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TheSixthHokage
04-02-2010, 09:18 AM
Raikage versus Deidera.

Location: Forest (where Sasuke and Deidera fought)

Distance: 100 m

Both are calm (well Raikage's less angry than usual).

superninja
04-02-2010, 11:56 AM
Raikage versus Deidera.

Location: Forest (where Sasuke and Deidera fought)

Distance: 100 m

Both are calm (well Raikage's less angry than usual).

This depends on whether raikages lightning chakra cloak would disable Deidara's bombs. It probably would so Deidara can't use his microbombs on raikage to win. What is left is Deidara's mega explosion so that might finish raikage.
Raikage 8 - Deidara 2

TheSixthHokage
04-02-2010, 12:32 PM
This depends on whether raikages lightning chakra cloak would disable Deidara's bombs. It probably would so Deidara can't use his microbombs on raikage to win. What is left is Deidara's mega explosion so that might finish raikage.
Raikage 8 - Deidara 2

Without Tobi, Deidera wouldn't have underground bombs, furthermore without Sharingan, Raikage would have no way of detecting them or knowing that they are Earth-element. Essentially you are giving Raikage the huge information advantage Sasuke had, without the tools that made it possible. Raikage is NOT an analytical fighter; he crushes through obstacles.

Raikage's speed is his asset here, if he can blitz Deidera before he can do any of his signature moves, he can win it, but even then... Sasuke had a speed advantage over Deidera, but couldn't win it that way. It took much more. I am giving it to Deidera narrowly. Raikage's been really, really exaggerated.

Wolverine
04-02-2010, 01:38 PM
It doesn't matter whether the Raikage knows that Deidera's bombs are Earth element or not, because they still will be of the Earth element. Raikage activates his Lightning cloak thr moment the fight starts and that would negate Deidera's micro bombs. Plus, like you said, Deidera doesn't have Tobi to lay his bombs so that is out. The only option Deidera has is to blo himself up which would technically make it a draw. So overall, I would give this fight to the Raikage simply because he has all thr necessary tools to beat an Earth user and is probably an even worse opponent for Deidera than Sasuke is.

stubborn_d0nkey
04-02-2010, 01:49 PM
Without Tobi, Deidera wouldn't have underground bombs, furthermore without Sharingan, Raikage would have no way of detecting them or knowing that they are Earth-element. Essentially you are giving Raikage the huge information advantage Sasuke had, without the tools that made it possible. Raikage is NOT an analytical fighter; he crushes through obstacles.

Raikage's speed is his asset here, if he can blitz Deidera before he can do any of his signature moves, he can win it, but even then... Sasuke had a speed advantage over Deidera, but couldn't win it that way. It took much more. I am giving it to Deidera narrowly. Raikage's been really, really exaggerated.

actually, he never said that raikage would figure out that its earth. He said that the cloak could disarm the bombs. We have seen that raikage in battle has his cloak on. So it doesn't really matter that much if he knows if its earth or not, only if the cloak will protect him since he always has it on.

superninja
04-02-2010, 01:51 PM
Without Tobi, Deidera wouldn't have underground bombs, furthermore without Sharingan, Raikage would have no way of detecting them or knowing that they are Earth-element. Essentially you are giving Raikage the huge information advantage Sasuke had, without the tools that made it possible. Raikage is NOT an analytical fighter; he crushes through obstacles.

Raikage's speed is his asset here, if he can blitz Deidera before he can do any of his signature moves, he can win it, but even then... Sasuke had a speed advantage over Deidera, but couldn't win it that way. It took much more. I am giving it to Deidera narrowly. Raikage's been really, really exaggerated.

Well I am not saying raikage would diffuse Deidara's bombs on purpose lol. It's just that raikage creates a cloak of lightning around him that might diffuse Deidara's microbombs if we are going to be consistent with the story. So raikage has a huge advantage at the start because he emits electricity all around his body. He wouldn't plan much, he would just dodge the smaller bombs and charge into Deidara. Then Dei would prob manage to create a clay bunshin and escape for a while. Then the raikage would break through the clay bunshin while Deidara flies away on the clay bird and activates the bunshin to explode. Dei would then say something like "gotchya" but raikage would appear right besides him in the air and almost get him with his fist. Dei would make a maneuver in air to dodge.
Then Deidara would analyze and conclude that raikage has insane speed.
Then Deidara would probably fly higher and bomb the area but raikage would evade the explosions and run after Deidara.
Raikage: "Come down you coward!"
Deidara (with his retarded face): "No way you bastard, hmmm!"
Then Dei would maybe try his microbombs or a big scale explosion, I think a big scale explosion might take raikage out so I guess Deidara has a chance to win, I'm changing it to 50-50.

The Special One
04-02-2010, 03:59 PM
I say Deidara wins if he can drop C3 on top of the Raikage. Then again, Deidara would win any match if he could do such a thing in every match up; after all, C3 has enough power to blow up an entire shinobi village... The moment the fight starts, Deidara has to create an air born clay creature and escape into the air before Raikage rips his throat out (which I doubt can happen, as Deidara probably isn't that fast to escape into the air). But why Deidara didn't drop C3 on top of Sasuke is another story. If the fight starts on the ground, Raikage wins. If Deidara never gives Raikage a hope of catching him, Deidara wins. But Deidara would any match up if he stayed in the air at all times and just dropped C3... So to play it fair, he has to start on the ground (which means, Raikage would most likely win, because he's not letting Deidara escape).

superninja
04-03-2010, 06:57 AM
I say Deidara wins if he can drop C3 on top of the Raikage. Then again, Deidara would win any match if he could do such a thing in every match up; after all, C3 has enough power to blow up an entire shinobi village...

That is the case with Deidara, in theory he could just drop that bomb that he tried to destroy the sand village with, and win. He didn't do it against Sasuke because ....... plot.

Another thing is that raikage has no range attacks (probably), so if Deidara is in the air he is pretty safe.

arctic_knight
04-03-2010, 01:37 PM
That is the case with Deidara, in theory he could just drop that bomb that he tried to destroy the sand village with, and win. He didn't do it against Sasuke because.......plot.

-sasuke could have just used another snake summon to protect him, he didnt win because of plot, he won cause every jutsu he has trumps deidara's. Lightning>Earth

and for someone who claims to have trained his eye (Eye Enhancement) to see through the Sharingan genjutsu, he always seemed to fall for saskue's genjutsu


-i dont think raikage can lay a finger on deidara, if deidara just stays in the air out of raikage reach he should be safe. as far as we know raikage is only a close quarters fighter with no long range attacks. he could try jumping at deidara, but deidara should be able to evade with ease.

i see this fight in ending in a draw, cause raikage cant touch deidara if he's flying high up in the air, and raikage could just blitz all of deidara bombs all day long

superninja
04-03-2010, 01:54 PM
Maybe I shouldn't have called plot because Sasuke cs lvl 2 has wings so Deidara's flying advantage should have been nullified by that, but Kishimoto made it so that Sasuke loses one wing at the start of the fight so I guess that was some plot advantage for Deidara there (Kishimoto wanted to show Sasuke can win even though Deidara was in air).
But I was bothered by the fact Deidara even came close to Sasuke at all when he could have dropped the big bomb from 1000 meters of height and end it that way or at least try to do that.

I'll post the next fight that is - Tsunade vs god realm of Pein and robot Pein (Demon realm)
The location is the battlefield Konoha (Konoha with buildings little damaged from explosions)
Tsunade has full chakra and no knowledge of what the realms can do individually but she knows they share the vision and that each has one jutsu specialty.
Demon realm has only one rocket to shoot so to make it more fair.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
04-03-2010, 04:17 PM
Deidara vs the Raikage??

1. Rai blitzes dei before he can jump on a clay bird to get off the ground because tobis not there to take the first hit which allowed dei to get away from sasuke

2. If deidei gets in the air he will be safe for a short time. And since dei doesnt start his fights with C3 which is the only thing that could even hurt or wound the raikage in raiton armour. I see dei showing the raikage hes for real, rai goes supermode, dei loses sight of him, rai picks up a tree, waits for dei then hits a fucking home run. Either that or rai waits in a tree then ambushes dei when he gets close enough with his instaspeed.

C3 can be outrun if amaterasu couldnt catch him and C4 wont work because the raiton armour would nullify the mini bombs before he brethed them in.

Rai wins 9-1 IMO.

Thor
04-03-2010, 07:40 PM
Sasuke (the one that defeated Itachi)
Naruto Sage Mode (but no frogs)
Sakura (at the time she fought Sasori to avoid the retarded Sakura from the last chapters)

Vs

Pain with all Paths.


Pain does not know any tecnhiques from team 7 and team 7 does not know of the jutsus except that they share vision.

Objective for team 7 is not to kill Nagato, but to defeat the Paths
Objective for Pain is to kill everyone

Place an open field, they begin 200 meters away from each other.

Go.

Dagoro
04-03-2010, 07:57 PM
So Nagato with no holding back.........I wonder how that would turn out....(-_-)

Viczor6
04-04-2010, 05:51 AM
Sasuke (the one that defeated Itachi)

He f***ing planned his own death and Sasuke did not defeat him, you can say Itachi won cause Sasuke didn't find out about him until after his death. Cmon.... I just had to -..-

Thor
04-04-2010, 06:41 AM
He f***ing planned his own death and Sasuke did not defeat him, you can say Itachi won cause Sasuke didn't find out about him until after his death. Cmon.... I just had to -..-



Dude, i am just refering to the Sasuke that fought with Itachi, nothing else.

superninja
04-04-2010, 09:02 AM
Sasuke (the one that defeated Itachi)
Naruto Sage Mode (but no frogs)
Sakura (at the time she fought Sasori to avoid the retarded Sakura from the last chapters)

Vs

Pain with all Paths.


Pain does not know any tecnhiques from team 7 and team 7 does not know of the jutsus except that they share vision.

Objective for team 7 is not to kill Nagato, but to defeat the Paths
Objective for Pain is to kill everyone

Place an open field, they begin 200 meters away from each other.

Go.

Happy Easter everyone.

I give this to Naruto, Sasuke and Sakura.

Naruto would charge into the six of them, that would leave Sasuke to slash through the isolated paths on the periphery. Sakura could maybe smash with her chakra fist through them also, but she is not to go directly into battle since she lacks the taijutsu skill Sasuke and Naruto have.
I know that Pein can use the gravity to pull one of them in at the beginning of the fight, Naruto would charge right in if that happens one way or the other. Or Sasuke would use fire jutsu to help. Naruto and Sasuke can cover each other fast that way.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
04-04-2010, 07:31 PM
Sakura being useless gets naruto killed. Sasuke who still feels some sort of bond with naruto kills sakura for getting naruto killed. Then pain trys to kill sasuke, but tobi steps in.

Pain wins because no matter how strong any single member of a team is. The entire team is only as strong as its weakest link so they get slaughtered.

However, if it was sasuke preMS and SM naruto then I think they might have a chance since they work so well together.

TheSixthHokage
04-04-2010, 08:31 PM
^ You have a point. Pre-MS Sasuke and SM Naruto working together MIGHT be enough to kill a full out Pain.... maybe. I still kinda doubt it. I think that Naruto and Sasuke, at the point they are now, could kill Pain without dying, even full out (having EMS and Senjutsu), but I don't think any single character except perhaps Madara could stand up 1v1. At least so far.

Dagoro
04-04-2010, 08:38 PM
Come on peeps, this is pain with no restrictions and fighting to kill vs SM Naruto with no summons, CS Sasuke and Sakura.

Feats and arsenal wise Pain wins.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
04-04-2010, 08:47 PM
Come on peeps, this is pain with no restrictions and fighting to kill vs SM Naruto with no summons, CS Sasuke and Sakura.

Feats and arsenal wise Pain wins.

Oops! Didnt notice no summons for naruto so yea they die horribly without bosses and ma, pa's frog song genjutsu.

Then again, after pain finally beats sasuke Oros going to come out at full power so its actaully going to be more like naruto, sasuke, sakura then Oro vs pain so they still might be able to win IMO.

Dagoro
04-04-2010, 08:52 PM
If by Oro you mean Yamata no Ochi, I still don't see how that would make any difference. It is still a giant monster ( AKA big target ) non to less. We've all seen what Deva does to big monsters.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
04-04-2010, 09:17 PM
If by Oro you mean Yamata no Ochi, I still don't see how that would make any difference. It is still a giant monster ( AKA big target ) non to less. We've all seen what Deva does to big monsters.

Thats just it though. With the white snake power in hydra form deva should be able to ST that fucker all day but he will just henge/regenerate. Then when deva actaully decides to stab him, That paralysing vapor will come out and deva will be in trouble.

I mean lets not underestimate Oro because he got beat by the sword of totsuka which could beat the juubi with a single stab. And dont forget that once naruto runs out of chakra or sees sasuke or sakura get hurt hes going 6tails and up. SO it wll be Hydra oro and the kyuubi vs what little paths (probaly deva, HG realm) thats left.

Dagoro
04-04-2010, 09:37 PM
Itachi had the blade, Nagato has soul harvesting abilities with human realm and GM.

So Yamata no Ochi wouldn't be a big problem. Besides, Cerberus is pretty much Yamata no Ochi with a different shell.

Shrike
04-05-2010, 05:32 AM
Pain wins.
No MS for Sasuke, Naruto has no summons which is very important part of his arsenal, and Sakura can do nothing in battle vs Pain.

Edit : Sakura did one-shot that huge summon of Pain's. So maybe she isn't that useless. If she can take care of a summon or two, that's enough to buy some time. Still, with Sasuke and Naruto on this level, they can hardly do anything. No time to prepare Kirin. The only thing that gives them any chance is FRS.

x_majiqal_x
04-05-2010, 06:28 AM
Sannin vs Pain?

My bet's on the Sannin.

superninja
04-05-2010, 07:11 PM
Sannin vs Pain?

My bet's on the Sannin.

Definitely on the Sanin, I had a doubt seeing as Peins are strong when they are together but Sanin can tank the damage and counter anything Pein has IF they work together of course. That would mean that Oro has to cover his teammates back and that is not in his character completely. But in any case Sanins have a greater chance of winning because each can summon something big so they can counter Pein's big number of summons right at the start of the fight. Oro and Tsunade can tank a critical injury and Jiraiya in hermit mode is very strong offensively. Sanin 7 - Pein 3.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
04-05-2010, 07:36 PM
How about Kabuoro (with kabutos abilities plus Oro snake hax "healing, snakes, ect") using Edo Tensai with kakuzu, deidara, itachi and harishima. (edo zombies can use all there abilites)

Vs All six paths of pain in akatsuki hideout sakura fought sasaori in.

ask me anything
04-05-2010, 07:44 PM
If they didn't know about pains abilities then it would very hard to win. Pain would only know about J-man, so orochimaru and tsunades techs would be new to him as well.

One of them could try to punch human realm, just to get their soul sucked out. That would be a huge loss to the sannin. Giant summons would work to well against Pains summons. Manda could burrow underground to avoid Shinra Tensei, while Katsuyu gets blasted into 1000 mini slugs that just reform back into the giant slug. Frogs just get fucked by it. Katsuyu's acidic spit is highly underrated. That shit can melt rocks, though it could be absorbed by preta path. It might destroy a body or 2 in a surprise attack.

When they were young the sannin were unable to defeat Hanzo. They were still young and developing. At there prime they together probable would have won that fight. Pain did defeat Hanzo. So it's very hard to say who's stronger then who.

It could go either way But I have to go with the sannin. 6-4

Only because J-man was able to fight and defeat 3 of pains bodies, so I would assume Oro could handle 3 pains on his own. Tsuande just puts them over the top.

ask me anything
04-05-2010, 08:03 PM
How about Kabuoro (with kabutos abilities plus Oro snake hax "healing, snakes, ect") using Edo Tensai with kakuzu, deidara, itachi and harishima. (edo zombies can use all there abilites)

Vs All six paths of pain in akatsuki hideout sakura fought sasaori in.

Depends on how good itachi's vision is. If he has 100% perfect vision (like when he first unlocked MS), and has all his MS abilities as well (complete susanoo) then he's gonna be a beast. Him and hashirama together should be enough to give pain serious problems.

Also depends on whether or not deidara can spam C0 and keep reforming. If he can that would be serious trouble for pain. Though that could backfire on them is pain uses Shinra Tensei to knock the blast back on kabuoro, and company.

Human path is the only thing pain has that can destroy the summons. If he gets destroyed then Pain can't remove the souls. Naraka path could revive the human path. If both of them are destroyed them pain loses. In this situation Pain just get worn down by a endless fight.

Shrike
04-06-2010, 05:11 AM
Sannin vs Pain - Sannin

Would be a good fight. Pain could put up with most of the stuff they throw at him.

How about Kabuoro (with kabutos abilities plus Oro snake hax "healing, snakes, ect") using Edo Tensai with kakuzu, deidara, itachi and harishima. (edo zombies can use all there abilites)

Vs All six paths of pain in akatsuki hideout sakura fought sasaori in.

Kabuto stomps. Common, it's not even funny.

superninja
04-12-2010, 11:02 AM
How about Naruto with his current set of abilities vs Danzo with his sharingan arm, without Shisui's eye genjutsu?
Naruto starts in sage mode plus three clones, he can summon a big frog or two, no Ma and Pa frogs allowed. His sage mode lasts for two rasenshurikens, or 6 different types of attacks (rasengans or summoning), or one rasenshuriken plus 3 rasengans or summoning, or just 10 minutes if he doesn't use any jutsus.
GU!

TheSixthHokage
04-16-2010, 03:31 PM
I don't know if the Sannin could take on Pain and win without the necessary info, but considering Jiraiya basically discovered the truth as he died, it's definitely possible for them to have done it as a 3-person cell. God Realm is just too strong by himself. Naruto only won because of the context.

Widana14
04-16-2010, 10:12 PM
Sannin vs Pain

Well, Jiraiya could literally kill pain 4 times, so with Oro and his snakes, Tsunade and Katsuyu, the Sannin wins...


wait a minute...


The couldn't beat Hanzo though...


How old are the Sannins?

superninja
04-17-2010, 03:57 AM
How old are the Sannins?

I guess they are the age we last saw them if it's not specified. So around 50. They win, the only thing Pein has to win would be chibaku tensei (a small black hole he tried to capture 6 tails Naruto with) but to do that Pein has to disable all the other bodies. That is the only jutsu Pein has that could win him the fight.

gravu
04-17-2010, 06:37 AM
Ok who would win between sasuke and naruto ? :))

superninja
04-17-2010, 07:16 AM
Ok who would win between sasuke and naruto ? :))

Lol lets not go there.

Thor
04-17-2010, 10:31 AM
Ok who would win between sasuke and naruto ? :))

Do not open Pandoras box!

Wolverine
04-17-2010, 10:42 AM
Ok who would win between sasuke and naruto ? :))

Now that you've said that... how about we go for Izumo vs Kotetsu ??

freaz
04-17-2010, 12:51 PM
Might Gai & Rock Lee vs. Deidara

Restrictions:

Area: Chuunin preliminary stage. So deidara can't fly that much on his summonings.
Rock Lee & Gai can't use gates. They can use the primary lotus and such moves.
Deidara has unlimited supply of clay ( so just the clay, not unlimited chakra ).

superninja
04-18-2010, 03:34 AM
Now that you've said that... how about we go for Izumo vs Kotetsu ??

I didn't know these guys were Naruto characters so I checked it out on wikipedia. Now I know, so they both seem equal to me because they are always together. Not much of their abilities was shown, Izumo can do that syrup field that binds his opponent and Kotetsu can summon a big shell like mace to bash someone. So going by the logic Izumo wins since he can cover Kotetsu with his syrup.....that sounds gay right.....and bind him from moving.

Might Gai & Rock Lee vs. Deidara

Restrictions:

Area: Chuunin preliminary stage. So deidara can't fly that much on his summonings.
Rock Lee & Gai can't use gates. They can use the primary lotus and such moves.
Deidara has unlimited supply of clay ( so just the clay, not unlimited chakra ).

Lee and Gai win or it's a draw if Deidara uses a very big explosion. Explanation is, they are fighting in a closed area with a roof so Deidara can't fly very high, that gives Gai and Lee advantage since they are much faster than Deidara and can avoid his smaller bombs, plus Dei has to aim at two ppl at the same time. Gai can walk on walls so if Dei is flying near the roof Gai can just reach him by jumping and walking on walls and stuff. Deidara uses his hands to make bombs so he makes movements that Gai won't miss and when Gai reaches Dei he will go for a joint lock on Deidara's hands.

KillerNN
04-18-2010, 05:48 PM
Now that you've said that... how about we go for Izumo vs Kotetsu ??

Seems like a bitch fight to me.

KillerNN
04-19-2010, 12:37 PM
How about This:
Orochimaru vs. Naruto
Oro-Pre Suna-Invasion of Konoha
Naruto-Post Akatsuki Invasion Konoha

50 Feet apart.
Naruto in Sage Mode, Orochimaru at prime.
Kimimaro Battlefield.

Vengeance
04-19-2010, 04:33 PM
^Seems like a bitch fight to me. Of course Naruto is going to win.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
04-19-2010, 10:00 PM
^Seems like a bitch fight to me. Of course Naruto is going to win.

But Oro would have Edo Tensai, manda, hydra form ect.

So it would be Oro, harishima and tobirama vs naruto and clones while manda solos any frog summons (manda fought katsuya and bunta yet it still took tsunades interference to save theyre asses so hes enough).

Thats a fight naruto could lose. Especialy since golem harishima could supress the kyuubi once its used so no kyuubi help.

KillerNN
04-19-2010, 10:16 PM
Lol, I think Naruto would win too. But both are high power ninjas so it's not as bitchy. ^_^

gravu
04-20-2010, 02:27 AM
Lol lets not go there.


Let's go there :))))

ask me anything
04-20-2010, 11:20 AM
But Oro would have Edo Tensai, manda, hydra form ect.

So it would be Oro, harishima and tobirama vs naruto and clones while manda solos any frog summons (manda fought katsuya and bunta yet it still took tsunades interference to save theyre asses so hes enough).

