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Old 05-22-2011, 04:14 PM   #54
Numinous
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Re: Jesus, not the first

Gakure is yet again praying for our souls, while we pray he grows some common sense. It seems that both prays are highly ineffective.

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Explanation is useless to those who have already made up their minds about God and his existence, and don't give room for changes.
Of course we can change our minds: if we are given highly undeniable proof that God exists, we'd be stupid for not believing in Him. But since such proof is yet to be found, the lack of belief on such a thing as a god is the most logical stance.

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Everything must be physically, logically and plain in sight before they believe it is true.
Well, duh? How the hell are we to believe X exists if we can't perceive it or obtain a mathematical law that leads to the discovery of the existence of it? You can't simply ask for faith to people who have none (because faith, like theism, is acquired through social interaction, it's not a standard characteristic of the human being).

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Well, I have news for them, God is Real.
O'rly? Care to prove it within logical parameters, with 0% of faith in it?

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So is Jesus and the Holy Spirit.
Jesus? I think Jesus was a real man (only hugely exaggerated in his feats), but the Holy Spirit? Again, a logical explanation would be appreciated.

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You cannot understand this mystery until you open your hearts.
And shut our brains, amirite? And why the use of the word "mystery"? It's no mystery, it's either the truth or shenanigans. And by the looks of it, the latter seems to still apply.

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You cant use your earthly knowledge in this matter.
But it's the only one we have, extrapolating outside of it is more trouble than worth.

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I pray God will grant you the grace to understand these things.
I hope your God tells you to stop evangelizing people, since it's rude.

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Check out my sig. HELL IS MORE THAN REAL.
We don't believe in hell, so why scare us with it? That's as effective as robbing a bank with a rubber ducky. And didn't your parents tell you that is rude to verbally assault people? Because argument ad infernum is pretty much it.

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By the way, no true christian
Define true Christian. Please, enlighten me, because with so many sects of Christianity, which one is the "true" one? And what is the right approach to the Bible that a "true" Christian should do, literal or more flax? Please, the expression you used is so loaded that I'm very confused by it.

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By the way, no true christian believed this rapture thing cos we know from Jesus' own words that only the God Almighty knows that particular time. Hit Matt 24:36.
I did better, I checked the whole chapter 24:

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3 As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately. “Tell us,” they said, “when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?” 4 Jesus answered: “Watch out that no one deceives you. 5 For many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I am the Messiah,’ and will deceive many. 6 You will hear of wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. Such things must happen, but the end is still to come. 7 Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places. 8 All these are the beginning of birth pains.
9 “Then you will be handed over to be persecuted and put to death, and you will be hated by all nations because of me. 10 At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, 11 and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. 12 Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, 13 but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved. 14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.

I checked the Greek for you, humas, and it's very specific on the intention: Jesus was talking about the disciples, not the Christians in general, so the end of the world should have come shortly after the lifetime of the disciples. Which is reinforced by this verse:

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34 Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.
So the world already ended if you are to trust the Bible. Which everyone and their mothers know it didn't, or else we wouldn't be talking here, so no rapture for you!

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Get it at the back of ur minds, THE RAPTURE WILL HAPPEN.

Let's put aside the fact I already debunked this, but so what? Who are the "true" Christians that we'll be target of it? See how this disaster of an expression kicks you in the back?


So let's take the most lax definition of it and say it's everyone that consider themselves Christians. That's 2 billion people out of the picture, and certainly a lot of us in the forum would lose many people dear to us, the upside is that the economy would receive an heck of an overhaul, we wouldn't need as much resources as we do (therefore things like fuel, food, clothes, among others, would be much cheaper), Christian abandoned wealth could be distributed to poorer countries, Christian estate could be given to poor and/or homeless people, science would progress much smoother without the Christian moral dogs, etc. So you guys getting raptured is pretty much the best thing ever to the rest of the world.


And all that Antichrist and demons shenanigans? Nuke them! Falling stars? Bunkers! Water turning into absinthe? We already have water filters to turn salty water into fresh water, absinthe would be easy as pie (and it'd be temporary, since the Bible says it just happens with the passing of the Absinthe star/comet). The world nowadays has a lot of ways to counter things that spooked Bronze Age farmers, so I'm not the least bit worried about the future of the human race, even if the fairy tails of the Bible are true.



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Exactly. As long as u keep to ur 'common knowledge and logic', no one can help u.

As long as you keep preaching instead of doing something more productive with your time, none can help you.


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Hahaha, u make me laugh. U are not even in the faith to begin with.

So only Christians can use the Bible to kick your sorry ass? Nice double standards!


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Being a born-again xtian doesnt mean u are a saint.

Oh boy, the "born again" crap. Isn't being "born again" passing through the sacrament of baptism (at least by Acts 2:38)? If that's so, I should be considered "born again", since I was baptized, and yet I'm an atheist.


I know, I know, you are referring to truly accept Jesus Christ as your Saviour and the rest of the spiritual truckload, but by observation of my Christians friends, they always believed in all of that since they have memories, so I really don't get that interpretation of "born again". But maybe it's a cultural dissonance, being the US mainly protestant while Portugal is mainly catholic.

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Am no saint, not perfect, never said I was. Being a born-again xtian doesnt mean u are a saint. Xtians do wrong, they sin, are fallible, and that is a fact. If u are ready to criticize someone, check to see if u deserve the same critcism. That's what the message is abt.
So, if Christians in practical terms aren't better than non-Christians, what's there for us? Poor literacy bad enough to not being able to write "about"?

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See how u are using the same bible u dont trust to try prove ur points.
Because the best way to shut up evangelizing buffoons like you is to make them taste their own medicine.

So, since by the inflection on the "true" Christians and being born-again, I'm sure you would:
  • Allow being castrated and not marry just to get a spot in heaven. (Matthew 19:10-12)
  • Send your wife (that you no longer love) to be stoned to death with the excuse of "she wasn't a virgin we got hitched" and the parents couldn't prove she was a virgin. (Deuteronomy 22:13-21)
  • Stone a man to death for working on the Sabbath (Numbers 15:32-36)
  • Kill birds, wash others in the dead bird's blood, shake them to sprinkle the blood towards the leper to cure him. But no, that's not enough for the cure: you also would kill a lamb and place its blood on the ill and then kill 2 more birds as offerings, then you have the leprosy washed off! (Leviticus 14:1-32)
  • Offer your virgin daughters to sexual predators if you think that'll protect the asses of supernatural manifestations that are dining at your home (Genesis 19:1-8)
5 examples of many in the Bible that work wonders against apologists and evangelists.

So, Gakure, I have nothing against you in other matters, but when it comes to God & Zombie Jesus and whatever, just sit down and have a nice cup of shut-the-fuck-up.
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