed him plain nd simple he was offered the job twice cause if u read on she says "but u left cause u wanted to pursue orochimaru":cool:

edit:http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-366/page012.html there's the link for ya... remember he left the village years ago to go after oro...

Obliterate Pain? I think we all knew how Jiraiya vs Pain ended. Also, what I said stands - how can he counter huge Shinra? Answer - he can't, he dies.

Also, Orochimaru was favored student of Sandaime. He wanted Jiraiya succeed him after Orochimaru deflected. Meaning, he wanted Jiraiya over Tsunade. If you can't realize that, you are in denial. It's all over the manga that Orochimaru was his favorite.
You said it yourself - But you left to pursue Orochimaru, meaning after Oro left.

superninja
05-27-2009, 05:25 AM
Jiraiya got fucking raped by Pain. You think a Kakashi who has poor stamina would make much of a difference in that fight?


I think your reading some next Naruto manga. Pain is perhaps one of the most strongest characters in Naruto. He raped Jiraiya and would rape him again and again.


I don't think so, Pein's bodies were scattered around Konoha during his invasion and Jiraiya could beat them one on one easily, except for the Deva realm which can do his gravity blasts so it's hard to get close.
Plus Kakashi is a good team player, he could at least take care of one Pein's path, Jiraiya would kill the other Pein's path before Pein regroups. So there you have it.

Shrike
05-27-2009, 05:29 AM
Except, you know, that Deva wouldn't even fight Jiraiya and just did big Shinra? Also, we didn't see anything Jiraiya can do to counter Deva. Naruto got raped 1v1.

superninja
05-27-2009, 07:22 AM
Except, you know, that Deva wouldn't even fight Jiraiya and just did big Shinra? Also, we didn't see anything Jiraiya can do to counter Deva. Naruto got raped 1v1.

He would have to disable his other bodies for that, but if Pein wanted to he could do a big shinra or chibaku tensei and destroy Konoha without a fight. That is the way he could beat anyone easily, but if he was scattered around Konoha like he was he would get beaten eventually.

poolangya
05-27-2009, 05:54 PM
@sarutobi's favorite candidate for hokage

orochimaru is. skill wise. a true genius from sarutobi's mouth himself. but he is tainted. so he would rather choose jiraiya who would be more capable of running the position because of his ideals in life ( except when in pervert mode, which is almost always ).
jiraiya in hokage position when pain attacks will just fast forward the reduction of Konoha into a huge crater. Yes he can take down one or two Pains or maybe even 5 if he manages to encounter them 1 on 1 which i bet he will. but deva? i don't think so. if he encounter's deva, deva will just do the massive shinra tensei and konoha still ends the same, a giant crater.

@ shikamaru + kakashi vs Deva
shikamaru + kakashi loses this. one on one, kakashi loses. he fought with the akimichi and fodder ninja, he loses. yes shikamaru can restrict the movement of deva, but deva can cast shinra tensei and tensho banin without lifting a finger to push and pull shikamaru and force him to release the jutsu and grab a hold of something to avoid sure death. SM Naruto used KB henge'd into a hundred or so rocks to throw rasengans to Deva and he swiped them all, how would u think Shikamaru + Kakashi would fare? Deva Pain 9-1 Shikamaru + Kakashi. Deva wins.

Myth
05-27-2009, 05:55 PM
@Dante - Jiraiya was able to successfully take out 3 bodies before they came back his genjutsu alone handles Multiple Bodies, add kakashi's Kamui nd it gets worse for pain... Ur whole argument is weak since if all 6 were out jiraiya would kill more then 1 for good ;)...

@Shrike - Stop with ur Large ST already he only used that because he had nothing left to do his search was over so as a partying gift he used it... Kkashi and jiraiya would tear holes in his ass... If kakashi and choji shinobi's were able to nearly level God realm wtf makes u think Jiriaya and kakashi wouldn't obliterate him... Ur large ST doesn't count since he won't use it till his info was done...

@SixthHoakge and any other moron still questiong who was Sarutobi's choice.... Yes Shrike he was slated to be the Fifth but that's not on Sarutobi's orders thats on their orders...

http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-140/page010.html - that's why tsunade said Fifth

and then here she says http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-366/page012.html "but u turned it down because u went after orochimaru"

Any other questions...