Thats a fight naruto could lose. Especialy since golem harishima could supress the kyuubi once its used so no kyuubi help.


I gonna disagree with you here. For one thing Edo Tensei has to be prepared before time. Oro has to find some bodies to sacrifice, and prepare them in the coffins, and do whatever other rituals are needed. If Oro were preparing to fight naruto like he did against sarutobi then yeah, this could work. If he just bumped into naruto randomly then (like when they last fought) then no he wouldn't have time to prepare it, and would get owned.

Also SM naruto could easily summon multiple Boss frogs to counter manda. If he summoned Gamabunta, Gamaken, and Gamakichi that should be more then enough to beat manda. If not then he could summon Gamahiro to help as well and the sage toads would kick ass.

kluang
04-20-2010, 11:57 AM
Too many overpowered ninja fights......

Lets take Naruto mission, to the wave country where he faces Zabuza and Haku. And we know the outcome

Change the situation.

Instead of Team 7 go there, what happen if other rookie 9 teams went there and will they win too?

Including team gai and the sand trios and the sound trios

Okadagiri
04-20-2010, 02:19 PM
ok seriously? the 2nd hokage could create water from gathering it from the atmosphere, hes like the ultimate water ninja, wether kisame was a shark or not, if he cant touch the nidaime with the samehada kisame wouldn't last long against him

AOTKorby
04-20-2010, 03:08 PM
ok seriously? the 2nd hokage could create water from gathering it from the atmosphere, hes like the ultimate water ninja, wether kisame was a shark or not, if he cant touch the nidaime with the samehada kisame wouldn't last long against him

You do realize that Kisame has pulled MORE IMPRESSIVE Suiton without any water nearby than Tobirama has shown, right? I don't even see a fight in here anytime remotely recently that pits them against each other, but I know for sure that if those two are against each other then Tobirama's Suiton would never be what would save him. The only chance the dude has would have been Edo Tensei.

Vengeance
04-20-2010, 04:26 PM
ok seriously? the 2nd hokage could create water from gathering it from the atmosphere, hes like the ultimate water ninja, wether kisame was a shark or not, if he cant touch the nidaime with the samehada kisame wouldn't last long against him
You do realize that Tobirama needed to spit up water just like Kisame does before he was able to use suiton jutsu right? The water didn't appear out of thin air re-read the manga Tobirama spit it up just like Kisame does.

Too many overpowered ninja fights......

Lets take Naruto mission, to the wave country where he faces Zabuza and Haku. And we know the outcome

Change the situation.

Instead of Team 7 go there, what happen if other rookie 9 teams went there and will they win too?

Including team gai and the sand trios and the sound trios
lol ok...

Team 10(Ino/Shika/Chou & Asuma) vs Zabuza & Haku
Asuma is proficient in close range combat & uses a fuuton blade which would be able to cut Zabuza's head cleaver in half. Shikamaru, Chouji, & Ino have a much better team dynamic when compared to team 7. Once Haku is caught in Shika's shadow the fight would be over. Haku wouldn't even have enough time to use his ice mirrors. Team 10 wins.

Team 8(Shino, Kiba, Hinata, & Kurenai) vs Zabuza & Haku
With Kurenai's genjutsu ability can be used to subdue both opponents at the same time while Kiba & Shino finish the job. Also Kiba can track Zabuza in his hidden mist. Team 8 wins.

Team Guy vs Zabuza & Haku
Ummm yeah..... Lee or Neji can solo Haku while the rest takeout Zabuza. Team Guy wins.

These matches aren't really fair as it's 4 vs 2. Why not add in Zabuza's full 4 man squad in a fight? Zabuza, Haku,Gouzu, and Meizu vs the respective teams would make for much more interesting fights.

But Oro would have Edo Tensai

I don't factor in Edo if its not clearly stated in the match up how it'll be used. Theoretically speaking Orochimaru & Kabuto can kill anyone in the manga if they're allowed the proper edo summons. One could make an argument for Orochimaru to summon Jiraiya, Itachi, & Nagato just to mentally take Naruto off his game. Edo is a jutsu of preparation & really with the right preparation almost anyone could beat anyone. This was shown in the manga when a chunin(Shikamaru) was able to solo a member of Akatsuki(Hiden).

superninja
04-21-2010, 09:11 AM
Orochimaru in his prime vs Naruto in sage mode is a close call, if Naruto's sage mode has a time limit then Oro could win since he is hard to kill.

The only team from Konoha that could have killed Zabuza and Haku (besides team Kakashi) is team Gai.

The sand team (Gara, Kankuro, Temari and that guy) can win since Gara has the absolute defense.

The sound team would probably lose.

Explanation is that Zabuza uses the mist to assassinate and he is good with taijutsu. How is Kurenai going to cast her visual genjutsu if she can't see Zabuza and Zabuza can't see her? Zabuza wins. How is Asuma going to see Zabuza and fight him without getting a water clone or two beside him first? Zabuza wins.

The Special One
04-21-2010, 12:16 PM
Orochimaru in his prime vs Naruto in sage mode is a close call, if Naruto's sage mode has a time limit then Oro could win since he is hard to kill.

Well if he gets hit with a Rasen Shuriken then that's all she wrote. I do agree he's hard to kill otherwise though. But I think Sage Tech: Oodama Rasenan is also quite devastating. Orochimaru might get purged clean instead of being sliced in half, or being morally wounded. Sage Tech: Oodama Rasengan would probably obliterate someone, Sage Tech: Rasen Shuriken would grind and shred its victim into confetti.

superninja
04-21-2010, 02:21 PM
Well if he gets hit with a Rasen Shuriken then that's all she wrote. I do agree he's hard to kill otherwise though. But I think Sage Tech: Oodama Rasenan is also quite devastating. Orochimaru might get purged clean instead of being sliced in half, or being morally wounded. Sage Tech: Oodama Rasengan would probably obliterate someone, Sage Tech: Rasen Shuriken would grind and shred its victim into confetti.

If he gets hit, Naruto takes his time making the rasengan so Oro would see the tech before hand. Oro can change his body size so which part of his body will get destroyed if Oro extends his neck 20 meters into length? Oro will just spit a new body out or something. He can also use earth travel so he can escape like that from some attacks. Oro at his prime can use jutsus and handseals, not like against Sasuke or 4 tail Naruto where he didn't use any. And the final note is Naruto is not immune to poison and Oro has access to poison since he is the white snake that emits the poison, he can combine the poison with his wind jutsus to carry it to Naruto from afar.

The Special One
04-21-2010, 02:49 PM
I posted that in response to you saying that Orochimaru is impervious to damage.

I don't really see ground travel giving Orochimaru much of an edge if Naruto's already in Sage Mode. Since he can feel Orochimaru's presence, he knows when he's going to attack, or where he's going.

And the White Snake is not something Orochimaru can evoke so often. It's his body after his current vessel nears its limit. That poison only erupts if his White Snake's body is out in the open therefore, releasing the airborn substance. If the White Snake's poisonous gas was so usable, he'd have done that before turning himself into a large target that moves sluggishly. Basically, that gas is a last resort. It's also a slow acting paralysis, as it took until Sasuke defeated Orochimaru before it got him.

If Orochimaru relied on that against a close-ranged powerhouse like Naruto, he'd get obliterated as the White Snake way before Naruto succumbs to paralysis. Not to mention, there's nothing saying Naruto can't stand up to Orochimaru's jutsu with Sage Techniques. Rasengans are bigger (causes more destruction), and his taijutsu is strong.

Now, with Edo Tensei, Orochimaru would easily win, but that's too hax for many fights...

superninja
04-23-2010, 02:27 PM
Ok, so I have been posting two fights and no one replied lol. It was Tsunade vs God and Robot Pein (practically Tsunade instead of Kakashi, Chouji's dad and Choji). I think Tsunade with her full chakra could win because God realm would use the gravity to pull Tsunade to the Robot and try to cut her like he tried with Kakashi but Tsunade can heal a wound through her torso if she activates that seal on her forehead that heals her wounds instantly. Then Tsunade is close enough to use her devastating fist or leg chop that would annihilate Robot Pein and/or God realm. But God realm would probably manage to back down, still that is one Pein down right off the bat. That is why Tsunade can win imo. If God realm managed to back down he would use the gravity to push Tsunade from him since he doesn't want to go close range with Tsunade (he saw she can break stones with kicks). Tsunade would then summon the slug, she saw God pein's ability now, the ability to push and pull things from him so she would use the chakra to glue her feet to the ground and resist his next gravity attack. That is why Tsunade wins.
The other fight I posted was Danzo vs Naruto and it is similar to Oro vs Naruto, Naruto can win both fights but his opponents can resist a long time and can also win in theory if their attack lands.

akuryuken
04-23-2010, 09:42 PM
ok here is my fights
Naruto(evil one with sg & kyuubi 8 tails) vs Konoha village
Naruto(evil one with sg & kyuubi 8 tails) vs Sasuke(as when he fought danzo)
P.S. Naaruto evil wont hold back nothing he wants to kill everything in front of him

superninja
04-24-2010, 06:21 AM
ok here is my fights
Naruto(evil one with sg & kyuubi 8 tails) vs Konoha village
Naruto(evil one with sg & kyuubi 8 tails) vs Sasuke(as when he fought danzo)
P.S. Naaruto evil wont hold back nothing he wants to kill everything in front of him

I don't know if the evil Naruto would use sage mode, it kind of looks out of character for him to use since he is evil and that means he is using his hatred and egoism to fight which means he wouldn't have the patience to gather the natural energy. But on the other hand, he might since it would make him stronger so..

Evil Naruto vs Konoha would go like this, evil Naruto would cause chaos in his base mode and then he would power up the kyubi if he finds someone that can pose a challenge to him. If he goes 8 tails then he would probably be unstoppable. Yamato is the one that would have to suppress the kyubi so that Naruto can be killed, Kakashi probably has the seals Jiraiya made that can suppress the kyubi also. So if they combine they might suppress the kyubi (seals plus Yamato's ability). Konoha wins if they stop Naruto from transforming into 8 tails since that is probably too strong to suppress.

Evil Naruto vs Sasuke (instead of Sasuke vs Danzo) is Naruto 7 - Sasuke 3. Sasuke could win because he has Susano to protect him from all sides and if he hits Naruto with amateratsu it should be his win. Naruto has a lot of chakra so he can make a lot of clones to overwhelm Sasuke and attack him from all sides, the only question is how strategic would evil Naruto be, if he just charges at Susano and makes no plans then Sasuke can win. If evil Naruto transforms into kyubi then the question is what would happen if kyubi gets hit with amateratsu. Susano probably wouldn't tank a blast from kyubi (that is also a question), or Sasuke would wear himself down using Susano the entire fight, he was already going blind in that fight.

camer999
04-25-2010, 01:18 PM
How about this, we combine characters? Naruto+Kakashi ablilties vs. anyone(you can combine two characters as well).

superninja
04-25-2010, 04:07 PM
How about this, we combine characters? Naruto+Kakashi ablilties vs. anyone(you can combine two characters as well).

So Naruto and Kakashi fusion means mass clones with sharingans that can use kamui. That would be hard to beat, Itachi and Naruto fusion would maybe be stronger, mass clones that cast genjutsu that is hard to break. Naruto plus anyone would create a mega strong character, Naruto plus Shikamaru is mass clones that can cover large surface with their shadow jutsu.

I would like to see Haku and Itachi fusion, it would be Itachi with the ice mirrors that he could use to cast genjutsu.
Well in any case Kakashi and Naruto fusion would be strong because kamui can break any defense, but Itachi and Naruto fusion would be stronger imo because genjutsu costs less chakra.

camer999
04-25-2010, 09:53 PM
So Naruto and Kakashi fusion means mass clones with sharingans that can use kamui. That would be hard to beat, Itachi and Naruto fusion would maybe be stronger, mass clones that cast genjutsu that is hard to break. Naruto plus anyone would create a mega strong character, Naruto plus Shikamaru is mass clones that can cover large surface with their shadow jutsu.

I would like to see Haku and Itachi fusion, it would be Itachi with the ice mirrors that he could use to cast genjutsu.
Well in any case Kakashi and Naruto fusion would be strong because kamui can break any defense, but Itachi and Naruto fusion would be stronger imo because genjutsu costs less chakra.
I figured naruto+kakashi would be the perfect match...Kakashi's brains, speed, sharingan and 1,000+ jutsu. With naruto's physical strength, massive amounts of chakra, etc. That is also why I think if kishi gave kakashi alot of chakra, he would be overpowered. Also, are you saying raikage+naruto would make a dig difference or KB for that matter? It wouldn't do anything IMO.

superninja
04-26-2010, 06:08 AM
I figured naruto+kakashi would be the perfect match...Kakashi's brains, speed, sharingan and 1,000+ jutsu. With naruto's physical strength, massive amounts of chakra, etc. That is also why I think if kishi gave kakashi alot of chakra, he would be overpowered. Also, are you saying raikage+naruto would make a dig difference or KB for that matter? It wouldn't do anything IMO.

I thought about it and raikage and Naruto fusion would actually be pretty strong, it would be sage mode plus clones plus lightning armor. Sage mode would make raiNaruto strong, lightning armor fast, he would be impossible to beat.
Killerbee and Naruto, that maybe wouldn't make much difference unless kyubi and 8 tails would merge also into a lot of chakra or something.

KillerNN
04-26-2010, 09:56 PM
Evil Naruto vs Konoha
Naruto 7-Konoha 3
With Jiraiya and Orochimaru gone,some of the strongest ninja are as follows:
Kakashi,Gai,Tsunade,Lee,Shino,Ebisu,Neji ,Shikamaru, and [even though she is annoying] Sakura.
Yamato could not suppress Naruto since the necklace broke. Naruto in base mode could cause a lot of damage,Sage Mode could take on some of the strongest ninja I named, and 8 tailed would just..merc the village since nothing could be done.

Evil Naruto vs Sasuke [Danzo fight]
Naruto 6 - Sasuke 4
I believe it would be an almost even match. If Naruto could like KB keep his tails but contain his form, his chakra would protect him from Amaterasu and burn instead, but replenish.[assumption] Genjutsu wouldn't work on him with the Kyuubi's assistance. We really don't know if Susano'o would pierce his chakra/skin so we can't calculate it's damage. Susano'o would protect Sasuke, but he would eventually run out of chakra.

akuryuken
04-27-2010, 06:49 AM
How about this, we combine characters? Naruto+Kakashi ablilties vs. anyone(you can combine two characters as well).

mines will be:
naruto + Itachi's MS eyes and jutsus
Sasuke + kyuubi chakra
[enter ninja name] + Nagato abilities(include ST and Pains) this is just to pwns:rolleyes:

camer999
04-27-2010, 05:05 PM
Evil Naruto vs Konoha
Naruto 7-Konoha 3
With Jiraiya and Orochimaru gone,some of the strongest ninja are as follows:
Kakashi,Gai,Tsunade,Lee,Shino,Ebisu,Neji ,Shikamaru, and [even though she is annoying] Sakura.
Yamato could not suppress Naruto since the necklace broke. Naruto in base mode could cause a lot of damage,Sage Mode could take on some of the strongest ninja I named, and 8 tailed would just..merc the village since nothing could be done.

Evil Naruto vs Sasuke [Danzo fight]
Naruto 6 - Sasuke 4
I believe it would be an almost even match. If Naruto could like KB keep his tails but contain his form, his chakra would protect him from Amaterasu and burn instead, but replenish.[assumption] Genjutsu wouldn't work on him with the Kyuubi's assistance. We really don't know if Susano'o would pierce his chakra/skin so we can't calculate it's damage. Susano'o would protect Sasuke, but he would eventually run out of chakra.

Naruto in base would lose to pretty much most of the people you mentioned, in sage mode GAI and Kakashi would have to be fighting REALLY well, and get lee very drunk, once you add kyuubi its over.

Edit: Wait kyuubi is huge and looks very stationary, I could see kakashi using Kamui while other distract it.

KillerNN
04-27-2010, 06:20 PM
I meant if Naruto could learn to go into 8 tails without changing his form like KB. And I didn't say base Naruto against all of the stronger people I mentioned, I sad base Naruto would cause some destruction to a portion of Konoha. <Well, that's what I meant.

HanzoTheSalamander
04-28-2010, 03:05 PM
ok here's one i know its going to seem biased but, Hanzo the salamander vs Itachi. I am going for hanzo on this one simply because he beat the three legendary sanin already. Opinions

Wolverine
04-28-2010, 04:32 PM
ok here's one i know its going to seem biased but, Hanzo the salamander vs Itachi. I am going for hanzo on this one simply because he beat the three legendary sanin already. Opinions

By Itachi, do you mean the healthy Itachi ??

We don't know much either about Hanzo's base abilities or his trump card, so it's hard to say. But I don't think Hanzo would have amy counter to Itachi's Tsukiyomi, though Amaterasu can be avoided. Susano'o is out of the question since I figure that would just be overkill...

If yes, then I give this one to Itachi 6-4...

superninja
04-29-2010, 04:31 AM
We have seen more moves from Itachi than from Hanzo. Hanzo showed he can summon a giant salamander that he rides on. Salamanders can travel on earth and under water so that gives Hanzo the advantage if he fights near water (http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/369/12/ you can see his summon is partially in water here), Hanzo also did a paper bomb trap attack on Nagato, he masked the paper bombs so they blend with the ground and then he controlled them to glue themselves to his enemy (http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/447/04/). He probably has more jutsus since he was famous but we haven't seen them.
Itachi on the other hand is the genjutsu master so if Hanzo gets caught in genjutsu Itachi should win. Hanzo looks like he can do bigger attacks than Itachi coz of his big summon while Itachi has to use his Susano or amateratsu to use big attacks and that tires him. Still Itachi would probably win, he can use amateratsu to corner Hanzo and Susano to defend from any attack that he can't dodge. He doesn't have to use Susano a lot, he can summon it for a moment and then unsummon it so he doesn't die from exhaustion (he blocked kirin with Susano and then he used it afterwards to seal Orochimaru and corner Sasuke but with Hanzo he won't have to use it for that long, only to block an attack that is unavoidable).
The only problem is if Hanzo goes underwater, that means he is away from Itachi's sight and Itachi can't really fight him underwater unless Itachi jumps in and summons full Susano so he can pierce him with Susano sword (that can extend). But that is too risky for Itachi so I think if Hanzo goes underwater Itachi wouldn't follow him and it would be a tie, but if Hanzo is on the ground then Itachi would win.

TheSixthHokage
04-29-2010, 11:07 AM
Itachi had Susanno so he could have killed Hanzo no matter what....

How about CS1 Young Sasuke versus Neji, Temari and Chouji?

Gakure
04-29-2010, 11:42 AM
Itachi had Susanno so he could have killed Hanzo no matter what....

How about CS1 Young Sasuke versus Neji, Temari and Chouji?

Current Neji alone shd do the job. Sasuke was fast then but Neji shd be able to catch his movt and location with his BG, parry his attacks and wait for sasuke to pass out from the curse seal. Nothing Much.

Current Temari is now a jounin and shdnt have problems with a short rang fighter. Temari wins.

Chouji is useless. With his slow movement and shit, sasuke shd have no problem kicking his ass. But the tables will turn if he uses his pills, they are just overkill.

All three together will steamroll CS1 young sasuke.

Wolverine
04-29-2010, 12:29 PM
CS1 Young Sasuke was stronger than the CS enhanced Sound Four who proved to be overkill for the Konoha Jounins sent after them. He was able to go toe to toe with KN1 Naruto who would kick all the aforementioned character's asses even in their current form, only if they were to fight him individually and not as a team.

Together... they will win, even though he would be more powerful...

superninja
04-29-2010, 01:29 PM
Well if it's Sasuke from part one and Neji, Temari and Chouji from part two then definitely Neji, Temari and Chouji win, if it's all of them from part one then I would say Neji, Temari and Chouji win again. The only problem is if Sasuke shoots a fire blast at Temari who is using the wind jutsu that could create a bigger flame and give Sasuke the edge. Sasuke also has sharingan and chidori, Chouji would get owned by chidori since he is such a big target and slower than Sasuke, Neji is the one that would have to give Sasuke a beating.

ask me anything
04-29-2010, 01:47 PM
Itachi had Susanno so he could have killed Hanzo no matter what....

How about CS1 Young Sasuke versus Neji, Temari and Chouji?

Really depends on what point in the storyline you mean by "Young Sasuke". That could mean anywhere from the forest of death when he first awakened it, up to his fight with naruto. Depending on the circumstances sasuke would either have decent taijutsu, or awesome taijustu (after kakashi trained him). Also he would have 2-tomoe sharingan or 3 tomoe sharingan (awakened during his fight with naruto). That would also play a huge role in this fight.

So I'm just going to assume you meant young sasuke at the valley of the end fight. In this case he would curb stomp Neji. High Speed+Movement Prediction=Pure Pwnage. If neji can't touch him or his chakra points then he's toast.

Chouji is (and will always be) a joke. A chidori to the gut and he's dead. There's no way his fat ass would be able to avoid it. This is an especially bad match up for choji seeing as all his jutsu are close range (meat tank, multi-size jutsu, palm thrust, etc...).

Temari is the only real threat in this fight. Mid-range wind techs could keep him at bay for a while. That weasel summoning of hers is pretty bad ass. The only problem is that her wind techs don't due much damage. When fighting shikamaru (more like a lovers quarrel;)) all she did was give him a few nicks and cuts here and there. If sasuke could get through here winds techs he would beat her. Also fire>wind so he's got an advantage over her anyway.

Sasuke 8-2 Neji, Temari, and Chouji

KillerNN
04-29-2010, 08:44 PM
I don't like Sasuke, but he would win.
His speed is over anybody in the first place, and if he has 3 tomoe Sharingan than he will be VERY hard to hit. [If he can fight damn 1 tail Naruto and match his speed, I think he can fight those 3]
Take out Choji's fat ass with a chidori in the beginning of the fight, Beat Temari with Flame jutsu, and Neji with chidori/taijutsu since I don't believe he can match Sasuke's speed.

Honestly, I give it 8-2 Sasuke.

TheSixthHokage
04-30-2010, 11:57 AM
Sorry! I had meant to say that his opposition is also from Part I.

AOTKorby
05-01-2010, 04:40 PM
I don't like Sasuke, but he would win.
His speed is over anybody in the first place, and if he has 3 tomoe Sharingan than he will be VERY hard to hit. [If he can fight damn 1 tail Naruto and match his speed, I think he can fight those 3]
Take out Choji's fat ass with a chidori in the beginning of the fight, Beat Temari with Flame jutsu, and Neji with chidori/taijutsu since I don't believe he can match Sasuke's speed.

Honestly, I give it 8-2 Sasuke.

Eh, 3 Tomoe could barely follow 1-Tail Naruto's movements, and couldn't predict the Kyuubi Chakra's movements. 1 Tail Naruto pretty much beat the shit out of 3 Tomoe Sasuke. Even CS2, at BEST, equaled 1-Tail Naruto (seeing as each of them landed one massive hit on the other before the "final clash" in which Sasuke won by pure plot). Now, granted, Part 1 Neji got his ass absolutely kicked by just basic Jinchuuriki mode, not even 1 tail. Neji would be the only reasonable opponent for Sasuke in this matchup. Sasuke's got speed but Neji has the Kaiten and the 64/128 palms. If he can knock Sasuke down hard even once, Sasuke's as good as effed.

7-3 Sasuke

piston_fan_09
05-01-2010, 09:06 PM
Here's a good fight: Post-timeskip Shikamaru VS Pre-timeskip Kakashi (No MS)

AOTKorby
05-01-2010, 09:07 PM
Here's a good fight: Post-timeskip Shikamaru VS Pre-timeskip Kakashi (No MS)

Not even a contest.

Kakashi wins 8-2 at least.

camer999
05-01-2010, 11:27 PM
^would you happen to know how many gates kakashi has access to?
Okay also, would would win sage naruto vs. H1 ichigo, no H2 because that was more like a fluke and no sage+kyuubi just because. Assume that chakra=spritual pressure/power so naruto can see ichigo. I don't know about this one because could naruto tank ichigo's sword slices or even getsuga tensho, if so sage naruto for the instant win(unless ichigo is that much faster but really naruto doesn't have to touch ichigo for the win). One direct punch from naruto in sage mode will be hell for ichigo though, could probably tank with serious damage.

naruto loses 6-4 if ichigo can effectively hurt him.
naruto wins 8-2 if ichigo has problems doing so.

AOTKorby
05-01-2010, 11:31 PM
^would you happen to know how many gates kakashi has access to?

what the hell does it matter? Kakashi is stated to be almost as sheerly intelligent as Shika, he's (supposedly) got over 1,000 different Ninjutsu up his sleeves compared to Shika's 1. He's a master of Nin, Tai, and Genjutsu, among those the only one Shika is honestly competent in is Ninjutsu, which Kakashi has an insane advantage in. Kakashi's got the MS, summons, Raikiri, Rasengan, and then another 1000 other ninjutsu.

The Special One
05-02-2010, 01:24 AM
Shikamaru needs help against someone on Kakashi's level. Not saying Shikamaru is weak, but he's not a front liner. More of a team facilitator...

Chiyo vs. Tsunade...

poolangya
05-02-2010, 02:26 AM
Chiyo vs. Tsunade...

would this be a contest on who heals a dying person faster?lol

srsly, tsunade has more stamina than chiyo. chiyo has more fighting arsenal than tsunade, but she's just too old. id give this to granny tsunade, she's no pushover. tsunade 7-3 chiyo.

piston_fan_09
05-02-2010, 02:48 PM
Kakashi is stated to be almost as sheerly intelligent as Shika, he's (supposedly) got over 1,000 different Ninjutsu up his sleeves compared to Shika's 1. He's a master of Nin, Tai, and Genjutsu, among those the only one Shika is honestly competent in is Ninjutsu, which Kakashi has an insane advantage in. Kakashi's got the MS, summons, Raikiri, Rasengan, and then another 1000 other ninjutsu.

Kakashi didnt have the MS or know Rasengan until after the timeskip. Pre-timeskip Kakashi has an arsenal of Jutsu that he can use, along wit the sharingan, yet Mito Gai, who only uses Taijutsu, was said to have been better than Kakashi (a fact that confused sasuke and naruto).

If a taijutsu user can beat Kakashi, then i wouldn't doubt that Shikamaru's post-timeskip mind could develop a plan to defeat Kakashi even with his sharingan. Shika has seen Kakashi in action enough times to think about all that he is capable of.

The only problem that i could see Shikamaru having is with genjutsu (even though i never remember Kakashi using one).

ask me anything
05-02-2010, 05:17 PM
I would say if shikamaru knew everything about kakashi, his abilities/jutsu, and the properties of his sharingan, then he might have a chance. If he were to prepare before hand like he did with hidan then he could pull it off.
Shikamaru 6-4 Kakashi

If it was just a striaght up fight with shikamaru not having any prior knowledge, it would be unbelievable pwnage.
Kakashi 9-1 Shikamaru >>>LOL, and this is assuming kakashi doesn't pull out Sharingan.

freaz
05-03-2010, 04:26 AM
I would say if shikamaru knew everything about kakashi, his abilities/jutsu, and the properties of his sharingan, then he might have a chance. If he were to prepare before hand like he did with hidan then he could pull it off.
Shikamaru 6-4 Kakashi

If it was just a striaght up fight with shikamaru not having any prior knowledge, it would be unbelievable pwnage.
Kakashi 9-1 Shikamaru >>>LOL, and this is assuming kakashi doesn't pull out Sharingan.

U guys forget that Kakashi is smart too.
They both had a 5 intelligence on the latest databook.
Shikamaru has to hit him with his shadow while kakashi just has to pull off some distance.
Kakashi would win it, of course but Shikamaru could give him a hard time.

ask me anything
05-03-2010, 06:55 PM
U guys forget that Kakashi is smart too.
They both had a 5 intelligence on the latest databook.
Shikamaru has to hit him with his shadow while kakashi just has to pull off some distance.
Kakashi would win it, of course but Shikamaru could give him a hard time.

I didn't forget anything. Shikamaru is the smarter of the 2. He only has a 5 in the databooks because that's as high as they go. If kakashi has a 5 then shikamaru should have a 6 because he's just that smart.

Shikamaru beat Hidan who was a S-ranked criminal, while kakashi couldn't beat kakuza. Shikamaru did it with preparation and knowledge. I said "if shikamaru knew everything about kakashi" then he would prepare a counter for it and win. When I say knowledge, there are several factors that I mean.

1. His chakra limit/ How many times he can do a jutsu(s) before running out of chakra.
2. His jutsu variety. What he will likely use and what he likely won't
3. The properties of his jutsu(s). Shit like, how long does it take perform the jutsu, what hand signs to look out for (ex. most fire jutsu have a tiger seal in them), how the jutsu is delivered (ex. chidori and rasengan are straight attacks), and what effect they have (chidori pierces, kamui sucks shit up,etc...)
4. The properties of the sharigan. Stuff like, how fast does it drain his chakra by being active, what effects does it have (genjutsu, technique copying, etc...), How long can he use it. Simple things like that.
5. Other things like his Taijutsu skill, summonings and their skills,etc..

If shikamaru picks out the fight location, and set it up before hand, he would be even harder to beat. I don't see why shikamaru couldn't win is he planned ahead. Kakashi is good, but he's not that good.

Thor
05-04-2010, 08:39 AM
I am a very smart guy, i have a 17 average in college (0 to 20).
I am 500000000 times more intelligente than Brock Lesnar will ever be.
I actually have some training in Karate Shotokan.

That being said i know all of the moves that Brock Lesnar performs in the ring (not wrestling WWE).

I could prepare for all of them... and i would still get my ass kicked.

That being said... the difference in intelligence is not that great between Shika and Kakashi.

The power difference however is huge.

Take Shika's fight with the girl with the flute. She was a brute. Shika thought of a counter for everything, Shika found out everything about her... but in the end... power overcame him and he had to be saved.

Get my drift?

Gakure
05-04-2010, 11:19 AM
Shadow bind wont be enough to floor kakashi(whose got many variations of raikifi, summonings, MS and a Jounin at 12).

With prior planning, shika can pull something off but on a fair plate, he'll lose 3-7.

ask me anything
05-04-2010, 01:47 PM
That being said... the difference in intelligence is not that great between Shika and Kakashi.

The power difference however is huge.

Take Shika's fight with the girl with the flute. She was a brute. Shika thought of a counter for everything, Shika found out everything about her... but in the end... power overcame him and he had to be saved.

Get my drift?

Has kakashi ever been shown thinking even 10 steps ahead of his opponent. I don't remember that happening. So to compare him to shikamaru who can think 200 steps ahead and then say they aren't that much different in intellect is just a ridiculous statement.

Kakashi has lots of powerful jutsu, but limited chakra to perform then with. Sharingan drains that chakra at a fast rate. Shikamaru and kakashi are real ninjas who understand the concept of attack and counterattacks. They aren't morons like naruto who will just rush at each other. They have enough sense to use stealth and their environment to their advantage. I they are fighting in a Forrest shikamaru will use all the shadows to his advantage. If they aren't shikamaru will try to lure him to a more advantageous location. If kakashi has his sharigan active shikamaru will try to make him waste his chakra, and then counterattack when he has the upper hand. It's as simple as that.

When shikamaru fought the girl with the flute he had no prior knowledge of her fighting style. He wasted a lot of time and chakra trying to get her in his shadow. When he finally did, he didn't have enough chakra to finish her. If he had that knowledge before hand, he would have done much better in that fight. It was the same when he fought temari. He wasted too much chakra fighting her and didn't have any left to finish the fight even though he had the next 200 moves planned out. You could say it's the same with Jiriaya. He wasted chakra and got damaged trying to figure out pain, and when he finally did it was too late for him.

Like I said in my last 2 posts. "IF shikamaru had prior knowledge of kakashi he could win. If not he would get unbelievable pwned."

Also this fight was post time skip shikamaru Vs. Pre time skip kakashi.

Back in part one kakashi had way less chakra, and didn't have MS. In his fight with Zabuza he barely defeated him, and was bed ridden for a week after that.

Shikamaru in part 2 had more then shadow bind jutsu. He had shadow choke and shadow needle jutsu. Both of which could fuck kakashi up, and he can't copy them being a secret clan jutsu.

Thor
05-04-2010, 02:22 PM
It has been stated that Kakashi has a level of brain power similar to Shikamaru.

And you keep claiming that... if Shikamaru knew everything about Kakashi....

If Kakashi knew everything about Shikamaru... Shikamaru would be dead.

Last, Shikamaru's level of Chakra is not great, i dare to say its exactly the same as Kakashi with Sharingan.

That being said, Shikamaru has, Shadow Binding, Shadow Sewing, and cause use Shadows to pick up objects like Kunais.

Kakashi has Raikiri, water dragon, genjustsu, much faster then Shika, can acess at least one gate, kage bunshin, raiton clone, raiton wolf, master of taijutsu and another thousand jutsu's...

Shika wins only if he ambushes Kakashi, if its a fair fight Shika looses 10 times in 10.

poolangya
05-04-2010, 03:41 PM
shikamaru(p2) vs kakashi(p1)

-shikamaru loses this one. even given preparation time, kakashi will be able to find a way against it. shikamaru 3-7 kakashi.

ask me anything
05-04-2010, 04:37 PM
Shika wins only if he ambushes Kakashi, if its a fair fight Shika looses 10 times in 10.

LOL, that's exactly what I have been saying this whole time. I specifically stated that shikamaru would only have a chance (and a good chance IMO) of winning if he had time to plan ahead, and that in a fair fight he would get his ass handed to him.

I would say if shikamaru knew everything about kakashi, his abilities/jutsu, and the properties of his sharingan, then he might have a chance. If he were to prepare before hand like he did with hidan then he could pull it off.
Shikamaru 6-4 Kakashi

If it was just a striaght up fight with shikamaru not having any prior knowledge, it would be unbelievable pwnage.
Kakashi 9-1 Shikamaru >>>LOL, and this is assuming kakashi doesn't pull out Sharingan.





Kakashi's intelligence was once compared to shikamaru's but nobody said he's just as smart. Just that he's in the same general category. If you can prove that he can think 200 steps ahead then OK he's just as smart, but that has never happened.

Shikamaru completely owned Hidan the second time they fought. He had that shit in the bag from the very beginning. He knew exactly what to do to Hidan to maneuver him into his trap and trick him into thinking he won.

Kakashi on the other hand was barely surviving, despite having other ninja there to help him out. Kakazuza was pushing him back with his wind-fire combination attack, and he would have been killed or badly injured if naruto and yamato hadn't arrived to save him. This clearly show the value of shikimaru's preparation skills, and the LIMITATIONS of what kakashi can do.

AOTKorby
05-04-2010, 07:46 PM
LOL, that's exactly what I have been saying this whole time. I specifically stated that shikamaru would only have a chance (and a good chance IMO) of winning if he had time to plan ahead, and that in a fair fight he would get his ass handed to him.







Kakashi's intelligence was once compared to shikamaru's but nobody said he's just as smart. Just that he's in the same general category. If you can prove that he can think 200 steps ahead then OK he's just as smart, but that has never happened.

Shikamaru completely owned Hidan the second time they fought. He had that shit in the bag from the very beginning. He knew exactly what to do to Hidan to maneuver him into his trap and trick him into thinking he won.

Kakashi on the other hand was barely surviving, despite having other ninja there to help him out. Kakazuza was pushing him back with his wind-fire combination attack, and he would have been killed or badly injured if naruto and yamato hadn't arrived to save him. This clearly show the value of shikimaru's preparation skills, and the LIMITATIONS of what kakashi can do.

Noting the last two paragraphs:

Hidan was by far the weakest member Akatsuki had ever seen.

Kakuzu was easily one of the strongest.

There's a huge difference in combat capability between the two of them. Hidan's a one-trick pony, which made him exceedingly easy to get flattened by Shikamaru's strategy (Hidan being a fucking dumbass also helped). Kakuzu has so many god damn tricks that Shikamaru wouldn't have lasted 10 seconds against him. Shika went in against Hidan knowing EVERYTHING that Hidan could do, while Kakashi was fighting Kakuzu with no knowledge of his techniques.

KillerNN
05-04-2010, 08:07 PM
Damn SK you said what I was about to say.
Shikamaru knew Hidan's capabilities, so he had a plan set up. [Kakashi supplied Kakuzu's blood]
Kakashi fought Kakuzu, a man who had all of the elements and 5 hearts. He only "lost" to Kakuzu for plot hax so Naruto could show off his new Rasenshuriken. It wasn't even a real loss. Kakuzu would flatten Shikamaru, Kakashi would too in my opinion.
6-4 Kakashi

Note:Shikamarus genius doesn't compare with Kakashi's combat level and genius. Also, Kakashi has fought so many ninja that I don't think Shikamaru could be the one who could kill him.

SilverbladeVI
05-05-2010, 11:42 AM
Shikamaru vs Kakashi would end fast.

This is all Kakashi needs to do to this guy.
http://media.onemanga.com/mangas/00000004/000100842/12.jpg

superninja
05-05-2010, 12:50 PM
Kakashi is stronger but if Shika can prepare the terrain with traps beforehand then Shika has a chance. But it would be difficult to catch Kakashi with a trap or a shadow binding jutsu because Kakashi is fast and he is observant of the surroundings so even with that advantage Shikamaru would probably lose. Shikamaru has to keep a certain distance between him and Kakashi if Kakashi is faster and does his attacks faster, but Shika also has to see Kakashi to attack him with his shadow so it's not easy for him. A forest is the most ideal setting for Shikamaru since he can cover behind trees, hide and set traps. If Shikamaru catches Kakashi with his shadow then he should win, Shikamaru has the range advantage, Kakashi only has kunais, a lightning dog attack and water cannon to attack from mid range, Shika could catch him before Kakashi does the handseals but then again Kakashi can dodge and do the handseals in mid air. It wouldn't be an easy fight for Kakashi but he would win imo. He knows what Shikamaru can do and has more jutsu to shoot at him. Plus his nin dogs can sniff the traps maybe.
In fact, Shikamaru is more dangerous close range if Kakashi can't use kamui (with kamui Kakashi is more dangerous close range) because Shikamaru catches with his shadow fast and his shadow binding is stronger the less distance there is between him and his target. So if they would start at ideal distance, like 5 meters from each other, Shikamaru would win by using his shadow imo (unless Kakashi backs down fast). So it is Kakashi actually that has to keep the distance since taijutsu won't work on Shika coz of his shadow binding.

There is that "body flicker" technique I heard about from you guys here, basically the ninja blinks a couple of meters in an instant, it's like a really fast movement so if Kakashi does that he could assassinate Shikamaru from close range before Shika binds him with the shadow but...
Kakashi blinks behind Shikamaru and stabs him with a kunai in his neck.
Kakashi gets bound with Shika's shadow.
Kakashi: "I see..my kunai didn't cut deep enough"
Shikamaru: "Yeah, my shadow also has physical properties, before you attacked I covered my vital spots with my shadow so it shields me from a fast attack.."
Kakashi: "Impressive... for a young guy like you...so what now.."
Shikamaru (prepares shadow spikes to impale Kakashi): "It's over now"
Kakashi (closes his eyes): "Rin, Obito, I'll be seeing you soon..."

camer999
05-05-2010, 06:19 PM
When bring up kamui, shika could not stop him from using it right? So shika is gone, he couldn't shadow bind him unless he wanted to visit another dimension.

ask me anything
05-05-2010, 07:17 PM
^kakashi didn't have kamui in part 1. This fight is part 2 shikamaru VS part 1 kakashi, so no kamui.

The only instant kill jutsu kakashi has is chidori, which is a close range attack. It would be incredible hard to get close enough to shikamaru without getting caught in shadow bind. Shika's shadow needle can easily pierce through a body so he has an instant kill move of his own.

Shikamaru vs Kakashi would end fast.

This is all Kakashi needs to do to this guy.
http://media.onemanga.com/mangas/00000004/000100842/12.jpg

LOL nice try, but that won't work for a number of reasons.

1. For that move to work kakashi needs a distraction so that his enemy doesn't notice him go underground. In this case (and when fighting itachi) he used the fireball for this purpose. Sasuke had his vision blocked by his own fireball, so he couldn't see kakashi go underground. Shika doesn't have anything that could block his view like that.

2. A shadow can be made underground. Remember the chunnin exam fight against temari? He used the shadow of the underground tunnel to catch her. The same thing applies here.

3. http://www.narutocentral.com/manga.php?s=naruto&c=246&p=11
http://www.narutocentral.com/manga.php?s=naruto&c=246&p=12

Hiding underground didn't even fool sakura, and that girl isn't exactly known for her keen intellect. You think something she easily saw through would fool Shikamaru? Didn't think so.


P.S. I just noticed your name is Silverblade VI. Did your original account get banned or was it always like that? I don't remember the VI being there before

superninja
05-06-2010, 09:57 AM
If Shika catches Kakashi with the shadow binding jutsu then Kakashi could maybe cast genjutsu on Shika with his sharingan eye. That is if Shikamaru looks at the sharingan I think.

freaz
05-09-2010, 05:58 AM
So, what about this fight:

Kakashi, Naruto and Shino vs. Sasori

Time: Shippuuden - while naruto was training to master wind style. ( so no rasenshuriken. )
Restrictions: None
Knowledge: None, Sasori has heard of the Sharingan Kakashi.
Sasori introduces himself as a puppet master.
Location: Akatsuki hide-out where they fought Sasori.

Game oN!

AOTKorby
05-09-2010, 01:34 PM
Shino = Fight-breaker. Sasori can't use his fucking puppets if Shino's bugs eat his chakra strings. Kamui would pretty much own Sasori without effort, and the Rasengan could crack any puppet that Sasori has open like an egg. Not even a contest.

piston_fan_09
05-09-2010, 03:34 PM
Shino = Fight-breaker. Sasori can't use his fucking puppets if Shino's bugs eat his chakra strings. Kamui would pretty much own Sasori without effort, and the Rasengan could crack any puppet that Sasori has open like an egg. Not even a contest.

Agreed. Shino alone could possibly own Sasori with his parasitic insects

superninja
05-09-2010, 04:14 PM
But if Sasori scratches them they are finished. Sasori would be more dangerous vs Kakashi, Naruto and Shino than he was vs Sakura and Chiyo, not just because they don't have the antidote and they wouldn't know the puppets he uses but because he would be more serious against these three than he was against his grandma. That means, he might use more than one puppet from the start since he showed he can control 100. In that scenario, Sasori has a chance to win, I'll just say it's 50-50. Kakashi can kamui his heart, Naruto can put a pressure on his puppets with mass clones and Shino can send his bugs to jam his puppets and toward his heart. But Sasori can poison the bugs with his poison cloud, he can massively destroy the clones with his needle barrage and he can put pressure on them.

AOTKorby
05-09-2010, 04:23 PM
But if Sasori scratches them they are finished. Sasori would be more dangerous vs Kakashi, Naruto and Shino than he was vs Sakura and Chiyo, not just because they don't have the antidote and they wouldn't know the puppets he uses but because he would be more serious against these three than he was against his grandma. That means, he might use more than one puppet from the start since he showed he can control 100. In that scenario, Sasori has a chance to win, I'll just say it's 50-50. Kakashi can kamui his heart, Naruto can put a pressure on his puppets with mass clones and Shino can send his bugs to jam his puppets and toward his heart. But Sasori can poison the bugs with his poison cloud, he can massively destroy the clones with his needle barrage and he can put pressure on them.

He can't use more than one puppet from within his first puppet. If Kakashi Kamui's Sasori to death before Sasori even uses his other puppets, Sasori has no chance. Which wouldn't be hard given that puppets lack of mobility. Plus, Shino's bugs could get into the clockwork of the puppets, and screw them up like that. Plus Naruto still has the Kyuubi powers. Sasori's puppets would be straight up useless against anything higher than Kn1.

superninja
05-09-2010, 05:33 PM
He can't use more than one puppet from within his first puppet. If Kakashi Kamui's Sasori to death before Sasori even uses his other puppets, Sasori has no chance. Which wouldn't be hard given that puppets lack of mobility. Plus, Shino's bugs could get into the clockwork of the puppets, and screw them up like that. Plus Naruto still has the Kyuubi powers. Sasori's puppets would be straight up useless against anything higher than Kn1.