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-27-2009, 05:58 PM
Gaara vs Oro? No edo tensai!

poolangya
05-27-2009, 06:06 PM
gaara vs oro
orochimaru will have a hard time against gaara's sand especially if gaara decides to end it early. but as slick as orochimaru is, i believe he will find a way to eventually shorten the gap from him to gaara and be in melee distance in moments to use his "forgot-the-name" sword which could probably pierce gaara's sand defence. manga exploits hints an orochimaru easy win, but i go for Gaara because of his Sand jutsus which i believe Orochimaru will definitely have a hard time. Gaara 6-4 Orochimaru. Gaara wins by close margin.

lamps123
05-27-2009, 06:07 PM
Gaara vs Oro? No edo tensai!
does gaara have shukaku

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-27-2009, 06:11 PM
No shukaku!

And a fight against Gaara on the ground without Raiton jutsu is hard for anyone, lol. Although Gaara would beat Oro to within an inch of his life I think Oro would win IMO.

lamps123
05-27-2009, 06:19 PM
No shukaku!

And a fight against Gaara on the ground without Raiton jutsu is hard for anyone, lol. Although Gaara would beat Oro to within an inch of his life I think Oro would win IMO.
shukaku i think gaara would win,
but without it i dont think sooo.

Vengeance
05-27-2009, 06:50 PM
Orochimaru vs. Gaara
Anyone saying Gaara would win this is a moron. Orochimaru is a Fuuton & Doton user he could simply slip through Gaara's sand by manipulating its density (Sand is a form of earth). Gaara doesn't stand a chance in hell against Orochimaru with or without Shukaku. Orochimaru can create seals that would disrupt Gaara’s connection to Shukaku. Orochimaru could travel underground like Zetsu or use massive Fuuton jutsu to blow away Gaara’s sand defenses. Orochimaru’s sword of Kusanagi would be enough to pierce all of Gaara’s sand defenses including his sand armor. Let's also not forget about the massive summons, extremely high chakra pool, & vast years of experience Orochimaru has to his advantage. You guy's are clearly underestimating the Sannin with this one.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-27-2009, 06:54 PM
I forgot he had the ability to slip through earth like zetsu so Oro will annihilate even Gaara.

liondemon
05-27-2009, 07:24 PM
@Dante - Jiraiya was able to successfully take out 3 bodies before they came back his genjutsu alone handles Multiple Bodies, add kakashi's Kamui nd it gets worse for pain... Ur whole argument is weak since if all 6 were out jiraiya would kill more then 1 for good ;)...

@Shrike - Stop with ur Large ST already he only used that because he had nothing left to do his search was over so as a partying gift he used it... Kkashi and jiraiya would tear holes in his ass... If kakashi and choji shinobi's were able to nearly level God realm wtf makes u think Jiriaya and kakashi wouldn't obliterate him... Ur large ST doesn't count since he won't use it till his info was done...

@SixthHoakge and any other moron still questiong who was Sarutobi's choice.... Yes Shrike he was slated to be the Fifth but that's not on Sarutobi's orders thats on their orders...

http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-140/page010.html - that's why tsunade said Fifth

and then here she says http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-366/page012.html "but u turned it down because u went after orochimaru"

Any other questions...


Hokage: Orochu vs Jiraiya


1 question. Is leaf Ninja accurate? In Orochu's bio summary, they say Orochumaru wasnt chosen by Sarutobi for his evil ways, and someone else was chosen, then he was caught doing his experiments, then he left/fled.

I cant remember where it was, but somewhere in the manga, someone once said that they heard Orochu left because he wasnt chosen as 4th. I think in the chunnin exams. Minato was chosen, Orochumaru later got caught doing his experiments, and then he fled. Then Jiraiya followed

Nobody's saying Jiraiya wasnt qualified back then. With Orochgumaru as his rival, he likely excelled like naruto did with Sasuke for his rival. Jiraiya could have been 4th, but like Jiraiya said himself, he's too free spirited although he has the will of fire too, but at that time, Minato was a younger, better all round choice. The theme is to pass it to the younger, up and coming generation. the Kings. Minato becoming Hokage made Jiraiya more proud than if he had done it. "a great master trains a great student", or something like that. Anybody and everybody knew Jiraiya was Hokage material. He just never really wanted the chain and ball title, but he still acted as a Hokage would and beyond for Konoha. Jiraiaya was like, How bout i just train u 2 generations of Hokages and find one for u? The only Manga fact is that Minato was 4th, and Saruto always hoped Orochu would be the one he could pass it on to, and that Jiraiya was 5th.