If he starts in just one puppet he would lose probably, but if he summons more puppets at the begging then it's the open game since he can use a lot of puppets simultaneously. I don't know how big objects can Kakashi kamui, I don't think he would transport the entire puppet for some reason, but he would aim for the heart container since it's smaller (could be easier to kamui smaller things). In any case Kakashi probably wouldn't start with kamui, he would wait to use it which would give Sasori time to summon the rest of his puppets.
Also, Naruto would go kyubi only if he gets enraged, that means if Kakashi or Shino die during the fight. Then Sasori would have trouble dealing with him, he would lose then since kyubi Naruto can hit his puppets with his chakra cloak. The only puppet to use then is the kazekage puppet that might create the iron walls to block kyubi Naruto's path or iron spikes to impale him. Sasori could still win if he manages to scratch Naruto enough to poison him.

AOTKorby
05-09-2010, 05:58 PM
If he starts in just one puppet he would lose probably, but if he summons more puppets at the begging then it's the open game since he can use a lot of puppets simultaneously. I don't know how big objects can Kakashi kamui, I don't think he would transport the entire puppet for some reason, but he would aim for the heart container since it's smaller (could be easier to kamui smaller things). In any case Kakashi probably wouldn't start with kamui, he would wait to use it which would give Sasori time to summon the rest of his puppets.
Also, Naruto would go kyubi only if he gets enraged, that means if Kakashi or Shino die during the fight. Then Sasori would have trouble dealing with him, he would lose then since kyubi Naruto can hit his puppets with his chakra cloak. The only puppet to use then is the kazekage puppet that might create the iron walls to block kyubi Naruto's path or iron spikes to impale him. Sasori could still win if he manages to scratch Naruto enough to poison him.

That's just it though. He can't summon more puppets while he's in that first one. Since the other side can pretty easily take him out without even breaking him out of the puppet (Kamui, Rasengan, Chakra Bugs), he stands very little chance if he starts in that. If he doesn't, then Shino can still fuck his shit up by breaking the chakra lines on the puppets, thereby rendering all of his puppets completely useless. Sasori would need to re-attach chakra lines manually, which would leave him wide open. Kn1-3 could theoretically be beaten by the Iron Sand (if Shino doesn't break Sasori's control over the puppet), but Kn4 would win effortlessly.

Viczor6
05-10-2010, 04:58 PM
I've got one:

Sai vs Deidara

KillerNN
05-10-2010, 07:05 PM
That's an interesting fight.

I have to say Deidara would win. Even though they are both distance fighters, Deidara's bombs are amazing. The particles that eat you up, unless Sai used an ink clone, D would win. We haven't really seen Sai's abilities much though except for in fillers and movies.

6-4 Sai

shruiken
05-12-2010, 06:24 PM
kakashi vs. gai


in an all out fight my vote is for Gai. After opening all the gates Gai is certainly one of the most powerful characters of the series. Don't get me wrong, I like Kakashi more than I like Gai and I'm not a Gai/Lee fanboy... I just think with 8 open gates Kakashi wouldn't stand a chance, not even with Kamui.

camer999
05-12-2010, 06:26 PM
^In the manga 8 gates means you are "limitless", if that is the case no one could beat gai.

mewmew
05-12-2010, 06:51 PM
^In the manga 8 gates means you are "limitless", if that is the case no one could beat gai.

huh? no one? susanoo, enton, gravity jutsu, TS jutsus and more easily pawns 8 gates.

markus601
05-12-2010, 06:51 PM
^In the manga 8 gates means you are "limitless", if that is the case no one could beat gai.

i thought it said something about have power on the kage level, but even if limitless is the case, naruto controlling all 9 tails could compete since he would then have limitless power.

mewmew
05-12-2010, 06:57 PM
kakashi vs. gai


in an all out fight my vote is for Gai. After opening all the gates Gai is certainly one of the most powerful characters of the series. Don't get me wrong, I like Kakashi more than I like Gai and I'm not a Gai/Lee fanboy... I just think with 8 open gates Kakashi wouldn't stand a chance, not even with Kamui.

gai doesn't technically win since it would be a double KO. lol. he'd be dead after he uses that tech.

camer999
05-12-2010, 06:59 PM
huh? no one? susanoo, enton, gravity jutsu, TS jutsus and more easily pawns 8 gates.

I am just saying what was said earlier in the manga, if it is true then he is literally as fast/strong as he wants to be, don't know how you could beat that.

mewmew
05-12-2010, 07:05 PM
I am just saying what was said earlier in the manga, if it is true then he is literally as fast/strong as he wants to be, don't know how you could beat that.

even the most powerful physical jutsu can't do anything against basic fundamental forces such as gravity and space / time.

AOTKorby
05-12-2010, 07:06 PM
I am just saying what was said earlier in the manga, if it is true then he is literally as fast/strong as he wants to be, don't know how you could beat that.

What opening the 8Gates does is that it neutralizes all of the body's natural limiting factors. Muscles aren't limited in what they can do, meaning you are far stronger than you are under normal stress levels, but that doesn't mean you have "limitless capability." It just means that the limitations your body puts on itself are all completely voided at once. Your body is shooting adrenaline through your bloodstream at an insane pace, your muscles aren't being limited at all to prevent them from damaging themselves, you don't feel pain that would prevent you from performing actions, everything your body normally does to keep you alive by limiting your capabilities is gone. That's what the 8gates do. It just has a much more drastic effect in the Naruto universe than it would in real life because the body also limits chakra flow in the Naruto universe. Take out that limitation, and your body is basically running on Crack, Morphine, Adrenaline, and Magical Steroids all at once.

ask me anything
05-12-2010, 07:35 PM
^you pretty much summed up what I was about to say. The only thing I could add is that opening gates damages the body heavily. When lee opened just 5 gates he was slowly ripping the muscle tissue of his own bones, just by moving. Also, just because your body can hit something at "unlimited" speed and power doesn't mean it can handle it. It could be theoretically possible to break your own hand/leg due to the impact of the force, even though it would likely be a death blow to the opponent. It's kinda like how the backlash of rasen-shuriken injured naruto when he first used. it.

KillerNN
05-12-2010, 07:43 PM
Only way that using full 8 gates would make sense is is the user knew they were going to die but needed to fuck the enemy up before they died.

The Special One
05-12-2010, 08:16 PM
^you pretty much summed up what I was about to say. The only thing I could add is that opening gates damages the body heavily. When lee opened just 5 gates he was slowly ripping the muscle tissue of his own bones, just by moving. Also, just because your body can hit something at "unlimited" speed and power doesn't mean it can handle it. It could be theoretically possible to break your own hand/leg due to the impact of the force, even though it would likely be a death blow to the opponent. It's kinda like how the backlash of rasen-shuriken injured naruto when he first used. it.

It kinda reminds me of the Berserk Armor in the Manga Berserk. Guts can become immune to pain (which releases the body's response to limit itself). If you can't feel pain, you'd probably push your body beyond normal heights. Broken bones, ruptured muscles, so what? You keep slashing away at your enemy until he's dead. But once the ecstasy subsides, you're pretty fucked (no telling what damage you've done to yourself at the cost of being nearly invincible). If Gai or Lee goes 8 there's no reasonable explanation to them surviving, it would be a troll if they did live after it. It's like comparable to Minato pulling out his Reaper God jutsu... I figure it's like this. If I can't kill you alive, I'm takin' yo' ass with me when I die.

ask me anything
05-12-2010, 08:33 PM
^ lol, i was just reading berserk this morning and I wasn't thinking about it like that. Now that you mention it, the comparison is a good one.

The ONLY legitimate way to survive opening 8-gates (IMHO) is if you got a talented medical ninja there to treat him immediately after. But even then it should still be some chance of not surviving. Depends on just who the medical ninja is. Tsunade probable would give him a 50-50 chance of living. somebody like sakura or shizune should be closer to a 25% chance of living. Also if Gai (or lee) do end up surviving they should have some permanent damage to them. The damage on the heart and circulatory system should be so tremendous that, using gate ever again would be impossible. That would (IMHO) give a legitimate excuse to living through it.

The Special One
05-12-2010, 08:51 PM
^Yeah, I guess that's fair. Maybe Gai gets put in the recovery room (for life)... I can't really see Lee going through two life and death like surgeries.lol

shruiken
05-12-2010, 10:39 PM
Well when I proposed Gai vs. Kakashi I initially thought that of course at the end of the battle Gai would die too. I think it would be a cop-out if he survived.

Some may say that this means its a draw, but it depends how you look at it.. If someone was trying to kill me, and the only way I could win was to sacrifice myself to kill them, I would chalk that up as a win in my book.

I think the real question may be... do you think in order to win Gai vs. Kakashi, Gai would NEED the eighth gate? Or perhaps seven or maybe even less would do?

ask me anything
05-12-2010, 10:52 PM
^kamui>>>any amount of gates. If kakashi gets a lock on him its over. Also kakashi could pull the same type move sasuke used against Raikage. That is, if you know where someone will attack prepare a effective counter. Sasuke used amatearsu on raikage. Maybe, kakashi could use a chidori right when gai is about to hit him. idk, maybe. kakashi has genjutsu, but gai can fight without making eye contact. Over all,idk. These 2 are just so drastically different that their skills don't even resemble each other. They could each pwn one another depending on the circumstances.

camer999
05-13-2010, 03:59 PM
^The thing is, could gai move so fast that kakashi would have problems keeping up?

AOTKorby
05-13-2010, 04:02 PM
^The thing is, could gai move so fast that kakashi would have problems keeping up?

Sharingan...

Kakashi would only have problems following Gai's movements at long distance. If it even got to midrange, it'd be near impossible for Gai to even touch him.

superninja
05-13-2010, 05:53 PM
Sharingan...

Kakashi would only have problems following Gai's movements at long distance. If it even got to midrange, it'd be near impossible for Gai to even touch him.

I think it's the other way around, if Gai is as fast as Lee was vs Gara then Kakashi would have a problem dodging his attacks, maybe he would see it with sharingan but he would still be a lot slower. When Gai opens 5 or more gates he becomes a lot faster than any ninja except for raikage so Kakashi would be screwed. Kakashi would have to henge into a tree or travel underground or take a gamble with a kamui. Gai at 8 gates is a probably DBZ kind of force, he would wreck the environment so that Kakashi can't hide (that is my assumption). But in that case it's a draw.

ask me anything
05-13-2010, 06:01 PM
^The thing is, could gai move so fast that kakashi would have problems keeping up?
It's hard to say, but he probably could go that fast. With just 4 gates open lee was moving faster then garras' automatic sand defense. The full 8 gates should be insanely fast. Kakashi said it would give the user power beyond the hokage, so it should be too much for kakashi.

Sharingan...

Even if sharingan can keep up, that doesn't mean kakashi's body can move fast enough to dodge the attacks. The only thing kakashi could do is use a shadow/lighting clone in place of himself, and try to counter Gai somehow.

Kakashi would only have problems following Gai's movements at long distance. If it even got to midrange, it'd be near impossible for Gai to even touch him.


Wouldn't it be the opposite? The farther away things are the slower they seem to move. An airplane may seems like its slowly moving through the sky, yet it's moving several 100 miles per hour. Another example is when you drive down the road fairly fast (60-80mph). Something near the road seems like its flying by fast while objects in the distance seem to move much slower. So in the same way Gai would seem to be moving much slower in the distance, and thus be easier to keep up with, then he would up close where he would be almost impossible to keep up with.

Shrike
05-13-2010, 06:07 PM
Gai vs Kakashi 6-4. If he opens enough gates Kakashi can't keep up. If, though, Kakashi Kamui's Gai before he is into gates, then game over. Kakashi could also Lightning Clone Gai since Gai has no clones, and kill him while shocked/stunned just like Demon Realm died.

AOTKorby
05-13-2010, 06:14 PM
Gai vs Kakashi 6-4. If he opens enough gates Kakashi can't keep up. If, though, Kakashi Kamui's Gai before he is into gates, then game over. Kakashi could also Lightning Clone Gai since Gai has no clones, and kill him while shocked/stunned just like Demon Realm died.

Considerin that Gai has to stand there yelling for a good 5 minutes to open the gates...

Shrike
05-13-2010, 06:21 PM
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/258/10/
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/258/11/

You must have watched the anime too much. He opens them instantly.

AOTKorby
05-13-2010, 06:29 PM
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/258/10/
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/258/11/

You must have watched the anime too much. He opens them instantly.

Not starting to read the manga until Naruto v Orochimaru (as in Kn4 fight) always seems to bite me in the ass.

TheSixthHokage
05-14-2010, 12:38 AM
Not starting to read the manga until Naruto v Orochimaru (as in Kn4 fight) always seems to bite me in the ass.

Back when the anime was good... it pretty much went to shit after the first bunch of Shippuden spoilers IMO.

lionheart_rp
05-15-2010, 05:56 PM
pain attack on the summit

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Pain is attacking the kage summit meeting, all 5 kages are there except danzo is replaced with lady T, kakashi and gai are also present and the cloud team. the meeting is being held in kahona this time. pain gets the same surprize attack that he had last time, no one has any knowledge of pain except what papa frog orginally told them when the prevy sage died.
pain has 1 hour prep befor he launch's his surprize attack, pain has very little knowledge of any in kahona, only what was displayed of him having in his battle. fodder leaf ninja are allowed to fight just like they did when he attacked the frist time, NO ANBU

(heres the twist, pain has collected different bodies for his sixth paths, each body has the same powers as the paths did, but also the added powers of the host)

remember- it the combined powers of the host and the paths

Deva Path-Shikamaru
Animal Path-tenten
Preta Path-neji
Human Path-sakura
Asura Path-rock lee
Naraka Path-choji

Distance: 20 meters

Location: heart of kahona

SOM: IC

Restrictions:none

Knowledge: None

Conditions: Naruto is not present, they have some clues as to how pain's bodies, but they need more time to figure it all out

ask me anything
05-15-2010, 07:17 PM
pain attack on the summit


Deva Path-Shikamaru
Animal Path-tenten
Preta Path-neji
Human Path-sakura
Asura Path-rock lee
Naraka Path-choji

I'm a little confused as to what your trying to say here. Are you saying shikamaru is the new deva path, and tenten the new animal path, etc....

Or do you mean shikamaru is the one who fights deva path and tenten fights animal path, etc.....

If you could clear this up for me I'll gladly respond, as this seems like an very interesting scenario.:)

superninja
05-15-2010, 07:34 PM
I'm a little confused as to what your trying to say here. Are you saying shikamaru is the new deva path, and tenten the new animal path, etc....

Or do you mean shikamaru is the one who fights deva path and tenten fights animal path, etc.....

If you could clear this up for me I'll gladly respond, as this seems like an very interesting scenario.:)

He said Pein took their bodies and their abilities, so basically Deva path now has the gravity attacks and shadow binding jutsus from Shikamaru, the Asura path (robotic Pein) has the rockets and a modified body and Rock Lee's ability to open 5 gates, etc. So he made Pein a lot stronger with this.

I would say Pein probably wins, but there are a lot of strong ninjas that could stand up to him in that scenario (kages and their body guards). Kakashi can kamui at least one Pein and Gai can open 8 gates and destroy at least one or two. Gara can fight all six at once since he is long distance fighter with his massive sand. Raikage would probably die if he charges first (and he would probably do that to test Pein, get caught in the shadow possession which is now 10x stronger since Pein's chakra is bigger than Shikamaru's), but the others would see Pein's abilities that way.

ask me anything
05-15-2010, 08:09 PM
Oh, I see now. In that case Pein pwns terribly. He was already powerful before, but this is just tooooooo much. I don't remember any of his paths ever using any ability of their own other the that paths 1 thing. I'm not even sure if Pein could copy Kekkei Genkai or Secret clan Jutsu's.

For the sake of argument lets assume he can. He can do a lot better then 2nd rate konoha ninja. (3rd rate if you count sakura :D) Why not use resurrected Akasuki members as hosts? I mean come on. Itachi>>>>all six of the names he mentioned together.

Itachi+Deidara+Hidan+Kakauza+Sasori+J-man(as a bonus)= FTW!!!!!!!!!!>>>>>>everybody

lionheart_rp
05-15-2010, 09:19 PM
see heres what im thinking,
kakashi, gai, lady t, garra , Raikage and cloud team, all other gennine such as kiba, chouji ino sai hinita, shino, that interagation dude, ino's dad, and kibas mom and choujis dad, mizukage her body gaurds, Tsuchikage, fodder jounin should do the trick

lionheart_rp
05-15-2010, 09:21 PM
yes its the combined powers of the host boddies and the paths

ask me anything
05-15-2010, 09:25 PM
see heres what im thinking,
kakashi, gai, lady t, garra , Raikage and cloud team, all other gennine such as kiba, chouji ino sai hinita, shino, that interagation dude, ino's dad, and kibas mom and choujis dad, mizukage her body gaurds, Tsuchikage, fodder jounin should do the trick

All those people together could barely defeat the original Pain. Now give Pain some power ups, and those guys don't stand a chance. Unless KB and/or naruto join in that fight the good guys don't stand a chance.

Shrike
05-15-2010, 10:07 PM
Back when the anime was good... it pretty much went to shit after the first bunch of Shippuden spoilers IMO.

Dunno, I think the anime went to shit during the first Sasuke Retrieval arc. The action itself was very good animated, and the characters were well drawn, but they just killed it all with totally pointless flashbacks, seen already for a hundred times, and terribly slow pace. Kimimaro and Naruto clones scene was shown during 3 episodes or some shit like that, and it should have been done in one minute.

Shitpooden overall has a terrible pace. The filler is just...horrible. I can't believe people lack so much imagination. I mean, let fans send you fanfics and you will have awesome fillers. Jesus.

pain attack on the summit

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Pain is attacking the kage summit meeting, all 5 kages are there except danzo is replaced with lady T, kakashi and gai are also present and the cloud team. the meeting is being held in kahona this time. pain gets the same surprize attack that he had last time, no one has any knowledge of pain except what papa frog orginally told them when the prevy sage died.
pain has 1 hour prep befor he launch's his surprize attack, pain has very little knowledge of any in kahona, only what was displayed of him having in his battle. fodder leaf ninja are allowed to fight just like they did when he attacked the frist time, NO ANBU

(heres the twist, pain has collected different bodies for his sixth paths, each body has the same powers as the paths did, but also the added powers of the host)

remember- it the combined powers of the host and the paths

Deva Path-Shikamaru
Animal Path-tenten
Preta Path-neji
Human Path-sakura
Asura Path-rock lee
Naraka Path-choji

Distance: 20 meters

Location: heart of kahona

SOM: IC

Restrictions:none

Knowledge: None

Conditions: Naruto is not present, they have some clues as to how pain's bodies, but they need more time to figure it all out

Surprise attack? You mean, he is just going to bust inside the room or what? If that is what you mean, then the Kages win.

If not, then the only thing he can do is Shinra the building (which again probably won't kill everyone, but will cause huge damage, or he could Chibaku Tensei them all (dunno how effective would it be, since we don't know if it's strong enough to crush you, it could be for capturing purposes only, or maybe Tsuchikage could use a jutsu to free himself and the others).

Either way, Kages have the advantage here from sheer numbers of skilled ninja. Pain would most likely lose.

Shrike
05-15-2010, 10:10 PM
All those people together could barely defeat the original Pain. Now give Pain some power ups, and those guys don't stand a chance. Unless KB and/or naruto join in that fight the good guys don't stand a chance.

Excuse me?

Kakashi could have alone killed Deva. Kamui his head instead of the fucking nail. But the plot wanted Naruto to kill Pain.

Gai wasn't in the fight, but he could easily dispatch one body or more with 6+gates.

Not to mention when you include many others.

ask me anything
05-15-2010, 10:50 PM
Excuse me?

Kakashi could have alone killed Deva. Kamui his head instead of the fucking nail. But the plot wanted Naruto to kill Pain.

Gai wasn't in the fight, but he could easily dispatch one body or more with 6+gates.

Not to mention when you include many others.

6 gates is a one shot thing. Gai would barely be able to move after that. That's assuming Deva's gravity doesn't send him flying. I won't even try to argue against kakashi using kamui on Deva. Even I know plot no jutsu when I see it.


The people Lionheart_rp mention just didn't seem that impressive when compared to Pain.
see heres what im thinking,
kakashi, gai, lady t, garra , Raikage and cloud team, all other gennin such as kiba, chouji ino sai hinita, shino, that interagation dude, ino's dad, and kibas mom and choujis dad, mizukage her body guards, Tsuchikage, fodder jounin should do the trick

All these people fought against pain and didn't stand a chance

These 3 are at a disadvantage against Preta Path. All their ninjutsu would be absorbed, including sand, acid, lava, and dust attacks. These 3 have shown that they depend on their Kekkei Genkai, and form their fighting style around it. With it neutralized what exactly could they do? They haven't shown any genjutsu or taijutsu ablities. In short they are worthless against pain.

These are the ones who give Pain trouble. Gai would have been a good opponent for Asura Path in raw physical strength and power, but Raikage would have destroyed Asura, and a few other pains. He's the tie-breaker in this fight.

@Shrike- on top of Pains already impressive powers, lionheart was talking about giving him evem more powers in the way of shikamaru's shadow jutsu's, neji's byakugan, rock lee's taijutsu and few others. That's why I said it would be crazy to give Pain that much power and why I said nobody besides KB and/or naruto could even hope to stand a chance against him.

superninja
05-16-2010, 07:10 AM
I am going to try to get their abilities straight

remember- it the combined powers of the host and the paths

Deva Path-Shikamaru
Animal Path-tenten
Preta Path-neji
Human Path-sakura
Asura Path-rock lee
Naraka Path-choji

So the new Pein bodies are the bodies of Konoha's ninjas.

So Deva path (Shikamaru) has the ability to push and pull things from himself using "the force" (gravity manipulation), shadow binding jutsu and using the shadow like tendrils to physically attacks opponents or move things.