When Jiraiya was offered the position, they told him that they had just talked it over and decided on him, who just happened to be the only Sannin whose whereabouts where known at the time. Jiraya basically said Tsunade is a Sannin too, ima go findher. The elder didnt need to go retalk anything over like they did to choose Jiraiya. She just said ok. If Jiraiya was always on the 3rd's mind, no meeting to decide anything would have needed to take place. Sarutobi died but he already made it clear that Shikamaru was to become chunnin. Jiraiya was never in the runup, but always a given, likely by anyone that knew him. to be one of the "great 3" at 25-30,40,50 years old means u are Hokage material and level. great students are supposed to surpass the teacher as the new generation. Minato did that to Jiraiya still Jiraiya always hokage material just never an option until 5th according to the manga. Like u say, it's manga fact its cannon
Tsunade is talking kind, praising words to Jiraiya. She Drunk, horny, thinking bout how Jiraiya has always been there for her and just really realizing she has feelings for him. Just words proven to be wrong by manga fact. It's just the liquor talking Myth. Dont listen to it.

Myth
05-27-2009, 07:28 PM
Hokage: Orochu vs Jiraiya


1 question. Is leaf Ninja accurate? In Orochu's bio summary, they say Orochumaru wasnt chosen by Sarutobi for his evil ways, and someone else was chosen, then he was caught doing his experiments, then he left/fled.

I cant remember where it was, but somewhere in the manga, someone once said that they heard Orochu left because he wasnt chosen as 4th. I think in the chunnin exams. Minato was chosen, Orochumaru later got caught doing his experiments, and then he fled. Then Jiraiya followed

Nobody's saying Jiraiya wasnt qualified back then. With Orochgumaru as his rival, he likely excelled like naruto did with Sasuke for his rival. Jiraiya could have been 4th, but like Jiraiya said himself, he's too free spirited although he has the will of fire too, but at that time, Minato was a younger, better all round choice. The theme is to pass it to the younger, up and coming generation. the Kings. Minato becoming Hokage made Jiraiya more proud than if he had done it. "a great master trains a great student", or something like that. Anybody and everybody knew Jiraiya was Hokage material. He just never really wanted the chain and ball title, but he still acted as a Hokage would and beyond for Konoha. Jiraiaya was like, How bout i just train u 2 generations of Hokages and find one for u? The only Manga fact is that Minato was 4th, and Saruto always hoped Orochu would be the one he could pass it on to, and that Jiraiya was 5th.

When Jiraiya was offered the position, they told him that they had just talked it over and decided on him, who just happened to be the only Sannin whose whereabouts where known at the time. Jiraya basically said Tsunade is a Sannin too, ima go findher. The elder didnt need to go retalk anything over like they did to choose Jiraiya. She just said ok. If Jiraiya was always on the 3rd's mind, no meeting to decide anything would have needed to take place. Sarutobi died but he already made it clear that Shikamaru was to become chunnin. Jiraiya was never in the runup, but always a given, likely by anyone that knew him. to be one of the "great 3" at 25-30,40,50 years old means u are Hokage material and level. great students are supposed to surpass the teacher as the new generation. Minato did that to Jiraiya still Jiraiya always hokage material just never an option until 5th according to the manga. Like u say, it's manga fact its cannon
Tsunade is talking kind, praising words to Jiraiya. She Drunk, horny, thinking bout how Jiraiya has always been there for her and just really realizing she has feelings for him. Just words proven to be wrong by manga fact. It's just the liquor talking Myth. Dont listen to it.

Leaf ninja isn't always accurate since they post non cannon stuff as well...

Im only going off by what i read jiraiya was chosen twice as a hokage once by sarutobi where he declined and went after orochimaru as stated.. im not making shit up..

and once where the advisors as well as others from "that" meeting chose him as the fifth...

There's really nothing to argue... yes it was said that sarutobi wanted oro at one point but tsunade xplains his true choice was always jiraiya...

lmfaoo @liquiorrr

<DaNTe>
05-27-2009, 07:55 PM
@Dante - Jiraiya was able to successfully take out 3 bodies before they came back his genjutsu alone handles Multiple Bodies, add kakashi's Kamui nd it gets worse for pain... Ur whole argument is weak since if all 6 were out jiraiya would kill more then 1 for good ;)...



His genjutsu? Last i checked it was performed by the frogs on his shoulders.

He probably will kill one of them for good. He still got raped by Pein.

Weak argument?

Myth
05-27-2009, 07:56 PM
His genjutsu? Last i checked it was performed by the frogs on his shoulders.

He probably will kill one of them for good. He still got raped by Pein.

Weak argument?

who gives a shit if pain got lucky he was able to summons the other bodies before the genjutsu hit otherwise he'd be dead nd like i said kakashi and choji's were enough to more then bother pain jiraiya and kakashi would stomp his ass.

superninja
05-27-2009, 08:43 PM
@ shikamaru + kakashi vs Deva
shikamaru + kakashi loses this. one on one, kakashi loses. he fought with the akimichi and fodder ninja, he loses. yes shikamaru can restrict the movement of deva, but deva can cast shinra tensei and tensho banin without lifting a finger to push and pull shikamaru and force him to release the jutsu and grab a hold of something to avoid sure death. SM Naruto used KB henge'd into a hundred or so rocks to throw rasengans to Deva and he swiped them all, how would u think Shikamaru + Kakashi would fare? Deva Pain 9-1 Shikamaru + Kakashi. Deva wins.

I gave Shikamaru and Kakashi an advantage of knowing Deva's power, so in my mind that puts them above Deva realm. Shikamaru doesn't need to be in Deva's line of sight to catch him with the shadow. Shika can bend the shadow around the corner while he is staying protected from the gravity blast. They would need a good plan though, and if they fail and Deva gets too close and blasts them, they would lose badly.

Xicidal
05-28-2009, 01:51 PM
lets not forget that kakashi could have use is MS justsu on pain but instead used it to save choji.

I think you could argue that kakashi MS justsu could simple suck up the Chibuki tensei

if pain use massive shinra tensei and fails to kill ether one he is pretty much screwed. If Jairya were in hermit mode he could endure it. Plus the move isn't instant. He needs to deactivate all the other realms, plus it covers a wide area and it certainly doesn't destroy it all at once.
Plus the 5th and there group survived, i bet kahashi and J man could as well.
I say he is pretty much screwed if he use that move.

I'm pretty sure Jairya could destroy all the realms at once with frog song and the other move he used in combination. Even if it was the frogs that did the song they are still his summons. Summons are a ninja tool.

I give this battle to kakashi and Jairya.

I give the battle of shikamaru and Kakashi it as well. They knwo the details, they will defaintly win. Especially if pain his looking for naruto still. He wont use any of his epic moves. Don't forget that kakashi had serveal chances to take pain out. If it wern't for hell realm interfering in one instances and him choosing to save choji in another pain would ahve been done.

kiba vs kankuro post time skip in a forest.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-28-2009, 05:47 PM
Kiba vs Kankuro PTS in the forest?

As I remember kankuro can only use one puppet at a time and uses poison. So, kankuro could hide and attack kiba like he did against shino. But, with Akas and Kibas sense of smell hiding is going to be impossible which puts kankuro at a disadvantage. And with kibas greater speed he could outmaneuver kankuro or his puppet as well probably.

Id say Kiba beats kankuro, but him and aka die from getting hit with some poison while closing the gap so its a draw.

lamps123
05-28-2009, 05:51 PM
Kiba vs Kankuro PTS in the forest?

As I remember kankuro can only use one puppet at a time and uses poison. So, kankuro could hide and attack kiba like he did against shino. But, with Akas and Kibas sense of smell hiding is going to be impossible which puts kankuro at a disadvantage. And with kibas greater speed he could outmaneuver kankuro or his puppet as well probably.

Id say Kiba beats kankuro, but him and aka die from getting hit with some poison while closing the gap so its a draw.
you cant run forever you know.
the probability of at least one needle scrap is about 0.9

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-28-2009, 06:05 PM
you cant run forever you know.
the probability of at least one needle scrap is about 0.9

I know which is why they died from getting poisoned making it a draw.


Sarutobi vs Animal, HG and human realm?

lamps123
05-28-2009, 06:35 PM
I know which is why they died from getting poisoned making it a draw.


Sarutobi vs Animal, HG and human realm?
oh sorry didnt finish reading your post lol

saru in his prime wins

TheFuTuR3
05-28-2009, 06:57 PM
dont care if u said it already or not...

kyuubi/hermit mode naruto vs. mangekyou sharingan sasuke

the epic battle we all know is coming

n so what if my spelling is off i've seen ppl on here put where when they meant what

Dagoro
05-28-2009, 07:04 PM
Naruto vs Sasuke has been done to death, and the debates always ends up in the same place.