Animal path (Tenten) has the ability to summon giant creatures plus summon mass quantities of weapons and aim them precisely, so she is a long distance fighter.

Preta path (Neji) has the ability to absorb ninjutsu and use byakugan to see through objects and chakra (that gives all Pein bodies the same sight), he can use gentle fist to disable chakra points in someone's body and use the spinning whirlwind to deflect range attacks.

Human path (Sakura) can remove souls of opponents on touch, she can heal herself and others with healing chakra (on touch), she can concentrate the chakra in her fist and create strong impact punches.

Asura path (Rock Lee) has a semi mechanical body, he can shoot rockets, he is durable to damage, he can open 5 gates and gain super speed.

Naraka path (Chouji) can revive other Pein bodies (he has to be near them to do it), he can increase his body size partially or completely and can smash stuff, he can curl into a giant ball and roll.


But the kages and their bodyguards can also fight:
Gara (Kankuro and Temari)

Gara's sand could bury these bodies with no problem except for the path that can suck chakra (Neji) (would suck the chakra from sand so it would be useless) and Deva path that could deflect it with gravity. But Gara can control a lot of sand, he could bury Preta path with just the mass of the sand so he would hurt it physically. Temari can deflect range attacks with wind (from Tenten/Animal realm or robo Lee) and attack with wind slice, Kankuro would use Sasori puppet to fight.

Tsunade (Kakashi and Gai)

Tsunade can divide her slug summon to heal other fighters, she has the super strength and can resist damage with autohealing. Kakasi can use kamui, Gai can open the gates to lay the smack down.

Rock kage (and those other two)

He can use an energy cube to destroy a small area, he can petrify things on touch. The other two are probably also strong.

Raikage (Darui and Shii)

Raikage is resistant to damage and super fast (coz of the lightning aura/armor), he does a lot of damage with his punches. Darui and Shii have a blinding genjutsu attack (maybe won't work on Pein since he has byakugan in one body), water and lightning combo, range lightning attack.

Mizukage (and two swordsmen)

She has the acidic slime spit and acidic mist attack that can dissolve Pein bodies. One of her bodyguards has byakugan, the other has some energy sword??

I would say kages can win. They have a lot of attacks that could damage Pein. He can't absorb/gravity deflect all of them.

lionheart_rp
05-16-2010, 07:46 AM
yes that is excatly it, but even with all that im thinking because of the numbers i have given to kahona i think they can pull it off seeing as how the pain bodys might not be able to gang up on people this time around, however with out knowledge of pain they may all still fail

The Special One
05-16-2010, 08:19 AM
Pain vs. any individual Kage will probably lead Pain to victory quite easily, but he's up against 5 Kages at once, different story.

Pain has unreasonable tactics against a lone footman, that's why he always win in a straight up match. One person vs. Six Pains is impossible odds. Just stupidly impossible. Pain has no blind-spots and can view the battle field from six different angles. He takes away your ninjutsu, he summons monsters, can revive defeated bodies, has one that can unleash nukes, and finally one that can repel and attract with powerful force. Not to mention they all seem able in taijutsu and carry those rods.

He also can kill a lot a fodder, because, well, fodder are fodder. But Pain doesn't fight 5, or six powerful opponents at once, he never does that. He is unbeatable even against one powerful opponent and is known for slaughtering bunches of fodder. Him facing Five Kages is a completely different story. Each Pain (with the exception of God Realm) is not Kage level and can only perform taijutsu and one type of attack.

And I'm betting that these aides aren't run-of-the-mill ninja (are not fodder). They were selected to guard their Kage (as in, provide back-up). Probably Elite Jounin from the village. Tsunade would probably bring Shikaku (since he's the assuming top Jounin) and Kakashi for example.

lionheart_rp
05-16-2010, 08:28 AM
I am going to try to get their abilities straight



So the new Pein bodies are the bodies of Konoha's ninjas.

So Deva path (Shikamaru) has the ability to push and pull things from himself using "the force" (gravity manipulation), shadow binding jutsu and using the shadow like tendrils to physically attacks opponents or move things.

Animal path (Tenten) has the ability to summon giant creatures plus summon mass quantities of weapons and aim them precisely, so she is a long distance fighter.

Preta path (Neji) has the ability to absorb ninjutsu and use byakugan to see through objects and chakra (that gives all Pein bodies the same sight), he can use gentle fist to disable chakra points in someone's body and use the spinning whirlwind to deflect range attacks.

Human path (Sakura) can remove souls of opponents on touch, she can heal herself and others with healing chakra (on touch), she can concentrate the chakra in her fist and create strong impact punches.

Asura path (Rock Lee) has a semi mechanical body, he can shoot rockets, he is durable to damage, he can open 5 gates and gain super speed.

Naraka path (Chouji) can revive other Pein bodies (he has to be near them to do it), he can increase his body size partially or completely and can smash stuff, he can curl into a giant ball and roll.


But the kages and their bodyguards can also fight:
Gara (Kankuro and Temari)

Gara's sand could bury these bodies with no problem except for the path that can suck chakra (Neji) (would suck the chakra from sand so it would be useless) and Deva path that could deflect it with gravity. But Gara can control a lot of sand, he could bury Preta path with just the mass of the sand so he would hurt it physically. Temari can deflect range attacks with wind (from Tenten/Animal realm or robo Lee) and attack with wind slice, Kankuro would use Sasori puppet to fight.

Tsunade (Kakashi and Gai)

Tsunade can divide her slug summon to heal other fighters, she has the super strength and can resist damage with autohealing. Kakasi can use kamui, Gai can open the gates to lay the smack down.

Rock kage (and those other two)

He can use an energy cube to destroy a small area, he can petrify things on touch. The other two are probably also strong.

Raikage (Darui and Shii)

Raikage is resistant to damage and super fast (coz of the lightning aura/armor), he does a lot of damage with his punches. Darui and Shii have a blinding genjutsu attack (maybe won't work on Pein since he has byakugan in one body), water and lightning combo, range lightning attack.

Mizukage (and two swordsmen)

She has the acidic slime spit and acidic mist attack that can dissolve Pein bodies. One of her bodyguards has byakugan, the other has some energy sword??

I would say kages can win. They have a lot of attacks that could damage Pein. He can't absorb/gravity deflect all of them.

heres a thought thoe, if one of pains body has the byakugan then that sight would be shared by everyone, also the summons. and with pains massive charka im sure the sakura path could heal much greater wounds, and equip serious posions. another though is that the rock lee path would be able to open gates and not have much after effect because the asura path is like a robot. naraka path can now row large, almost the size of a huge sommon and then spam massive revive's for the pain team. tenten path, spamming massive weapons all over the place, like twindragons ( even thoe its a hax jutsu) pluse 5 powerful sommons could create serious confusion and damage. and im pretty sure that the neji path will just walk around absorbing ninjutsu then proceeding with 64 palms kill each person in his path, leaving who i believe is the most deadly path, the shika path to keep a far distance from the battle create a cloud storm over kahona, and spam his shadows from all over the place with his massive charka levels and new eyesight to see whats going on everywhere. im starting to see things going to pain for the win here 7/10

lionheart_rp
05-16-2010, 08:31 AM
Pain vs. any individual Kage will probably lead Pain to victory quite easily, but he's up against 5 Kages at once, different story.

Pain has unreasonable tactics against a lone footman, that's why he always win in a straight up match. One person vs. Six Pains is impossible odds. Just stupidly impossible. Pain has no blind-spots and can view the battle field from six different angles. He takes away your ninjutsu, he summons monsters, can revive defeated bodies, has one that can unleash nukes, and finally one that can repel and attract with powerful force. Not to mention they all seem able in taijutsu and carry those rods.

He also can kill a lot a fodder, because, well, fodder are fodder. But Pain doesn't fight 5, or six powerful opponents at once, he never does that. He is unbeatable even against one powerful opponent and is known for slaughtering bunches of fodder. Him facing Five Kages is a completely different story. Each Pain (with the exception of God Realm) is not Kage level and can only perform taijutsu and one type of attack.

And I'm betting that these aides aren't run-of-the-mill ninja (are not fodder). They were selected to guard their Kage (as in, provide back-up). Probably Elite Jounin from the village. Tsunade would probably bring Shikaku (since he's the assuming top Jounin) and Kakashi for example.

she cant because he is being used as pains body, and that give pain some skill in terms of streagy now

The Special One
05-16-2010, 08:41 AM
I'm comparing the quality of the aides. Like Raikage's Darui and Shii would probably be like Tsunade's Kakashi and Shikaku give, or take a little... I don't think the aides are like Iruka, or anything.

Shrike
05-16-2010, 08:53 AM
tl;dr version of all below - Pain would lose from being surrounded with such numbers, just like he wins against one opponent, so it's almost fair.

6 gates is a one shot thing. Gai would barely be able to move after that. That's assuming Deva's gravity doesn't send him flying. I won't even try to argue against kakashi using kamui on Deva. Even I know plot no jutsu when I see it.

So what if it's one shot thing? He will kill a body easily with it, or two. If Deva repels him, that just means Deva is dead, since in the next 5 seconds, someone from the 5 Kages or the bodyguards will rip him apart. It would be bad idea to use Shinra on someone like Gai and not on someone like Tsuchikage or Raikage.

The people Lionheart_rp mention just didn't seem that impressive when compared to Pain.

No one is that impressive when compared to Pain. He is six people. Hardly anyone can win against six powerful ninja at the same time.

All these people fought against pain and didn't stand a chance

No, they didn't. Tsunade didn't fight him. She was healing the villagers. Besides, fodder and ex Genins will not be there, so it doesn't matter if they wouldn't fare well.

These 3 are at a disadvantage against Preta Path. All their ninjutsu would be absorbed, including sand, acid, lava, and dust attacks. These 3 have shown that they depend on their Kekkei Genkai, and form their fighting style around it. With it neutralized what exactly could they do? They haven't shown any genjutsu or taijutsu ablities. In short they are worthless against pain.

So you would only go with what we have seen from them? Then this VS is useless, since we haven't seen anything from Tsuchikage and barely anything from Mizukage.

Also, Shii uses genjutsu.

They would see that their ninjutsu doesn't work, and slash him with taijutsu or genjutsu. Sure, it would be hard to fight him since he has Juuken now as well, but with so many people around, it wouldn't be hard. Raikage or Gai destroy him easily, or Kamui from Kakashi.

These are the ones who give Pain trouble. Gai would have been a good opponent for Asura Path in raw physical strength and power, but Raikage would have destroyed Asura, and a few other pains. He's the tie-breaker in this fight.

You underestimate other Kages. Gaara is a fearsome opponent. Just remember his fight with Kimimaro, and that was back in Part 1. Even Temari could be deadly for Pain. Animal realm could be taken out by her weasel summon.

@Shrike- on top of Pains already impressive powers, lionheart was talking about giving him evem more powers in the way of shikamaru's shadow jutsu's, neji's byakugan, rock lee's taijutsu and few others. That's why I said it would be crazy to give Pain that much power and why I said nobody besides KB and/or naruto could even hope to stand a chance against him.

I think he would be destroyed here without people spending more then 50% of their chakra.

We have Mizukage with one of the Mist Swordsmen, Ao with Byakugan.
Tsuchikage with bodyguards.
Raikage with Shii (who uses genjutsu) and Darui (who can combine elements).
Gaara with Temari and Kankuro.
Tsunade with Kakashi and Gai.

VS

Buffed Six Paths

Definitely the Kages.

lionheart_rp
05-16-2010, 09:50 AM
i think i have to disagree with that, pain has surprize here, hes not just facing each kage one on one right away, IC, they will do just what they did in the kage summit, and when pain attack the frist time which is some ninja will fight frist and other as will take their time getting to the fight while attending to the wounded

lionheart_rp
05-16-2010, 09:51 AM
i think i have to disagree with that, pain has surprize here, hes not just facing each kage one on one right away, IC, they will do just what they did in the kage summit, and when pain attack the frist time which is some ninja will fight frist and other as will take their time getting to the fight while attending to the wounded

aswell as pain is not looking for naruto this time so he wont be wasting time ask questions, its going to be their just to kill, so that speeds things up and make him more to handle

superninja
05-16-2010, 11:01 AM
heres a thought thoe, if one of pains body has the byakugan then that sight would be shared by everyone, also the summons.

Well yes, but that is only a slight advantage if Pein fights all the kages and jounin simultaneously since he might see everything but he can't react to every attack coz there would be too many attacks.

and with pains massive charka im sure the sakura path could heal much greater wounds, and equip serious posions.

I guess you're right that healing capabilities would be increased coz Pein has bigger chakra, but poisons require preparation and knowledge how to make them, so you're saying that Pein has all the knowledge Sakura had? In that case he could equip Asura path with poison bombs and sleeping gas which would make it more deadly. Tsunade could counter it though with the antidotes, she could distribute them with Katsuya.

another though is that the rock lee path would be able to open gates and not have much after effect because the asura path is like a robot.

That is nice, he would be ultra fast, he could jump and fire a missile rain before anyone can counter it, I think 5 gates would damage him less, but it should still wear that body out to use the gates for a long time. But Pein can revive him or heal him in that case.

naraka path can now row large, almost the size of a huge sommon and then spam massive revive's for the pain team.

But that also makes him a bigger target for the jounins/kages, once Pein revives someone with him that path would become the first one to target.

tenten path, spamming massive weapons all over the place, like twindragons ( even thoe its a hax jutsu) pluse 5 powerful sommons could create serious confusion and damage.

Those big summons are troublesome, Tsunade, Raikage and Gara can destroy them with superstrength/ sand coffin. The kunai rain from Tenten can be blocked with Gara's sand or wind from Temari.

and im pretty sure that the neji path will just walk around absorbing ninjutsu then proceeding with 64 palms kill each person in his path

Neji path would be powerful, but if he absorbs the ninjutsu he has to stand still and concentrate so he can't do the taijutsu and ninjutsu absorbing at the same time, he would have to be taken down with a taijutsu attack from someone who is much faster than him (raikage/gated Gai).

leaving who i believe is the most deadly path, the shika path to keep a far distance from the battle create a cloud storm over kahona, and spam his shadows from all over the place with his massive charka levels and new eyesight to see whats going on everywhere. im starting to see things going to pain for the win here 7/10

That is a nice move with the cloud to create a bigger shadow, if Pein can create a massive shadow then it would be "troublesome", Kakashi can still kamui him even if he is caught in the shadow. But it all depends how powerful shadow can Pein make with his massive chakra, it would be too hax if he can hold all the kages at the same time with it.

Basically I agree with what has been said, if they fight Pein one by one then Pein wins for sure but if they fight together then Pein loses. Since you said he caught them by surprise and they fight like they would in the manga, Pein might win if they go one by one.

ask me anything
05-16-2010, 09:35 PM
So what if it's one shot thing? He will kill a body easily with it, or two. If Deva repels him, that just means Deva is dead, since in the next 5 seconds, someone from the 5 Kages or the bodyguards will rip him apart. It would be bad idea to use Shinra on someone like Gai and not on someone like Tsuchikage or Raikage.

In this scenario deva has other skills besides his gravity manipulation. He can use all of shikamaru's jutsu. So during those 5 seconds after he shinra tensei's Gai into oblivion, he can still use shadow possession, shadow strangling, and shadow sewing jutsu's to attack or defend himself, as well as any other Pain that may be nearby. So its not like he's instantly at a disadvange in those 5 seconds like he originally was.

No, they didn't. Tsunade didn't fight him. She was healing the villagers. Besides, fodder and ex Genins will not be there, so it doesn't matter if they wouldn't fare well.
Whether the kage summit is held in the land of Iron, or one of the villages, their will be fodder who need protection. A shit ton of samurai or ninja will still get hurt and still need medical attention.


So you would only go with what we have seen from them? Then this VS is useless, since we haven't seen anything from Tsuchikage and barely anything from Mizukage.That's right. If they haven't been shown doing it then I'm not going to consider it. Lack of knowledge about someone doesn't mean we make up shit to fill in those blanks. None of the kages (except tsunade) have been shown to summon. Should we assume they all can despite not seeing them do so?


They would see that their ninjutsu doesn't work, and slash him with taijutsu or genjutsu. Sure, it would be hard to fight him since he has Juuken now as well, but with so many people around, it wouldn't be hard. Raikage or Gai destroy him easily, or Kamui from Kakashi.
That's right. It would be harder for them to win if the attacks they are use to are nuetralized. Their Kekkei Genkai is shown to be their strongest and most reliable attacks. It forms the centerpeice of their entire fighting style. Taking that away is like telling naruto that he can't use shadow clones or rasengan at all. I'm not saying it's impossible, but it's just insanely hard, to spontaneously adapt your fighting style like that.


You underestimate other Kages. Gaara is a fearsome opponent. Just remember his fight with Kimimaro, and that was back in Part 1. Even Temari could be deadly for Pain. Animal realm could be taken out by her weasel summon.LOL, I'm not underestimating anyone. Of all the Kages Raikage is the most useful against Pain. If he doesn't destroy Preta Path, then Gaara can't use his sand. Nor can any of the other ninja's use any ninjutsu against Pain. Even if Preta Path is destroyed they better destroy Naraka Path before he revives him. Seeing as Naraka Path is alwas protected by the other Paths, that won't be an easy job.



I think he would be destroyed here without people spending more then 50% of their chakra.

We have Mizukage with one of the Mist Swordsmen, Ao with Byakugan.
Tsuchikage with bodyguards.
Raikage with Shii (who uses genjutsu) and Darui (who can combine elements).
Gaara with Temari and Kankuro.
Tsunade with Kakashi and Gai.

VS

Buffed Six Paths

Definitely the Kages.I believe it is you who are grossly underestimating the power of Pain. Pain wasted soooooo much chakra trying to capture kyuubi-naruto with chibaku Tensei. If he won't do that in this fight he can last for a lot longer. Not to mention using the outer path to completely restore the lives of hundreds of people. What's to say he couldn't do the exact same thing to his own bodies (the 6 paths) if they were destroyed.

Not to mention that Pain has something nobody else has. Coordination. Him being in control of all 6 bodies, means he can plan for each body to protect and attack with the others in unison. It's this strength that makes him fearsome. It's for this very reason J-man knew he didn't stand a chance against just 3 of them if he didn't split them up somehow. Even then he wouldn't have stood a chance if the sage toads hadn't used their frog song. IMO J-man>>>any of the Kages

Not that any of this matters because OP just changed the rules of the fight.

i think i have to disagree with that, pain has surprise here, hes not just facing each kage one on one right away, IC, they will do just what they did in the kage summit, and when pain attack the first time which is some ninja will fight first and other as will take their time getting to the fight while attending to the wounded

So basically this has turned into a "What if Pain attacked the kage summit instead of sasuke, and Tsunade's crew had been there instead of Danzo" like scenario. So basically Pain VS. Raikage and his 2 guys. Then he fights the sand Trio when they show up, and then he goes after the rest of them.

In this case Pain would definitely have the starting advantage, because he would start off with greater numbers (6 on 3). The when the sand Trio shows up it becomes 6 on 6. That's assuming Raikages team hasn't been completely slaughtered by the time Gaara shows up. Then he goes after the other 3 teams, which would be 10 (if you include the samurai leader). Against that Pain is looking good for the win. If you throw in the rest of the people mentioned (rest of the konoha 12, and their parents, team samui, interrogation guy) the pain might be ad a disadvantage. unless he just uses shinra tensei when he walks into the room.:cool:

Shrike
05-16-2010, 09:46 PM
Hey, I am not going to respond to all that, because you just mentioned a few stupid things, so let me clear it up:

There will be no fodder or samurai who need protection. This VS is a Kages and bodyguards vs Pain scenario. If the fodder is involved, then the Kages have an even greater advantage in numbers.

Also, you are saying like Preta Pain can be at 10 places at the same time and absorb anyone's attack. He can maybe absorb two or three jutsu before being overwhelmed in taijutsu. Kaiten won't help much when Raikage enters your space either.

Jiraya was one man. Pain had the numbers. It's reverse here. Kages have the numbers and that advantage.

ask me anything
05-16-2010, 10:47 PM
Hey, I am not going to respond to all that, because you just mentioned a few stupid things, so let me clear it up:

There will be no fodder or samurai who need protection. This VS is a Kages and bodyguards vs Pain scenario. If the fodder is involved, then the Kages have an even greater advantage in numbers.
If the Kage summit is held at any of the villages, there will be countless civilian, and shinobi injuries. If it is held in the land of Iron then there will be samurai injuries. Either way fodder will be involved. Fodder BTW don't contribute anything to the fight. There only purpose is to die meaningless and vain deaths, hence the name fodder. sasuke killed a shitload of samurai when he attacked the kage summit without breaking a sweat. Minato killed a whole army of fodder ninja single handedly in he Kakashi Gaiden arc. Surely you don't think fodder could do anything against pain DO YOU?:confused:

Also, you are saying like Preta Pain can be at 10 places at the same time and absorb anyone's attack. He can maybe absorb two or three jutsu before being overwhelmed in taijutsu. Kaiten won't help much when Raikage enters your space either.Wrong again. Your thinking in terms of the Pain invasion arc, where individual pains were scattered across konoha looking for naruto. If his objective is pure destruction (and not searching) then he wouldn't do this. All the Pain would stick together, as they did latter own in the naruto vs. pain fight. If the pains stick together then Preta Path could just jump in the way of a jutsu to absorb it. Just as he did here. http://www.narutocentral.com/manga.php?s=naruto&c=377&p=8 It's also worth noting that Preta Path doesn't have to absorb jutsu from just his hands. The move he has (Blocking Technique Adsorption Seal) forms a 360 degree bubble around him that protects from EVERY side http://www.narutocentral.com/manga.php?s=naruto&c=377&p=12

Jiraya was one man. Pain had the numbers. It's reverse here. Kages have the numbers and that advantage.Yes Pain has numbers. Which in this fight is no exception. According to the OP Pain does basically the same thing Sasuke did when he fought the kages. This means he fights Raikages team to which he immediately has a 6 to 3 numbers advantage. Then he fights Sand Trio which make the odds even, assuming Rai hasn't been merc'd by the time they show up. Then from there it's anybodies guess what happens next.