Sasuketards: Sasuke rapes Naruto with genjutsu.

Narutotards: Sage Naruto 1 pannels Sasuke with frog katas.

Best to wait for the fight to happen.

Myth
05-28-2009, 07:09 PM
Sarutobi in his old age would murder human and hungry ghost... he can blow off they're legs like he did with the zombies.....

Here's a cool fight...

Neji's Kaiten vs Sasuke lighting which can cut through anything roflll

Place - Kimi vs Garra field
Specials - Neji can throw KY-JELLY in the middle of sasuke's awesome cutting lighting..

Dagoro
05-28-2009, 07:11 PM
Neji's Kaiten vs Sasuke lighting which can cut through anything roflll

I don't know. Neji's kaiten can deflect FRS, stop Bijuu chakra blast and Sasuke's lightning can cut through chakra strings.

I say both are too powerful and awesome to declare a clear winner.

Myth
05-28-2009, 07:27 PM
I don't know. Neji's kaiten can deflect FRS, stop Bijuu chakra blast and Sasuke's lightning can cut through chakra strings.

I say both are too powerful and awesome to declare a clear winner.

but neji can throw ky-jelly im sure it can mess with sasuke's sick lighting.

superninja
05-28-2009, 08:17 PM
Kiba vs Kankuro in the forest, Kankuro can't hide coz Kiba and Akamaru can smell him. On the other hand Kiba and Akamaru would probably get scratched coz they charge into their enemies so Kankuro wins.

Sarutobi vs Animal, HG and human realm
Sarutobi loses this, Animal realm can spawn too many summons, HG and Human realm are good in taijutsu so old Sarutobi would lose. Young Sarutobi I don't know, but he would have to be pretty inspired to win.

Myth
05-28-2009, 08:30 PM
Kiba vs Kankuro in the forest, Kankuro can't hide coz Kiba and Akamaru can smell him. On the other hand Kiba and Akamaru would probably get scratched coz they charge into their enemies so Kankuro wins.

Sarutobi vs Animal, HG and human realm
Sarutobi loses this, Animal realm can spawn too many summons, HG and Human realm are good in taijutsu so old Sarutobi would lose. Young Sarutobi I don't know, but he would have to be pretty inspired to win.

r u retarded ghost realm is weak against taijutsu wtf kind of manga r u reading....

superninja
05-28-2009, 09:02 PM
r u retarded ghost realm is weak against taijutsu wtf kind of manga r u reading....

HG is vulnerable to taijutsu (coz he absorbs ninjutsu so a physical attack is the best way against him) but he is not weak in using taijutsu. HG dodged Kiba's attack and he also dodged a direct punch from sage Naruto.

Myth
05-28-2009, 09:15 PM
HG is vulnerable to taijutsu (coz he absorbs ninjutsu so a physical attack is the best way against him) but he is not weak in using taijutsu. HG dodged Kiba's attack and he also dodged a direct punch from sage Naruto.

not really he jumoped away from Kiba which is why it was said "he's scared of close combat" ouchh that had to hurt...

he didn't dodge anything numb nuts
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/427/13/

he used the dead body as a shield and jumped up after and as it said "he doesn't like physical attacks" meaning he sucks in taijutsu..

He dodged naruto's punch not really he just moved his head barely n still got flattened.

TheSixthHokage
05-28-2009, 10:30 PM
Dude Myth chill out with the insults, holy tap dancing Christ.

How about Asuma versus Yamato?

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-28-2009, 10:32 PM
New fight!

Myth vs Mibs?

Myth gets raped again runs like a puss as usual.

Myth vs Madness?

Myth just runs because hes tired of being rape pwned.

Lol, if only you were as smart as naruto Myth. Maybe then you would know when to shut up and quit being aflamming fairy. No offense, lol!

BOT: Sarutobi in his prime still cant handel all of animal realms summons so IMO the realms win.

<DaNTe>
05-28-2009, 10:39 PM
New fight!

Myth vs Mibs?

Myth gets raped again runs like a puss as usual.

Myth vs Madness?

Myth just runs because hes tired of being rape pwned.

Lol, if only you were as smart as naruto Myth. Maybe then you would know when to shut up and quit being aflamming fairy. No offense, lol!

BOT: Sarutobi in his prime still cant handel all of animal realms summons so IMO the realms win.

Someone had to tell this arrogant bastard. xD

Dude Myth chill out with the insults, holy tap dancing Christ.