Just because Pain is in the same scenario as the sauce doesn't mean they will do identical things. There are 4 major differences between Pain and Sasuke.

1. Pain isn't a dumbfuck. If he Raikage and Sand Trio take too much out of him he will pull back. He's doesn't have that "gotta kill danzo even though I'm out of chakra and half dead" mentality. He wants people dead by any means necessary. Even if that means he only kills 1 kage and has to pull back to reorganize/resurrect his paths. He's cool like that. The exact opposite of sasuke's fiery and prideful attitude.

2. He has a shitload of chakra. He's the energizer bonny of ninja's. He keeps going and going and going.

3. His jutsu don't have any significant backlash on him, with the exception of chibaku tensei and his outer path bringing massive amounts of people back to life crap (which he wouldn't use here anyway). So no worrying about losing eyesight or body aching from spamming susanoo.

4. Even if all his bodies are destroyed he still technically doesn't loose. He just goes back to his village and gets 6 new bodies. Muhahahahahaha. Can the ninjas he kills in the process be brought back? Didn't think so. So however you look at it either Pain wins or he kills a few now and kills the rest later.




So then, is there any other stupid thing I said, you want to clear up?

Shrike
05-17-2010, 07:06 AM
This why I hate the manga section nowadays.

If the Kage summit is held at any of the villages, there will be countless civilian, and shinobi injuries. If it is held in the land of Iron then there will be samurai injuries. Either way fodder will be involved. Fodder BTW don't contribute anything to the fight. There only purpose is to die meaningless and vain deaths, hence the name fodder. sasuke killed a shitload of samurai when he attacked the kage summit without breaking a sweat. Minato killed a whole army of fodder ninja single handedly in he Kakashi Gaiden arc. Surely you don't think fodder could do anything against pain DO YOU?:confused:

Did you see a civilian @ the Summit? No.
Fodder contributes. It is enough that they enter Pain's space for him to use jutsu or taijutsu on them. Gives other countless opportunities. Use your head.

Wrong again. Your thinking in terms of the Pain invasion arc, where individual pains were scattered across konoha looking for naruto. If his objective is pure destruction (and not searching) then he wouldn't do this. All the Pain would stick together, as they did latter own in the naruto vs. pain fight. If the pains stick together then Preta Path could just jump in the way of a jutsu to absorb it. Just as he did here. http://www.narutocentral.com/manga.php?s=naruto&c=377&p=8 It's also worth noting that Preta Path doesn't have to absorb jutsu from just his hands. The move he has (Blocking Technique Adsorption Seal) forms a 360 degree bubble around him that protects from EVERY side http://www.narutocentral.com/manga.php?s=naruto&c=377&p=12

Man. Are retarded as fuck or what? He can jump in front of a technique or two, as I said. But when you attack from ten sides, how is going to catch them all? Jesus FUCK use that head a bit. Imagine the situation.

Yes Pain has numbers. Which in this fight is no exception. According to the OP Pain does basically the same thing Sasuke did when he fought the kages. This means he fights Raikages team to which he immediately has a 6 to 3 numbers advantage. Then he fights Sand Trio which make the odds even, assuming Rai hasn't been merc'd by the time they show up. Then from there it's anybodies guess what happens next.

Why would the scenario be the same? So then Gaara comes in when Raikage loses an arm, right? No. You can't put it into the same scenario because it's stupid, and nonsensical. He said he is attacking the Kages. Raikage wouldn't have just left to fight Pain like he did when Sasuke's name was mentioned.

Just because Pain is in the same scenario as the sauce doesn't mean they will do identical things. There are 4 major differences between Pain and Sasuke.

This isn't even about Sasuke. I don't care what the fuck Sasuke did.

1. Pain isn't a dumbfuck. If he Raikage and Sand Trio take too much out of him he will pull back. He's doesn't have that "gotta kill danzo even though I'm out of chakra and half dead" mentality. He wants people dead by any means necessary. Even if that means he only kills 1 kage and has to pull back to reorganize/resurrect his paths. He's cool like that. The exact opposite of sasuke's fiery and prideful attitude.

We are not talking about pulling back. THIS IS A VS. Duh.

4. Even if all his bodies are destroyed he still technically doesn't loose. He just goes back to his village and gets 6 new bodies. Muhahahahahaha. Can the ninjas he kills in the process be brought back? Didn't think so. So however you look at it either Pain wins or he kills a few now and kills the rest later.

Again, what are you thinking?

So then, is there any other stupid thing I said, you want to clear up?

All of the above in quotes.

lionheart_rp
05-17-2010, 07:11 AM
1. Pain isn't a dumbfuck. If he Raikage and Sand Trio take too much out of him he will pull back. He's doesn't have that "gotta kill danzo even though I'm out of chakra and half dead" mentality. He wants people dead by any means necessary. Even if that means he only kills 1 kage and has to pull back to reorganize/resurrect his paths. He's cool like that. The exact opposite of sasuke's fiery and prideful attitude.

2. He has a shitload of chakra. He's the energizer bonny of ninja's. He keeps going and going and going.

3. His jutsu don't have any significant backlash on him, with the exception of chibaku tensei and his outer path bringing massive amounts of people back to life crap (which he wouldn't use here anyway). So no worrying about losing eyesight or body aching from spamming susanoo.

4. Even if all his bodies are destroyed he still technically doesn't loose. He just goes back to his village and gets 6 new bodies. Muhahahahahaha. Can the ninjas he kills in the process be brought back? Didn't think so. So however you look at it either Pain wins or he kills a few now and kills the rest later.




So then, is there any other stupid thing I said, you want to clear up?[/QUOTE]

im going to have to agree with this....the major fact also that i think where skipping is, saukra healing keeping the pain bodies health and shika paths shadows, because we have all seen him hold more then one person befor, so with all this new charkra and power i can clearly see him hold down large groups, not to mention their will be 5 powerful sommuns running around ...you tell me how they can stop 5 powerful sommons plus 6 paths that have now been upgraded and revived if need be? all the while everyone of the paths and sommons has byakugan and rinnegan. They will see everything coming from every direction through walls and far distances and charka levels

lionheart_rp
05-17-2010, 07:52 AM
just another thought i was thinking how this would go down sin my mind

deva path and asura path would start the attack, which would lead raikage and comapny to come out frist as they are hot tempered.

asura path would fight raikage and deva the cloud team

the asura path is already decent but with rock lee added, he can now open gates, so im thinking he can hold his own against, he may or may not win, but he can easy last long enough until he is aided by deva path for the win after deva path makes quick work of the cloud team. human path/sakura heals them and they continue

this would then bring out in my mind, Garra and sand siblings and Lady T and her gaurds kakashi and gai as this is the leaf village and i cant see them staying out of the fight for long as this is her village.

This is where the fun would start, the animal path cast summons to keep lady T on a defence healing the leaf village, and proceeding spamming massive amount or weapons everywhere to kill more fodder ninja to keep her busy and creat damage to the village.

asura path again pulls out gates and takes on gai, witch he should win as they have the same moves, plus asura can spam missiles. kakashi would be dealing with the deva path which we have seen him fail at. leaving the sand team with preta path who would absorb everything they throw or simply rotation it away, and proceed with shuting down everyones charka or just wearing them out.( note we've seen neji put his charka in that guys webbing and it was sent all the way to him knocking him out no reason that would work with garra's sand or kankuro strings) after their defeat it would bring out the remaining people to help or aid, which we all know would fail as we have not seen anything great from any of them.

superninja
05-17-2010, 01:26 PM
just another thought i was thinking how this would go down sin my mind

deva path and asura path would start the attack, which would lead raikage and comapny to come out frist as they are hot tempered.

asura path would fight raikage and deva the cloud team

the asura path is already decent but with rock lee added, he can now open gates, so im thinking he can hold his own against, he may or may not win, but he can easy last long enough until he is aided by deva path for the win after deva path makes quick work of the cloud team. human path/sakura heals them and they continue

this would then bring out in my mind, Garra and sand siblings and Lady T and her gaurds kakashi and gai as this is the leaf village and i cant see them staying out of the fight for long as this is her village.

This is where the fun would start, the animal path cast summons to keep lady T on a defence healing the leaf village, and proceeding spamming massive amount or weapons everywhere to kill more fodder ninja to keep her busy and creat damage to the village.

asura path again pulls out gates and takes on gai, witch he should win as they have the same moves, plus asura can spam missiles. kakashi would be dealing with the deva path which we have seen him fail at. leaving the sand team with preta path who would absorb everything they throw or simply rotation it away, and proceed with shuting down everyones charka or just wearing them out.( note we've seen neji put his charka in that guys webbing and it was sent all the way to him knocking him out no reason that would work with garra's sand or kankuro strings) after their defeat it would bring out the remaining people to help or aid, which we all know would fail as we have not seen anything great from any of them.

You are kind of underestimating kages and the jounins here because raikage can't be held down by just one Pein unless it's the Deva path (he is too fast and he is resistant to damage because of his lightning armor), Pein has to use more paths to beat raikage.
Gai is stronger than 5 gates, he can open more so Asura with Rock Lee's speed is still slower if Gai opens more than 5 gates.
Kakashi already almost beat Deva path (without even trying to use kamui on him), so with a stronger team he could definitely beat Deva path (Tsunade can heal him with a slug so he can spam kamui more freely).
Sand team can beat the Preta path, Neji/hungry ghost realm could deflect their attacks with rotation/absorbing ninjutsu, but Gara can put a ton of sand on him and that is a physical attack even if the sand is controlled with chakra the sand itself is physical. Plus what Neji did against that spider guy was a special case, the web was like a conduct for chakra (and it was coming out of his mouth) while the chakra strings are just chakra strings and they wouldn't conduct Neji's strike to Kankuro or Gara's sand is just controlled with Gara's chakra but the sand is not a conduct for anyone's chakra if you know what I mean.

The Special One
05-17-2010, 02:15 PM
4. Even if all his bodies are destroyed he still technically doesn't loose. He just goes back to his village and gets 6 new bodies. Muhahahahahaha. Can the ninjas he kills in the process be brought back? Didn't think so. So however you look at it either Pain wins or he kills a few now and kills the rest later.

When Naruto destroyed all of the bodies Nagato was reduced to firing a projectile base chakra-rod... He can't lose all of his bodies and expect to win in his condition. Also, how mobile is Nagato anyway? I don't think retreat and gather more bodies is an option because if it was, he would have did that against Naruto.

Also, with so many high-level senors on each of the Kages' team, he'd probably get found out if he tries to use Chikabu-Tensei (since God realm has to come within a closer proximity in order for the technique to work). And I don't know if Nagato would risk mounting his body closer to the Kages location. It just seems too risky.

ask me anything
05-17-2010, 08:31 PM
When Naruto destroyed all of the bodies Nagato was reduced to firing a projectile base chakra-rod... He can't lose all of his bodies and expect to win in his condition. Also, how mobile is Nagato anyway? I don't think retreat and gather more bodies is an option because if it was, he would have did that against Naruto.

I don't know how mobile Nagato is, but he gets around somehow. He must be capable of movement. I also doubt he sits their connected to his control chair all the time. He has to sleep, eat, and take a dump just like everyone else. Nagato didn't have time to retreat when he fought naruto. When naruto figured out how to trace nagato back to his location using SM and the chakra rod, he immediately went to his location to meet him. None of the kages have anyone that can use SM so they can't trace him like naruto can.

Also, with so many high-level senors on each of the Kages' team, he'd probably get found out if he tries to use Chikabu-Tensei (since God realm has to come within a closer proximity in order for the technique to work). And I don't know if Nagato would risk mounting his body closer to the Kages location. It just seems too risky.

Depends of just how close Nagato would have to be, to be noticed by sensor ninja's. You are likely correct though. If Nagato doesn't use Chibaku-Tensei then he should be far enough away to not be detected. I would like to think konoha has at least 1 sensor ninja, yet they were unable to find nagato as well.

shruiken
05-20-2010, 08:23 PM
Truth is if Nagato were to use Chibaku Tensei on anyone else besides Naruto, they would have been buttraped. He could have killed all five kages at once.

And he would have been able to use it, too.

BAYSYCK
05-20-2010, 11:04 PM
i think pein would beat the 5 kages if he hid his secret

ninjalostboy95
05-23-2010, 12:09 PM
How about Naruto,Bee,and pain vs. the 5 Kages?(SM Naruto)
Distance:100m
location: Forest of Death
mindset:bloodthirsty

freaz
05-23-2010, 01:58 PM
How about Naruto,Bee,and pain vs. the 5 Kages?(SM Naruto)
Distance:100m
location: Forest of Death
mindset:bloodthirsty


Please, don't.

ninjalostboy95
05-24-2010, 07:09 PM
How about the 5th mizukage vs. Tsunade vs. Sakura(3 way battle)

freaz
05-25-2010, 09:45 AM
How about the 5th mizukage vs. Tsunade vs. Sakura(3 way battle)

Asking Sakura vs. Tsunade is like Rock lee vs. Gai

They are the same, but the older versions are stronger, more experience etc..


What about this fight?

Neji Hyuuga, Rock lee and Gaara vs. Deidara


Lee starts with weights on, can take em of when he wants.
Gaara like he was on the kage meeting.
Deidara has both of his arms.

No knowledge over each other.
200m distance.

ninjalostboy95
05-25-2010, 06:15 PM
I think Gaara's team would win because Deidara only won because he used Gaara's love for the village against him

BAYSYCK
05-25-2010, 07:05 PM
deidara because hes a long range fighter while both neji and lee are close range and he already beat gaara

superninja
05-26-2010, 05:16 AM
How about Naruto,Bee,and pain vs. the 5 Kages?(SM Naruto)
Distance:100m
location: Forest of Death
mindset:bloodthirsty

Naruto, Bee and Pein would win no problem. Pein has 6 bodies, Naruto can make 100 clones for start and Bee transforms into a giant bull-octopus. Then Pein summons 4 of his giant animals and Naruto summons Gamabunta, they have an army bigger than the 5 kages.

How about the 5th mizukage vs. Tsunade vs. Sakura(3 way battle)

5th mizukage would win, she has a range attack unlike Sakura and Tsunade (she can spit the acidic goo). Plus she is resistant to her acid attack while the other two are not, she can use that to her advantage.


What about this fight?

Neji Hyuuga, Rock lee and Gaara vs. Deidara


Lee starts with weights on, can take em of when he wants.
Gaara like he was on the kage meeting.
Deidara has both of his arms.

No knowledge over each other.
200m distance.

Gara, Neji and Lee would win this fight. Gara was a match for Deidara by himself, if you give him reinforcements like Neji and Lee then the fight goes to him. Unless, Deidara does the same trick again (he sacrifices one of his arms to kill Gara early in the fight), but it would be more difficult to do when there are Lee and Neji waiting to jump out of the sand tunnel Gara made for them and masked it as a normal sand attack. (Neji can see through sand). Other option is Deidara uses the microbombs Neji can see, so at least Neji would avoid that attack. Then maybe Gara and Lee would die, but Neji would be left to fight. Deidara would be exhausted after that so Neji would win if he could go close range on him. Neji could close Deidara's chakra points and disable Deidara from going kamikaze. Also, Neji and Lee could maneuver in the air when they jump from the sand platform Gara made, Lee or Neji can push or throw each other in mid air to avoid Dei's bombs or to attack him. Gara would also guard them with sand.

dev_drone
05-26-2010, 07:50 AM
KABUTO VS YAMATO
Yamato will win coz he's got the first's DNA so he will surely have a trick up his sleeve not yet shown

superninja
05-26-2010, 02:10 PM
KABUTO VS YAMATO
Yamato will win coz he's got the first's DNA so he will surely have a trick up his sleeve not yet shown

Are you talking about Kabuto from before he took Orochimaru's cells? If so then Yamato would win, but Kabuto now is a lot stronger.

Vengeance
05-30-2010, 06:43 PM
KABUTO VS YAMATO
Yamato will win coz he's got the first's DNA so he will surely have a trick up his sleeve not yet shown
Kabuto wins this no matter what version of Kabuto you're using. Kabuto defeated Tsuande & was said to be on par with Kakashi during part 1. Kabuto can use earth style jutsu by way of underground traveling while his medical ninjutsu can cut Yamatos wood. Kabuto is also smarter than Yamato. Factor in his Oro cell which grants him the white snake abilities such as regeneration & snake summoning & its not even a contest. FYI edo tensi was not given to Kabuto via Oro cell. It's a jutsu that Kabuto actually mastered himself. When Kabuto is shown again in part 2 he's got a collection of bodies as well. So its safe to say that said preparation for edo isn't even a factor here as keeping bodies on standby for such a jutsu is something that he's shown having.

xDD
06-09-2010, 04:58 PM
What about Tenten vs Akamaru?
On a serious note xP, Naruto, Kakashi vs edo tensei'd Hiruzen and Danzo ?

BoyThisIsAwkward
06-10-2010, 12:10 AM
What about naruto vs tsunade? is he basically hokage?

BoyThisIsAwkward
06-10-2010, 12:10 AM
Akamaru...

superninja
06-10-2010, 07:46 AM
What about Tenten vs Akamaru?
On a serious note xP, Naruto, Kakashi vs edo tensei'd Hiruzen and Danzo ?

Tenten would win over Akamaru lol.

Naruto and Kakashi would win, I don't know if the edo tensei golems can do the summoning because they might not have blood that is needed to summon stuff (because they are made of ash). So if they can't summon then Sarutobi can't use the monkey king and Danzo can't use his big summon which takes away a lot from their arsenal. Though, Sarutobi can use fire and Danzo can use wind breath and they can destroy Naruto's clones fast, plus Sarutobi has shadow shuriken jutsu that can destroy Naruto clones. If Danzo has sharingan is a question, it didn't belong to him so he might not have it. Naruto in sage mode should be enough to beat them, Kakashi wouldn't be able to do much coz he gets out of chakra fast. Kakashi would have to be the one to think how they are going to get rid of them though, if they keep regenerating. Naruto could probably destroy them completely with giant rasengan or rasenshuriken so there is nothing left of them. Kakashi can go underground and try to catch them with chains so Naruto gets a clear shot at them with giant rasengan.

What about naruto vs tsunade? is he basically hokage?

Everyone would say Naruto wins easily, Naruto can fight two styles at the present. He can fight in his base mode where he makes a lot of kage bunshins, maybe summons a frog and then tries to get Tsunade with one of his clones. Tsunade has superhuman strength but she is not that fast to avoid all of Naruto's attacks so she has to summon a slug to slow Naruto's clones down. Tsunade has a lot of chakra and she can heal herself with it so she could last some time, maybe she could use the small slugs to attack Naruto's clones or attach to Naruto's clones coz the slug summon can divide into a lot of slugs so it evens the numbers a bit. Then Naruto can also go sage mode which gives him the ability to create a giant rasengan and do rasenshuriken plus he gets superstrong. Tsunade doesn't have a counter for that I think. It would depend then how long can Tsunade avoid Naruto's attack and how long the sage mode would last. Sage mode Naruto can sense chakras so you can't hide from him, another hax. The only way would be to occupy him directly with something or to be fast enough to dodge all his attacks. Basically Naruto would win, Tsunade has a small chance to win imo.

darrylgm
06-18-2010, 05:53 PM
Tsunade has a small chance to win imo.

Thats only if she manages to land a full direct hit on Naruto which is very unlikely considering how fast he is.

Just plain Kakashi VS Naruto no "HAX"

ninjalostboy95
06-18-2010, 09:26 PM
you have elaborate what no "Hax" means because if Kakashi cant use his sharingan he's fucked.

AOTKorby
06-18-2010, 09:48 PM
Well let's see:

Kakashi:

Raikiri and other ninjutsu: not hax
Sharingan: not hax, since his doesn't pull out new abilities every 20 chapters
Kamui: not hax, he can only use it at most 3 times before he's on the brink of death

Naruto:

Clones: not even close to hax
Rasengan: not hax
Sage Mode: not hax, it's capabilities are pretty clearly defined, and he hasn't really gotten any completely unrelated to old abilities-style new abilities from it.
Kyuubi Chakra: not hax, he fucking fought for that shit and won it.

So basically they can use all of their abilities...why "NO HAX" was even necessary is a more relevant question...

ninjalostboy95
06-18-2010, 09:51 PM
In that case Naruto wins hands down. :D

superninja
06-19-2010, 04:59 AM
I consider sage mode and kyubi chakra to be hax for Naruto, sage mode improves him a lot (gives him chakra sensory abilities, super strength, more power to rasengans and ability to use rasenshurikens) plus kyubi gives him a lot more chakra, Kakashi's kamui is also hax, it can destroy anything but in Kakashi vs Naruto, Kakashi wouldn't be able to use kamui on Naruto because Naruto makes a lot of clones and Kakashi is done after 2 uses. Naruto wins with hax allowed coz his hax is more useful than Kakashi's, if it's base Naruto vs Kakashi without kamui then Naruto would win 6 times out of 10. Don't ask me how I got these numbers. Naruto would outlast Kakashi in some scenarios and Kakashi would come up with a plan to locate real Naruto in other scenarios, that is just my opinion.

Wolverine
06-22-2010, 04:14 PM
Comparing two characters, one of which is purposely handicapped to bring about equity is ridiculous in the first place, since it creates nothing but a hypothetical and ambivalent result over something that was certain in the first place. Also saying that "X is hax and Y is unfair" is bullshit since it's a part of the characters predetermined list of abilities and doesn't change anytime whatsoever. It has been given for a reason and that reason is to set that character apart from the realm of mediocrity. Disputing it over a similar situation with another character, just because cause or method of achieving or determination of those abilities is different, is plain retarded. Alright, I'm done ranting for now... :D

How about Sai vs Kiba... ???

ninjalostboy95
06-22-2010, 05:03 PM
Sai wins 10-0

The Special One
06-23-2010, 09:10 AM
Part II made Kiba out to be too much of an idiot. Sai is a good long ranged fighter and can take to sky with his ink creations and launch attacks from there. Kiba is strictly close range and so far, hasn't shown that he can manage to close the gap and be effective when fighting someone who can fight at such a distance. I give it to Sai.