How about Asuma versus Yamato?

Yamato wins for me. Simply because of his bloodline.

Myth
05-28-2009, 10:40 PM
New fight!

Myth vs Mibs?

Myth gets raped again runs like a puss as usual.

Myth vs Madness?

Myth just runs because hes tired of being rape pwned.

Lol, if only you were as smart as naruto Myth. Maybe then you would know when to shut up and quit being aflamming fairy. No offense, lol!

BOT: Sarutobi in his prime still cant handel all of animal realms summons so IMO the realms win.

Jelly its not funny when u do it cause i already did it first numb nuts. runs where lol i trolled the spam zone and got tired need a break from tearing ur shit down here thats all.. n fact remains i'd fight any of em if they when they come down to ny...

@Hokage It gets irritating when morons can't seem to read right and miss easy points...

Sarutobi prime was god of ninja he'd rip those realms even in his old self.. the same way he blew up those zombies.

@Dante Kyf is the most made fun of person on this forum he isn't telling anything to anyone lmaoo... check the naruto section u'll see im right... quit thanking people for posting wrong things ur not cool..

<DaNTe>
05-28-2009, 10:48 PM
Jelly its not funny when u do it cause i already did it first numb nuts. runs where lol i trolled the spam zone and got tired need a break from tearing ur shit down here thats all.. n fact remains i'd fight any of em if they when they come down to ny...

@Hokage It gets irritating when morons can't seem to read right and miss easy points...

Sarutobi prime was god of ninja he'd rip those realms even in his old self.. the same way he blew up those zombies.

@Dante Kyf is the most made fun of person on this forum he isn't telling anything to anyone lmaoo... check the naruto section u'll see im right... quit thanking people for posting wrong things ur not cool..

Sure sure. Keep telling yourself that. Your still an arrogant bastard. You stink.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-28-2009, 10:49 PM
Jelly its not funny when u do it cause i already did it first numb nuts. runs where lol i trolled the spam zone and got tired need a break from tearing ur shit down here thats all.. n fact remains i'd fight any of em if they when they come down to ny...

@Hokage It gets irritating when morons can't seem to read right and miss easy points...

Sarutobi prime was god of ninja he'd rip those realms even in his old self.. the same way he blew up those zombies.

@Dante Kyf is the most made fun of person on this forum he isn't telling anything to anyone lmaoo... check the naruto section u'll see im right... quit thanking people for posting wrong things ur not cool..

1. No its funny because you start shit and I finish it like what Mibs and Madness did to you in the spam zone, lol.

2. Sarutobi can be called buddha of taijutsu for all i care because names or reps wont stop saru from getting his ass handed to him by the pain realms.

3. What can I say, its just not popular to like sasuke more than naruto in this forum.

Myth
05-28-2009, 10:49 PM
Sure sure. Keep telling yourself that. Your still an arrogant bastard. You stink.

I don't need to tell myself anything i can post proof from this very thread starting at page 200 something lol or another thread...

Lol I stink... its ok I'll live through that insult..

@KYF ROFLLL correction u start n get finished by the entire naruto section... u do realize not once has anyone ever agreed with what u said in a debate.. its not cause they don't like u its cause u don't post anything normal... the sad part is u think ur posting evidence and facts but really u aren't. I mean u know u suck when newbs make fun of u who haven't even seen any of ur legendary facts filled posts.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-28-2009, 11:05 PM
I don't need to tell myself anything i can post proof from this very thread starting at page 200 something lol or another thread...

Lol I stink... its ok I'll live through that insult..

@KYF ROFLLL correction u start n get finished by the entire naruto section... u do realize not once has anyone ever agreed with what u said in a debate.. its not cause they don't like u its cause u don't post anything normal... the sad part is u think ur posting evidence and facts but really u aren't. I mean u know u suck when newbs make fun of u who haven't even seen any of ur legendary facts filled posts.

I know this! I dont post naruto overglorifying ass kissary while I admit I fan sasuke which isnt normal. Although I ignore some stuff "I pick my battles", Im still going to respond to pointless insults I get for not conforming to the popular oppinion.

LMAO! Myth, your facts are just your reatartedly Bias oppinion feuled by pure all natural fail.

BOT: Sarutobi vs just deva realm, no Chibaku tensai.

Myth
05-28-2009, 11:08 PM
I know this! I dont post naruto overglorifying ass kissary while I admit I fan sasuke which isnt normal. Although I ignore some stuff "I pick my battles", Im still going to respond to pointless insults I get for not conforming to the popular oppinion.

LMAO! Myth, your facts are just your reatartedly Bias oppinion feuled by pure all natural fail.

BOT: Sarutobi vs just deva realm, no Chibaku tensai.


giant shinera tensei pain wins.

@the rest u'll cont being made fun of for the remainder of ur time here... thats a promise

TheSixthHokage
05-28-2009, 11:51 PM
Someone had to tell this arrogant bastard. xD



Yamato wins for me. Simply because of his bloodline.

I am not a huge fan of his Wood Element, it seems sketchy. It's not half as legendary as the First's (I assume). I'd go with Asuma though, he's a Jounin on his own right and the son of the Third. I really don't see him being taken down by Wood Element, particularly considering he has a (secondary) fire affinity.

TheSixthHokage
05-28-2009, 11:55 PM
Sarutobi in his prime was one of the best shinobi ever to have lived (Kishimoto in his 2008 interview said the Third and Fourth were both the strongest deceased ninja).. he could take on as many Jiraiya I would assume or even more. But if he went against all 6, he'd be dead I think, just like his pupil.

Myth, KYF, Dante, etc... guys, stop with the gay name-calling seriously. I am not blaming any of you guys specifically but seriously, calm down it's a forum. Go jerk off to relieve stress, lol.

Myth
05-28-2009, 11:56 PM
Sarutobi in his prime was one of the best shinobi ever to have lived (Kishimoto in his 2008 interview said the Third and Fourth were both the strongest deceased ninja).. he could take on as many Jiraiya I would assume or even more. But if he went against all 6, he'd be dead I think, just like his pupil.

Myth, KYF, Dante, etc... guys, stop with the gay name-calling seriously. I am not blaming any of you guys specifically but seriously, calm down it's a forum. Go jerk off to relieve stress, lol.

that interview was a fake one made as an April fools jokes on manga helpers....

Myth
05-29-2009, 12:00 AM
"Well, I just got my March issue of Shonen Jump and was delighted to find a new interview with our favorite manga author, Kishimoto.
I realize not everyone gets this magazine, and would not get to see it, so I thought I'd post a transcript here. Since Kishimoto was in hurry, there couldn't be too many questions asked.

------------------------------------------------------------

SJ = Shonen Jump
MK = Masashi Kishimoto

SJ: There's many rumours regarding Madara being the absolute final villain. Is this true?

MK: Madara being the final villain is yet to be seen and I can't let that information out just yet. But he will play a big part as a villain, that's for sure.

SJ: Now that it's officially known that Yondaime is Naruto's father, will you show more of Minato?

MK: Yes, definitly. I actually wanted to reveal more about Yondaime earlier, but other characters were in development and some fights still had to be dealt with.

SJ: While we're at it... could you please tell us if Minato was the strongest shinobi that ever lived?

MK: Hmmm, it's a tricky question. As far as dead shinobis goes, then yes, he's the strongest. I'd say that Sandaime shares the number one spot with him. As far as living shinobis goes... well, without going into many details I'd have to say no. There's a couple of shinobis whose stronger than him.

SJ: Now that Itachi seems to be dead, what is Kisame going to do now?

MK: Kisame has always come off as a sidevillain whose only purpose is to travel along Itachi. But to my surprise, Kisame has gone from an unpopular character to someone whose more popular than Deidara after the Gai-fight. I won't say too much, but Kisame is a character that wont die anytime soon. I will definitly develop on his character more and possibly make him...

SJ: Make him what?

MK: It's a surprise."


this is a fake interview posted on manga helpers as an april fools joke... its been discussed here as well... before i was a member

TheSixthHokage
05-29-2009, 12:01 AM
this is a fake interview posted on manga helpers as an april fools joke... its been discussed here as well... before i was a member

Maybe I wasn't a member then, sorry. Seemed pretty realistic to me, as all the answers were quite logical.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
05-29-2009, 12:02 AM
"Well, I just got my March issue of Shonen Jump and was delighted to find a new interview with our favorite manga author, Kishimoto.
I realize not everyone gets this magazine, and would not get to see it, so I thought I'd post a transcript here. Since Kishimoto was in hurry, there couldn't be too many questions asked.

------------------------------------------------------------

SJ = Shonen Jump
MK = Masashi Kishimoto

SJ: There's many rumours regarding Madara being the absolute final villain. Is this true?