Vengeance
06-23-2010, 09:11 PM
LMAO.... Naruto in base form would beat Kakashi... If you factor in Sage mode or the Kyuubi then its not even a fair fight.

About Sai vs Kiba; Sai wins this hands down.

AOTKorby
06-23-2010, 09:21 PM
I consider sage mode and kyubi chakra to be hax for Naruto, sage mode improves him a lot (gives him chakra sensory abilities, super strength, more power to rasengans and ability to use rasenshurikens) plus kyubi gives him a lot more chakra, Kakashi's kamui is also hax, it can destroy anything but in Kakashi vs Naruto, Kakashi wouldn't be able to use kamui on Naruto because Naruto makes a lot of clones and Kakashi is done after 2 uses. Naruto wins with hax allowed coz his hax is more useful than Kakashi's, if it's base Naruto vs Kakashi without kamui then Naruto would win 6 times out of 10. Don't ask me how I got these numbers. Naruto would outlast Kakashi in some scenarios and Kakashi would come up with a plan to locate real Naruto in other scenarios, that is just my opinion.

So wait, basically, any power that is in any way "kage-level" is automatically "hax?"

I believe you don't know what "hax" are. Hax are powers that conveniently come into existence for the sake of resolving a conflict/saving a character from defeat, etc. Just being powerful isn't "hax".

superninja
06-23-2010, 09:25 PM
Sai vs Kiba?
I always give the advantage to the long range fighters like Sai if they are against close range fighters. But I also root for the underdog. Kiba has ways to close in on Sai if Sai is flying on his ink bird. One way is that Kiba and Akamaru do a fusion and turn into a giant dog, then they jump upwards and do that spinning jump. Maybe they could jump high that way and maintain in the air, maybe hit Sai, or if they go near him the air pressure that happens because of their ultra fast spinning disturbs Sai's flight. Then they can run and jump in their normal form, if Sai flies low, Akamaru could get him by bouncing off Kiba in air. So if Kishimoto wants someone to win, they can win. Sai probably has some wicked long range move though, I am giving the fight to Sai. Plus if Akamaru dies, Kiba would go berserk and lose the fight because he would attack head on.

ninjalostboy95
06-23-2010, 09:38 PM
Kiba has ways to close in on Sai if Sai is flying on his ink bird.

No, he doesnt.

superninja
06-23-2010, 09:39 PM
No, he doesnt.

Lol, yes he does. Haven't you read my idea that Kiba can turn into a giant dog (like he did in part one) and he can jump and spin really fast in that form. If we imagine that he can jump upwards then he has a chance to get Sai who would be in the air. Even if it's a small chance it is still a chance, and if Kishimoto wanted to write a fight where Kiba wins against Sai, he would prob do something like that. Or he would write something different, either way no one is without a chance to win. But you got to believe first.

So wait, basically, any power that is in any way "kage-level" is automatically "hax?"

I believe you don't know what "hax" are. Hax are powers that conveniently come into existence for the sake of resolving a conflict/saving a character from defeat, etc. Just being powerful isn't "hax".

Well, I had to do something to give Kakashi a fighting chance, lol. Plus I really do think sage mode is hax, it improves Naruto's fighting ability a lot and Naruto learned it a bit too quickly. I mean, base Naruto was strong, but sage Naruto gives him super strength (you can't wrestle with him, he can throw giant objects at you or block giant physical attacks), improved durability (you can't injure him with normal taijutsu), chakra sensing (you can't hide from him), giant rasengans/rasenshuriken (he can destroy a wide area with his jutsus). My definition of hax is an unreasonably strong ability that is very hard to counter.

The Special One
06-24-2010, 03:58 AM
Sage Mode isn't really hax (there's many ways around it). The Kyuubi's chakra is. There's no limiting factor on it and it can be spammed indefinitely to give Naruto instant access to speed, chakra, and power. It doesn't have much of a weakness either. The only way to counter a hax, is with another hax (preferably, a stronger one). Take Killer Bee for example. He would shred his opponents pretty easily. So, what do you do? Toss in a person who can effectively null everything he can do, render him to the point in which he can barely fight.

ninjalostboy95
06-24-2010, 08:36 AM
But Kakashi cant take down SM Naruto.

ask me anything
06-24-2010, 09:23 AM
@TSO, SM may not necessarily be a hax due to it having reasonable limitations, but the way naruto learned it makes it a hax (or maybe plot no jutsu is a better way to put it).

There's no reasonable way he should have learned it in such a short time. How could naruto with just 4 clones helping him, completely master SM in a week, when Jiriaya couldn't master in with decades of trying.

superninja
06-24-2010, 06:23 PM
But Kakashi cant take down SM Naruto.

He probably can't. That is because Kakashi can only damage Sage Naruto with a chidori or kamui (imo) and that takes a lot of chakra from him, plus it is dangerous to get close to sage Naruto. Naruto makes a lot of clones so Kakashi can't be sure he will hit the real one with an attack. Maybe if genjutsu works on Sage Naruto, maybe then Kakashi could win by using a sharingan genjutsu on him. But he would have to get close for that and there are many Naruto clones around that could get Kakashi before he does that. I am talking about Naruto that doesn't spam giant rasengans and clones like he did against kyubi because if Naruto can pull that, then Kakashi can't get close. And if Kakashi can't get close he has to go long range and he doesn't have a powerful long range attack, Naruto can sense his chakra long range so he can't hide and Naruto can gether sage chakra while Kakashi is hiding so Naruto only benefits if Kakashi is not fighting close range. So, that is why Naruto would win.

akuryuken
06-25-2010, 11:50 AM
Naruto Vs Kakashi
the only thing i have to say is Sage Art - Nonstop Gargantua rasengan barrage and thats it for kakashi(or any other ninja out there)

freaz
06-25-2010, 12:04 PM
Naruto Vs Kakashi
the only thing i have to say is Sage Art - Nonstop Gargantua rasengan barrage and thats it for kakashi(or any other ninja out there)

yup, now that we;ve seen all those kage bunshins that Naruto can handle in SM he is one heck of a though guy :D..

But don't make them useless again...
( thinks about the screwing part when Naruto's Kagebunshins were useless against Sasuke/Kimmimaro )

darrylgm
06-25-2010, 05:56 PM
Naruto Vs Kakashi
the only thing i have to say is Sage Art - Nonstop Gargantua rasengan barrage and thats it for kakashi(or any other ninja out there)

Idk maybe if Kakashi were to use his MS to its full potential he might not defeat naruto but wound him.

ninjalostboy95
06-26-2010, 03:30 PM
Naruto doesnt need SM to beat Kakashi. Base mode Naruto can beat Kakashi( It's the truth).

The Special One
06-26-2010, 05:04 PM
@TSO, SM may not necessarily be a hax due to it having reasonable limitations, but the way naruto learned it makes it a hax (or maybe plot no jutsu is a better way to put it).

There's no reasonable way he should have learned it in such a short time. How could naruto with just 4 clones helping him, completely master SM in a week, when Jiriaya couldn't master in with decades of trying.

True. But I don't think Naruto will have the opportunity for Sage Mode against Kakashi (unless Naruto came prepared like he did against Pain). But I don't think Naruto needs to take that risk anyway. Apparently, Naruto can make each individual shadow clone wield Rasengan. That alone reevaluates are assumptions on how capable base Naruto apparently is.

Not that I thought base Naruto was weak, but since he can have each shadow clone wield Rasengan, then that just makes mass shadow clones not only a physical onslaught, but gives it a wide spread explosive radius.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
06-26-2010, 05:24 PM
I think alot of people underestimate kakashi.

Now that we know SM naruto is still lacking in speed like his base form kakashi stand a better chance in the first two minutes of the fight IMO.

Why? Speed, KBs, strategy/tactics and the biggest. GENJUTSU! And KAMUI if all else fails.

Kakashi alone figured out deva then set a trap and nearly took him out if it wasnt for the interference of demon realm and the fat father son team. Meanwhile, a worn down deva was able to take out SM naruto, ma, her summons and pa in no time flat. So clearly kakashi does have just as good of chance to beat SM naruto as SM naruto ahs to beat him within the first couple minutes of the fight. But because of his lack of stamina though, as time goes beyond that his chance keep decreasing.

Still, if kakashi was serious about killing naruto. I think he could pull it off if within the first couple minutes. Kakashi knows narutos strengths and weakness so kakashi could easily use that to get a W over even naruto in SM.

ninjalostboy95
06-26-2010, 05:36 PM
What the fuck? Worn out Deva ended up on the floor against SM Naruto. He only took out the boss summons and pa when he regained his FULL POWER. Even then, Deva had to kill pa to get Naruto out of SM to actually get a chance of capturing him. Also if you think Kakashi>Deva then you're slightly overestimating him. One more thing, we don't "know" SM is slow as piss, that's your opinion.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
06-26-2010, 05:53 PM
What the fuck? Worn out Deva ended up on the floor against SM Naruto. He only took out the boss summons and pa when he regained his FULL POWER. Even then, Deva had to kill pa to get Naruto out of SM to actually get a chance of capturing him. Also if you think Kakashi>Deva then you're slightly overestimating him. One more thing, we don't "know" SM is slow as piss, that's your opinion.

Wait, so deva didnt basho tenin choke slam naruto then pin him to the ground from which he couldve killed him if he pleased, but he needed him alive?

And Kakashi had deva beat. He figured him out, set a trap and wouldve got deva to stab the raiton clone, get Immobilized then the real kakashi hiding in the ruble wouldve chidoried him, the END. Even deva realised how much of a threat kakashi was. WHy do u think demon was sent to assist him even though devas so powerful himself.

EDIT: Wait, u know kakashi cant beat SM naruto, but we DONT KNOW if SM naruto is fast?? Dude WFT??? In the manga as well as the anime naruto in SM never didnt anything of the high speed nature exept in KN6 mode. naruto nase or SM has been proven by the manga and now the anime to not be that fast at all.

The Special One
06-26-2010, 06:10 PM
Kakashi had help to make it that far though. True, he set up a way for God Realm to be beat however, there's no proof that he could have pulled it off on his own. He had already used half his chakra. Chouza's team appearing gave Kakashi's counter attack a fighting chance. Otherwise, Kakashi would have been a sitting duck in that pile of rubble.

As for Naruto vs. Kakashi. I just can't see Kakashi winning. Naruto has already surpassed him. They aren't on par anymore. If Kakashi's fighting to kill, Naruto has to fight to kill for the match to be fair. Naruto's on another plane. He's on the Killer Bee, Sasuke plane.

Kakashi's pretty good, he's on the plane just below the one I just mentioned but far above the fodder plane.

AOTKorby
06-26-2010, 06:16 PM
At this point, now that he's got the Kyuubi's chakra, Naruto's easily in the

"Nagato, Minato, Kabuto, Madara, Hashirama" plane of power. The ninja who are on equal or greater standing than entire nations.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
06-26-2010, 06:28 PM
[QUOTE]Kakashi had help to make it that far though. True, he set up a way for God Realm to be beat however, there's no proof that he could have pulled it off on his own. He had already used half his chakra. Chouza's team appearing gave Kakashi's counter attack a fighting chance. Otherwise, Kakashi would have been a sitting duck in that pile of rubble.


Ur forgeting kakash was hidding and not even deva knew until he came out. And kakashi obviously made a raiton bushin because he knew deva would stab it with his chakra rod which wouldve Immobilized him like it did demon realm. So clearly its seems to not be a matter of if, but WHEN would deva stab the clone then get paralysed so kakashi could blitz chidori while hes helpless.

As for Naruto vs. Kakashi. I just can't see Kakashi winning. Naruto has already surpassed him. They aren't on par anymore. If Kakashi's fighting to kill, Naruto has to fight to kill for the match to be fair. Naruto's on another plane. He's on the Killer Bee, Sasuke plane.

Kakashi's pretty good, he's on the plane just below the one I just mentioned but far above the fodder plane.

This isnt DBZ, its naruto. Its not how powerful one is, but how ell they match up Strengths vs weakness, ect.

And although SM naruto can use a couple bushins, put out huge rasengans, throw his Fuuton rasengan. But Kakashis SG and bushin usage should be able to defend against the onlslaught for a couple minutes. And as we know, narutos biggest weakness GENJUTSU kakashi can use very effectivly. Along with kamui, his intelligence and just how well he knows naruto.

I think kakashi wthin the first few minutes could actaully beat naruto even in SM if hes on his game. Lol, Kakashi could be in trouble as naruto comes at him with a rasengan to kill him, then kakshi tunrs into sasuke using ninjutsu. Naruto hesitates and gets chidoried and loses because kakashi knows naruto and is smart enough to know just how to attack and where.

Hes freaking kakashi. Hes shikamaru with a SG, high speed, genjutsu, 1000 jutsu, ect.

ninjalostboy95
06-26-2010, 06:37 PM
Naruto's not that stupid to fall for genjutsu with Sasuke in it if he's fighting Kakashi. Naruto also knows Kakashi as Kakashi knows him -_-.

The Special One
06-26-2010, 06:45 PM
Ur forgeting kakash was hidding and not even deva knew until he came out. And kakashi obviously made a raiton bushin because he knew deva would stab it with his chakra rod which wouldve Immobilized him like it did demon realm. So clearly its seems to not be a matter of if, but WHEN would deva stab the clone then get paralysed so kakashi could blitz chidori while hes helpless.

Kakashi hid after God Realm used shinra tensei. The rubble allowed for Kakashi to hide away. And it wouldn't have happened the way you said it because Pain entered Demon realm into the fray. The whole strategy behind Pain's assault was to use Demon realm to assist in fighting Kakashi at bay while using Bansho Tenin to lure him into trap. So the fact that Kakashi's feint was used up before what you say was it's intended purpose, proves that Kakashi would have been a a sitting duck (which he was) and would have fallen to God Realm unless back up arrived (and it did).

This isnt DBZ, its naruto. Its not how powerful one is, but how ell they match up Strengths vs weakness, ect.

When picking any two combatants for battle, it is better to pick characters who are on the same standing so the fight isn't a blowout; easily favoring one person due to him/her having the total advantage in any given situation based on general skill level... I know power doesn't necessarily > intel and all that, but overall, Naruto is above Kakashi and it is clear cut.

You wouldn't put Konohamaru vs. Raikage for example, as a fair match up. You'd pick Orochimaru vs. Jiraiya, or something like that.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
06-27-2010, 01:11 PM
Kakashi hid after God Realm used shinra tensei. The rubble allowed for Kakashi to hide away. And it wouldn't have happened the way you said it because Pain entered Demon realm into the fray. The whole strategy behind Pain's assault was to use Demon realm to assist in fighting Kakashi at bay while using Bansho Tenin to lure him into trap. So the fact that Kakashi's feint was used up before what you say was it's intended purpose, proves that Kakashi would have been a a sitting duck (which he was) and would have fallen to God Realm unless back up arrived (and it did).

Im only speaking of deva vs kakashi as if demon didnt show up. In which case kakashi wouldve had his ass which the only point Ive been trying to make here. Which also brings up the point that despite devas obvious Kage level, badass sage slaying status. He still felt the need to summon demon fro assistance which should say how strong kakashi is to threaten deva like that.

When picking any two combatants for battle, it is better to pick characters who are on the same standing so the fight isn't a blowout; easily favoring one person due to him/her having the total advantage in any given situation based on general skill level... I know power doesn't necessarily > intel and all that, but overall, Naruto is above Kakashi and it is clear cut.

You wouldn't put Konohamaru vs. Raikage for example, as a fair match up. You'd pick Orochimaru vs. Jiraiya, or something like that.[/QUOTE]

I agree, but kakashi isnt so far behind SM naruto. Its only kakashi stamina that puts him so far behind, but within the first few minutes of battle hes proven to be so strong he could take on kakuzu and hidan at once. COmpete with itachi while protecting his comrades, ect.

I mean the only person to out right beat kakashi one on one is itachi and he used the MS so:rolleyes: And since kakashi lasted longer then Oro and deidara who are also Kage level, I think kakashi is rather underestimated because of the way kishi has him always receiving assistance.

AOTKorby
06-27-2010, 01:35 PM
Hidan is about as dangerous as a sack of feathers to anyone who knows what his powers are. Kakashi wasn't even getting hits in on Kakuzu when Kakuzu got serious, and he was barely able to avoid Kakuzu's combinations. He and the team formerly lead by Asuma (minus Shikamaru, who'd already led Hidan out of the fight and gotten Hidan to take out one of Kakuzu's hearts) would have been killed if Naruto and Yamato hadn't shown up and blocked Kakuzu's Fire+Wind combination.

Kakashi was getting flat-out owned by Pain the entire time they fought. The only time he even came close to harming Deva Path was when he had the Akimichis' help.

"and he used the MS?" So it "doesn't count" if Itachi uses the MS once to beat someone, but if Sasuke uses it enough times to blind himself in ONE DAY it's perfectly valid? lol, fanboy.

Kakashi didn't last longer. He went down in 1 Tsukuyomi. Deidara went down in 1 Genjutsu, Orochimaru went down in 1 Genjutsu. No. Difference.

Kakashi's job in the manga is to have a fairly substantial rep, then to fight the new villain of the arc JUST TO PROVE THAT THE VILLAIN IS STRONGER. THAT'S HIS JOB.

SM Naruto is significantly faster than Kakashi, far stronger than Kakashi, can sense Kakashi's location, is basically invulnerable to any attack short of Kamui, and allows Naruto to use ninjutsu on a scale that makes Kakashi seem downright impotent.

Note: I like Kakashi. Kakashi is cool. But there's honestly no comparison between him and Naruto in most ways at this point.

The Special One
06-28-2010, 07:11 PM
Im only speaking of deva vs kakashi as if demon didnt show up. In which case kakashi wouldve had his ass which the only point Ive been trying to make here. Which also brings up the point that despite devas obvious Kage level, badass sage slaying status. He still felt the need to summon demon fro assistance which should say how strong kakashi is to threaten deva like that.

The God Realm + another realm strategy isn't anything new really. God Realm pretty much said that Sage Naruto wasn't your casual walk in the park to go through, that's why he used the same method he used against Kakashi, but since a different realm was present, the strategy allowed Hungry Ghost to absorb Naruto's Sage chakra and reduce him to base. Sage Naruto is tough for God Realm to handle and the final squabble proved that.

And there isn't much saying that God Realm would have fought Kakashi the same way you think he would have fought him. The Raiton clone could have very well attempted to charge at God Realm and Pain would have used Shinra-Tensei to blow it away, dispersing the clone and throwing a wrench in what you say was Kakashi's initial plan. There's too many scenarios that could have played out to make the single assumption that Kakashi would have killed God Realm with the Raiton Clone feint.

I mean the only person to out right beat kakashi one on one is itachi and he used the MS so And since kakashi lasted longer then Oro and deidara who are also Kage level, I think kakashi is rather underestimated because of the way kishi has him always receiving assistance.

Again, no one is saying Kakshi's weak, it's just that he's not as top tier as he was in Part 1. In part one, Kakashi was elevated to the status of untouchable outside the Sannin, Itachi, and Sarutobi having their way with demonstrating their prowess. In Part II, there are the Kages, Madara, Sasuke and Naruto rising to frightening collateral damage level, Kabuto, and probably some very handy aides of the Hokage.

Basically, Kakashi has been ousted from of the competition by all of these hard hitters. The manga is at the point where power and hax far outweighs experience and finesse. Suasno-o (to be fun let's add Itachi's version since it has seemingly unique equipment that even makes hax sound like a watered down definition of how we should classify Itachi's otherworldly weapons) and that wide-scale Shinra Tensei, are a prime examples of that.

ninjalostboy95
06-28-2010, 07:54 PM
Okay, KYF if we rewind back to the point Kakashi used the raiton clone BEFORE help arrived, Kakashi would of never executed the plan and would've died from no chakra.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
06-29-2010, 03:56 PM
[QUOTE]Hidan is about as dangerous as a sack of feathers to anyone who knows what his powers are. Kakashi wasn't even getting hits in on Kakuzu when Kakuzu got serious, and he was barely able to avoid Kakuzu's combinations. He and the team formerly lead by Asuma (minus Shikamaru, who'd already led Hidan out of the fight and gotten Hidan to take out one of Kakuzu's hearts) would have been killed if Naruto and Yamato hadn't shown up and blocked Kakuzu's Fire+Wind combination.

Yea sure lMAO!!!

Kakashi before he started to run low on chakra took on both at once proving that in the first couple minutes of a fight, hes very powerful and on Kage level.

And from what I remember, kakashi stated he was getting ready to use kamui on kakuzu before naruto arrived lol. And last I checked, kaakshi and yamato had to save naruto from kakuzu. HA HAaaaaaaa!

Kakashi was getting flat-out owned by Pain the entire time they fought. The only time he even came close to harming Deva Path was when he had the Akimichis' help.

A flesh wound and 1 ST=owned?? Lol, then SM naruto got super owned since he got BT choke slmmed and skewed like shrimp and the barbie lol. U fail!

Kakashi had deva right where he wanted him until demon realm then the fat clan interfered.

"and he used the MS?" So it "doesn't count" if Itachi uses the MS once to beat someone, but if Sasuke uses it enough times to blind himself in ONE DAY it's perfectly valid? lol, fanboy.

Fanboy.....:rolleyes:

Ha! Ur riding narutos dick so hard u can taste it and u know it.

Kakashi didn't last longer. He went down in 1 Tsukuyomi. Deidara went down in 1 Genjutsu, Orochimaru went down in 1 Genjutsu. No. Difference.

Kakashi was still able to compete with a shinobi so strong hes on a whole other level from the sennin. And if u didnt notice, it took regular genjutsu to own Oro (sennin) and deidara (S ranked criminal). Yet it took tsukuyomi to own kakashi (just jounin?).




Kakashi's job in the manga is to have a fairly substantial rep, then to fight the new villain of the arc JUST TO PROVE THAT THE VILLAIN IS STRONGER. THAT'S HIS JOB.

SM Naruto is significantly faster than Kakashi, far stronger than Kakashi, can sense Kakashi's location, is basically invulnerable to any attack short of Kamui, and allows Naruto to use ninjutsu on a scale that makes Kakashi seem downright impotent.

^this is the most retarted fanboy staement Ive seen in a while. The manga and now the ANIME have show SM naruto isnt even as fast as kakashi. SM naruto did nothing fast what so ever so ur Idea of speed is seriously flawed because its noexistant with naruto at any level other then Kyuubi mode.

And is invulnerable lol. Sennindownsweenie, u have lost it. Narutos more durable then the average not, earth style hard like kakuzu u tard biscut! And u remember what kakashi did to kakuzu in his iron skin form. (Went through it like hot knife through butter).
Clealry ur just riding naruto too hard to focus long enough to post a logical counter arguement.

Seriously, saying "narutos on this level super ninja" and "kakashi is just kakashi" means nothing compared to the fact that when kakashi is fresh, knows hims enemy so well and can exploit his greatest weaknesses (genjutsu, speed and love for sasuke). kakashi within the first couple minutes before he starts to fade from shitty stamina damn well could beat even SM naruto. After that its clear narutos going to win, but ur inability to admit kaakshi could damn well win with whats hes capable of in the first couple minutes is just naruto dick riding.

ninjalostboy95
06-29-2010, 05:18 PM
KYF you sound so stupid. Kakashi got owned by God realm. Kakashi can't beat SM Naruto get over it. If you want proof then reread the WHOLE pain invasion arc.

Wolverine
06-29-2010, 05:23 PM
KYF you sound so stupid. Kakashi got owned by God realm. Kakashi can't beat SM Naruto get over it. If you want proof then reread the WHOLE pain invasion arc.

Knowing him, you should know how useful that piece of advice really is...

01purple
06-29-2010, 08:13 PM
I really think Kakashi would be able to beat SM Naruto. I mean come on. Kakashi has the MS, plus, it's KAKASHI. Come on guys.

ninjalostboy95
06-29-2010, 11:02 PM
Kakashi can't. That's like saying Kakashi>Jiraiya or Orochimaru which we all know is false. I like Kakashi but I just don't see him beating SM Naruto.

Wolverine
06-30-2010, 02:48 AM
^This.

First validate the point that Kakashi can even beat Jiraiya, then we will talk about him standing a chance against Naruto. Plus, Naruto is not restricted to SM as the only weapon in his arsenal. He also has the Kyubi, whom he has mastered now, remember... ?

naruto_nutty
06-30-2010, 09:02 AM
if the argument is kakashi vs SM naruto or even norm naruto, then it goes without sayin that the victor would in all sense and purpose BE naruto!!!

I only need one bit of evidence to validate my decision:

Upon returning to Konoha way bk when: "Who got a finger stuck up their arse" after you figure that out work out how much they have both increase in powers since then and you got yourself a victor!!!

ninjalostboy95
06-30-2010, 10:27 AM
Wait, so deva didnt basho tenin choke slam naruto then pin him to the ground from which he couldve killed him if he pleased, but he needed him alive?

Yeah, he did but after he hurt Fukasaku which got to Naruto's emotions so your point is invalid.

Wolverine
06-30-2010, 11:47 AM
Saying that Deva was not fighting to kill doesn't really matter in this particular situation. The moment Deva would have inflicted a mortal wound on Naruto, Kyubi would have taken over and Deva would have gotten his ass kicked in 2 chapters instead of 8-10 chapters. Him not attacking Naruto with complete killing intention only helped save his sorry ass longer than it would have otherwise.

This is a moot point and repeating it time and time again has long since become irritating. Please try to understand this simple logic.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
07-01-2010, 07:27 PM
^This.

First validate the point that Kakashi can even beat Jiraiya, then we will talk about him standing a chance against Naruto. Plus, Naruto is not restricted to SM as the only weapon in his arsenal. He also has the Kyubi, whom he has mastered now, remember... ?

Lol, naruto cant even beat Jman lol. Naruto needed his hand held by his teachers to be able to compete with a weakned pain with all kinds of other advantages. Jman stepped in with no info, no outside help and took down 3 realms AT ONCE.

Jman>naruto because a better SM doesnt even come close to closing the gap in exspirince which allows Jman to use his ninjutsu far more efficient and effectivly which is why it took Jman and 1 summon in base mode to beat animals summons. Meanwhile naruto needed SM, ma, pa and three boss summons.



Yeah, he did but after he hurt Fukasaku which got to Naruto's emotions so your point is invalid.

Lol, but u just said a page ago narutos not that stupid to fall for such things. I told kakashi nows naruto so well he could use a ploy just like this exzept with a sasuke genjutsu or clone. However, clearly u contradicted ur self.

Manga fact, naruto is that stupid.

Saying that Deva was not fighting to kill doesn't really matter in this particular situation. The moment Deva would have inflicted a mortal wound on Naruto, Kyubi would have taken over and Deva would have gotten his ass kicked in 2 chapters instead of 8-10 chapters. Him not attacking Naruto with complete killing intention only helped save his sorry ass longer than it would have otherwise.

This is a moot point and repeating it time and time again has long since become irritating. Please try to understand this simple logic.

Lol, the Kyuubi cant just gain control because narutos dying LMAO!!! Deva would have to free the kyuubi or naruto would so this "Kyuubi would magicly take over like he did for sasuke" wouldnt work because back then he willfully used the kyuubi. However, when fighting pain naruto had already refused to rely on the kyuubis power long ago.

ninjalostboy95
07-01-2010, 08:53 PM
Naruto's not that stupid to fall for genjutsu with Sasuke in it if he's fighting Kakashi. Naruto also knows Kakashi as Kakashi knows him -_-.

This is what I said notice how the word genjutsu is in there so clearly I didn't contradict myself.

Thor
07-16-2010, 04:40 AM
OK PEOPLE.

NOW IS THE TIME.

Finally we have seen glimpses of Minato in battle. We have seem in in the Kakashi Gaiden and now in the manga.

Let us make the battle everyone is curious about. With all these new powers clarified for us its time to start:


MINATO VS RAIKAGE.

GOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!

Konnaha_yellow_flash
07-16-2010, 05:12 AM
OK PEOPLE.

NOW IS THE TIME.

Finally we have seen glimpses of Minato in battle. We have seem in in the Kakashi Gaiden and now in the manga.

Let us make the battle everyone is curious about. With all these new powers clarified for us its time to start:


MINATO VS RAIKAGE.

GOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!

Minato FTG is instantanous. His kamui original can redirect huge blasts, but his reflexes are lacking compared to rai in supermode where not only his shushin speed is instant, but his reflexes as well.

And since the FTG has to be activated by minatos reflex to defend or attack against a certain person. Is he going to be able to react to use his FTG before Rai removed his head from his shoulders???? The SG couldnt even....

And since rais raiton armour stopped chidori then the rasengan isnt going to fair any better. So even if minato landed a hit on rai what good would it do?? And with rais bijuu chakra level he could instant shushin all day while minato clearly has limits or far less chakra.

IDK, if minato could use his T/S kamui to draw Raikage in but not let him out he would win because rai would eventually die of dehydration without water to survive. But basic FTG wont work because of the rais combo of super reflexes to react to summoning speed like he did against the amaterasu, while still ebing protected by his raiton armour just in case minato actually lands a hit.

IDK, I want to know what else minato can do because the shiki fuujin wouldnt work either because minato has to grab his opponent and rais covered in raiton which would only harm minato.

EDIT: If minato could use a clone jutsu to let rai beat him, thus rai lets down his guard and armour then minato FTGs to rai taking him out. But, can minato use a KB or better?? We will find out.

ninjalostboy95
07-16-2010, 01:52 PM
No it's not KYF, Rai's super mode reflexes = Minato's. Basically Minato wins hands down(I'm not fanning.)

The Special One
07-16-2010, 01:57 PM
Minato uses a space-time transfer and is fast to boot. Though his Raiton Armor might be a problem. Though the head would be a fair enough target to strike. If the Chidori can pierce Raikage's chest a few inches, then the Rasengan should be powerful it it strikes a more vulnerable spot (such as the head).

Konnaha_yellow_flash
07-16-2010, 02:14 PM
No it's not KYF, Rai's super mode reflexes = Minato's. Basically Minato wins hands down(I'm not fanning.)

read the manga little one.

Shi clearly states minatos reflexes are compareable without ANY raiton armour on. However, his armour takes them to a whole new level (which is clearly above minatos). However, even further rai can increase his raiton armour to his max like he did against sasuke MS which increases his speed and reflexes to instantaneous levels......

Ill get the damn panel if I need to but just trust me on this one:cool:

Minato uses a space-time transfer and is fast to boot. Though his Raiton Armor might be a problem. Though the head would be a fair enough target to strike. If the Chidori can pierce Raikage's chest a few inches, then the Rasengan should be powerful it it strikes a more vulnerable spot (such as the head).

But the rasengan wasnt even able to pierce completely through a Tree when Jman showed it so how is any of its destructive force suppost to do anything to armour that chidori couldnt barely do and that shit went through gaaras super dense sand ball and kakzuzus iron skin like hot knife through butter.

The rasengan wont do crap, but send rai flying back into something which his raiton armour will absorb the impact of as well.

Myth
07-16-2010, 02:35 PM
Minato wins hands down nobody can beat him he can just suck raikage into a wormhole and throw him into a fucking ocean.

ninjalostboy95
07-16-2010, 02:36 PM
read the manga little one.

Shi clearly states minatos reflexes are compareable without ANY raiton armour on. However, his armour takes them to a whole new level (which is clearly above minatos). However, even further rai can increase his raiton armour to his max like he did against sasuke MS which increases his speed and reflexes to instantaneous levels......

Ill get the damn panel if I need to but just trust me on this one:cool:


My bad KYF I misread it.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
07-16-2010, 02:49 PM
My bad KYF I misread it.

Its all good. However, I still have to post the manga panel because Myths clearly confused about what was really said..

http://onemanga.com/naruto/462/03/

Minatos relfexes are compareable to rai, but once hes in that raiton armour they go to a whole new level which not even the SG should be able to follow. AND.....

The and part had to be concerning the fact rai wasnt even at full power which would just yet again take his reflexes and speed even further beyond Minatos shushin...

Face it, no one else can shushin INSTANLY. Minato can FTG himself instantly, but not move and react that fast... However, rai clearly can...http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-463/page014.html
Instantaneous!!!!!

The Special One
07-16-2010, 03:06 PM
But the rasengan wasnt even able to pierce completely through a Tree when Jman showed it so how is any of its destructive force suppost to do anything to armour that chidori couldnt barely do and that shit went through gaaras super dense sand ball and kakzuzus iron skin like hot knife through butter.

The rasengan wont do crap, but send rai flying back into something which his raiton armour will absorb the impact of as well.

That's because Chidori is a high level Raiton jutsu and it has the natural advantage over Doton. I never said Chidori was shit...

And what are you talking about? Rasengan has more explosive power than the Chidori. The Chidori just has greater penetrating power. Jiraiya used only a small step of (of the few it takes to perform a perfect Rasengan) Rasengan to damage the tree, not the full blown Rasengan.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/155/09/

A Full blown Rasengan = this

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/176/10/

You can't say Raikage won't feel anything if he's hit in a more vital position. Hell if Chidori pierced Raikage's neck, he'd be a goner.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
07-16-2010, 03:28 PM
That's because Chidori is a high level Raiton jutsu and it has the natural advantage over Doton. I never said Chidori was shit...

And what are you talking about? Rasengan has more explosive power than the Chidori. The Chidori just has greater penetrating power. Jiraiya used only a small step of (of the few it takes to perform a perfect Rasengan) Rasengan to damage the tree, not the full blown Rasengan.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/155/09/

A Full blown Rasengan = this

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/176/10/

You can't say Raikage won't feel anything if he's hit in a more vital position. Hell if Chidori pierced Raikage's neck, he'd be a goner.

I agree a rasengan to rai chin would probably rock his ass, but it still wouldnt PENATRATE (GIGITY) rais armour because it doesnt penatrate. The rasengan would never be able to blow a hole in the armour since thats not what it does.

It causes serious damage to the impact spot then sends the opponent flying back into something which causes alot of damage as well, but it doesnt actaully explode or anything.

Once more look herehttp://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/485/17/
The rasengan couldnt even overcome the simple raiton ons sasukes hand so how in the hell is a simple rasengan going to overcome a human chidorihttp://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/463/02/

Yes the raikage is a human chidori ninja lol. ANd ur purposing that the basic rasengan that couldnt overcome sasuke hand chidori could actually overcome rai full body chidori??? WHAT????

Maybe oce of these rasengans would allow eachother to be canceled outhttp://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/499/07/
because theyre closer in size and power. However, not a regular lol. No way!!!!

AOTKorby
07-16-2010, 04:18 PM
I agree a rasengan to rai chin would probably rock his ass, but it still wouldnt PENATRATE (GIGITY) rais armour because it doesnt penatrate. The rasengan would never be able to blow a hole in the armour since thats not what it does.

It causes serious damage to the impact spot then sends the opponent flying back into something which causes alot of damage as well, but it doesnt actaully explode or anything.

Once more look herehttp://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/485/17/
The rasengan couldnt even overcome the simple raiton ons sasukes hand so how in the hell is a simple rasengan going to overcome a human chidorihttp://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/463/02/

Yes the raikage is a human chidori ninja lol. ANd ur purposing that the basic rasengan that couldnt overcome sasuke hand chidori could actually overcome rai full body chidori??? WHAT????

Maybe oce of these rasengans would allow eachother to be canceled outhttp://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/499/07/
because theyre closer in size and power. However, not a regular lol. No way!!!!

Chidori/Raikiri is more concentrated to a point than Raikage's armor. Raikage's armor isn't shaped to be a blade or a point. It's meant to be a moderately powerful defense that also stimulates Raikage's nervous system to vastly increase the speed of his movements and reflexes. Chidori doesn't beat Rasengan. Rasengan, at normal size without nature manipulation, is of equal power to Chidori. Chidori focuses that power to a point, Rasengan hits like a bomb.

I don't even know what the current matchup being discussed is. If it's Minato v Raikage, it shouldn't even be a contest. If it's Naruto minus Kyuubi v Raikage...it still really shouldn't be that much of a contest. Raikage loses both matchups, but loses by a much larger margin against Minato.

Wolverine
07-17-2010, 11:34 AM
So now better reflexes>>FTG which is instantaneous ?? Not to mention FTG Level 2 ???

Konnaha_yellow_flash
07-18-2010, 12:48 AM
Chidori/Raikiri is more concentrated to a point than Raikage's armor. Raikage's armor isn't shaped to be a blade or a point. It's meant to be a moderately powerful defense that also stimulates Raikage's nervous system to vastly increase the speed of his movements and reflexes. Chidori doesn't beat Rasengan. Rasengan, at normal size without nature manipulation, is of equal power to Chidori. Chidori focuses that power to a point, Rasengan hits like a bomb.

I don't even know what the current matchup being discussed is. If it's Minato v Raikage, it shouldn't even be a contest. If it's Naruto minus Kyuubi v Raikage...it still really shouldn't be that much of a contest. Raikage loses both matchups, but loses by a much larger margin against Minato.

WTF on both????

The only reason minato can even compete with the raikage is because of his FTG and vica versa. However, narutos in SM isnt much faster then base. So no, I retratc my previous statement that kakashi=SM naruto in speed because the anime showed a completly different story. All SM naruto can do quick is jump....

ANd with such crap speed the raikage would utterly own naruto in seconds lol. Narutos only chance is KN6 and above because of its combo offering of such speed and power... Not enough speed to catch rai in supermode, but at least enough to compete until one of them runs out of chakra and thus loses..


BOT: Minato isnt unbeatable which tobi is showing. And since raikage is tailor made to be able to beat minato (like kisame is to beat KB).

1. Minatos FTG is nullified by rais reflexes and physical speed to follow and even react to instantaneous attacks like the amaterasu..

2. Even if minato lands something it will fail against rais armour and being in close range off balance because an atack failed causes thishttp://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/463/16-17/

So now better reflexes>>FTG which is instantaneous ?? Not to mention FTG Level 2 ???

No, not what Im saying...

The FTG allows one to get from point A to point B instantly no matter the distance. However, once there the user can only attack or defend with theyre physical speed and reflexes...

and raikage in supermode may also allow him to move instantaneouslyhttp://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-463/page014.html(what karin says)
but only over a shorter distance. The further he moves, the longer it will take him to get there, but in the course of that movement he can react, attack or defend just as fast as his speed from point A to point B. Minato cant react, attack or defend instantly. Only move from point A to B that fast....

ninjalostboy95
07-18-2010, 01:00 AM
Rai's not smart enough to figure out FTG..........

Konnaha_yellow_flash
07-18-2010, 01:08 AM
Rai's not smart enough to figure out FTG..........

He was smart enough to change his tactics against sasuke once he started using the MS so IDK. Kunai flys and minato appears with it..... Gee, isnt rocket science rai lol.

Wolverine
07-18-2010, 02:57 AM
@KYF... Minato is blazing fast in base mode itself. I personally don't think Raikage can match FTG level 2 with his reflexes. As Darui said, with his Raiton armour on, his reflexes are "comparable" to Minato's base reflexes. I don't see how he can evade FTG on pure reflex considering even Madara was caught off-guard. Using Sasuke as a benchmark for comparison is incorrect, since he's not as fast as Minato.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
07-18-2010, 12:30 PM
@KYF... Minato is blazing fast in base mode itself. I personally don't think Raikage can match FTG level 2 with his reflexes. As Darui said, with his Raiton armour on, his reflexes are "comparable" to Minato's base reflexes. I don't see how he can evade FTG on pure reflex considering even Madara was caught off-guard. Using Sasuke as a benchmark for comparison is incorrect, since he's not as fast as Minato.

Thats a misunderstanding, miantos only used the FTG, not shushin...

Smoke implys FTG and
http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-240/page008.html andhttp://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-240/page009.html
andhttp://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/501/06/
andhttp://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/501/15/


and no SHI said his reflexes are comparable, but ONCE hes in his raiton armour not even the SG should be able to follow him.http://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-462/page003.html
Shis clearly saying the raiton armour takes his reflexes further and still......

and Rais still....not moving at full speed because he can increase his raiton armour even further, thus his reflexes and speedhttp://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-463/page008.html

ninjalostboy95
07-18-2010, 01:28 PM
He was smart enough to change his tactics against sasuke once he started using the MS so IDK. Kunai flys and minato appears with it..... Gee, isnt rocket science rai lol.

He was given EVERYTHING about Sasuke's power and Sasuke didn't know shit about his powers.

stubborn_d0nkey
07-18-2010, 01:43 PM
shunshin also produces a similar effect, so the smoke thing means nothing.

Wolverine
07-18-2010, 01:49 PM
But how would the Raikage's reflexes overcome FTG ? How does pure speed overcome instantaneous teleportation ???

Konnaha_yellow_flash
07-18-2010, 04:34 PM
He was given EVERYTHING about Sasuke's power and Sasuke didn't know shit about his powers.

Raikage still had the intellect to change tactics, not just hulk smash....

shunshin also produces a similar effect, so the smoke thing means nothing.

Hunh???? Ive never seen a shushin cause smoke dude. However, it clearly shows the FTG does and there were kunai there so it had to be FTG....

(kakashi had minatos kunai as a present so thats how minato FTGed to him, then clearly had one back where the team was which is how he FTGed back)/

and the rest is obvious in the new chapters...

But how would the Raikage's reflexes overcome FTG ? How does pure speed overcome instantaneous teleportation ???

Think about it. Minato FTG speed is instant, but he can only activate the jutsu for attack/defense as fast as he cant react (reflexes). So, no matter how fast Minato can move from point A to Point B after activating the FTG jutsu. He can still only use the jutsu and execute an attack as fast as his basic reflexes and speed will allow.

However, raikage can move at the same speed and react at the same speed the whole time which is also instant as described here by karinhttp://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-463/page014.html

And since rai doesnt need kunai, his intentions cant be telegraphed which makes him seem even faster. All rai has to do is keep track of the kunai to either defend or to attack minato the moment he appears at one with his super shushin speed...

I mean look here!! Rai avoided amaterasu which just like minato using the FTG, is summoned onto the targethttp://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-463/page012.html
Rai dodged an attack as fast as minatos so is it really up for discussion if he could do it again???

And if u dont believe its as fast then readhttp://read.mangashare.com/Naruto/chapter-463/page013.html
The user can IGNITE his target from a distance which means hes summoning the flames onto the enemy, not shotting at high speed.

ninjalostboy95
07-18-2010, 04:57 PM
Dude when Sasuke summoned his MS Raikage stated "That's the MS?" and after that he proceeded to go super black man(I'm part Jamaican so I could say that) in order to counter his Amateratsu.

Konnaha_yellow_flash
07-18-2010, 07:23 PM
Dude when Sasuke summoned his MS Raikage stated "That's the MS?" and after that he proceeded to go super black man(I'm part Jamaican so I could say that) in order to counter his Amateratsu.

Yea, and ur point? Mine is he knew of one of sasukes strengths and already planned a strategy to get around it. and even though he was super pissed he changed tactics without hesitation which shows raikage was still in control and not exactly stupid lol.... Planning ahead then executing a strategy based on gathered info=shikamaru behavior:cool:

Thor
07-18-2010, 07:48 PM
Sooooo losing an arm in the most retarded move in history is now called planning ahed?

good to know...

ninjalostboy95
07-18-2010, 07:56 PM
Planning ahead then executing a strategy based on gathered info=shikamaru behavior:cool:

No he didn't they showed him everything as in when Sasuke starts bleeding tears he'll summon black flames upon his target. All he did was remember this info that's not wits. He also had 3 days to plan this.

stubborn_d0nkey
07-18-2010, 07:56 PM
too lazy to find a manga panel:

http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20091211141841/naruto/images/thumb/e/ef/Body_flicker_pt_1.png/300px-Body_flicker_pt_1.png

Wolverine
07-19-2010, 12:47 PM
On the basis of reflexes alone... Raikage is "comparable" to Minato. Nowhere does it say that his reflexes surpass those of Minato. Add to that FTG level 1, and FTG level 2 and Raikage is more or less history...