MK: Madara being the final villain is yet to be seen and I can't let that information out just yet. But he will play a big part as a villain, that's for sure.

SJ: Now that it's officially known that Yondaime is Naruto's father, will you show more of Minato?

MK: Yes, definitly. I actually wanted to reveal more about Yondaime earlier, but other characters were in development and some fights still had to be dealt with.

SJ: While we're at it... could you please tell us if Minato was the strongest shinobi that ever lived?

MK: Hmmm, it's a tricky question. As far as dead shinobis goes, then yes, he's the strongest. I'd say that Sandaime shares the number one spot with him. As far as living shinobis goes... well, without going into many details I'd have to say no. There's a couple of shinobis whose stronger than him.

SJ: Now that Itachi seems to be dead, what is Kisame going to do now?

MK: Kisame has always come off as a sidevillain whose only purpose is to travel along Itachi. But to my surprise, Kisame has gone from an unpopular character to someone whose more popular than Deidara after the Gai-fight. I won't say too much, but Kisame is a character that wont die anytime soon. I will definitly develop on his character more and possibly make him...

SJ: Make him what?

MK: It's a surprise."

Seems pretty genuine to me. Regardless, the Third was one of the best shinobi ever.

Is this fake or real?

Myth
05-29-2009, 12:02 AM
Maybe I wasn't a member then, sorry. Seemed pretty realistic to me, as all the answers were quite logical.

yes they were but this was made on april 1, 2008 as a joke on MH.. do us all a favor and delete that post before a bunch of clueless people start to rant over this... no kyf its old nd fake..

Silverblade
05-29-2009, 12:04 AM
That interview is fake. It made Minato haters crack a smile and feel great for about 2 hours.

Sarutobi v. Killerbee. LMAO

Vengeance
05-29-2009, 02:18 PM
Naruto (current) vs. Team Hyuuga (Hiashi, Neji, & Hinata)
Naruto wins this easily. When all 3 rush him Naruto would summon Bunta to gain some distance & will just sit on bunta's head gathering Sage chakra. By the time team Hyuuga can get on top of Bunta to strike at Naruto it would be to late for them. With Naruto's chakra sensing abilities, superior speed, & frog kata's he'll be able to take these 3 down in hand to hand with one hit a piece. Hyuuga's suck balls!!!!

Sasuke (current) vs. Team Hyuuga (Hiashi, Neji, & Hinata)
Sasuke wins this easily. With the ability to see chakra & predict muscle movement Sasuke would be able to easily avoid direct attacks to his chakra network. The first Hyugua to move in will fall by Nagashi. When the other two jump back in shock Sasuke will finish the fallen Hyuuga with Senbon. As the left over Hyuuga try to do something one will be impaled by the awesome speed & strength of Eisou. Once impaled Sasuke will expand the jutsu inside of that Hyuuga in the same method used against the Itachi clone. When there's only one Hyuuga left Sasuke will blink for the win. Hyuuga's suck balls!!!

Dagoro
05-29-2009, 02:23 PM
Naruto (current) vs. Team Hyuuga (Hiashi, Neji, & Hinata)

Naruto takes his shirt off, Hinata faints. Thats 1 down right there. He goes Kn2 and proceeds to rape neji and Hiashi, no Sage mode needed. On a serious note, Taijutsu only people are not good against a ninjutsu spammer like Naruto. Naruto stomps. ( not Hinata though, he makes sweet love to her )


Sasuke (current) vs. Team Hyuuga (Hiashi, Neji, & Hinata)

MS jutsu , Chidori nagashi... you pick the tech, the Hyugas die.

HinataFanX
05-29-2009, 07:47 PM
Hyuugas rock, but against those two....well, there's really noone from the original series who can fully beat them.

Dagoro
05-29-2009, 07:52 PM
Base Jiraya vs Team Hyuga ( Hiashi, Hinata and Neji ).

Location: Chunin arena
restrictions: No summons for Jiraya or HM. Anything else is green lighted.
State of mind: Blood lusted
Starting distance: 10 m

superninja
05-29-2009, 08:35 PM
Base Jiraya vs Team Hyuga ( Hiashi, Hinata and Neji ).

Location: Chunin arena
restrictions: No summons for Jiraya or HM. Anything else is green lighted.
State of mind: Blood lusted
Starting distance: 10 m

Jiraiya without summons and without his hermit mode. Team Hyuga could win against him. Hinata would die first in that fight.