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Old 12-24-2008, 05:56 PM   #46
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Re: A Women Who Took Justice Into Her Own Hands

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@Miburo: I was under the impression that you were only allowed to use as much force as is necessary to stop the attack. If you're free to do whatever you want to your attacker, then there should be no legal basis for her prosecution. I still think her reaction was over the top, though.
Kinda. If you justifiably feel your life is in danger then you can use whatever force necessary to protect yourself from harm and stop the attack as swiftly and safely as possible. Could she try to knock him out with the butt end of the sickle? Yeah, maybe. But that's a lot more difficult, and therefore more risky, to do. Just like I can try shooting the kneecaps of a guy with a handgun to stop his attack, but it's a hell of a lot safer and more reliable to just pop him in the chest. Bottom line is that she was attacked and could rationally conclude that her life could be in danger, and she didn't use any more force than necessary to stop the attack. Meaning no foul.

Also, you seem to be misunderstanding the whole "more force than necessary" thing. If you attacked me and I slammed you on your head, knocking you out, then it's all good. If I slam you on your head, knock you out, then kick you in the teeth a couple dozen times then I became the aggressor since you were no longer a threat to me once you were knocked out. If you punched me, then ran away and I chased you down and knocked you out then I'm still in the wrong because you were no longer a threat to me once you started running away. That's what that means. You can't become the aggressor and still claim self defense. It has hardly anything to do with what action you take to defend yourself against an aggressor. The only exception is if you had a clear alternative that would be just as effective in stopping the attack, just as safe to you (No extra risk), and if you were aware of the alternative at that moment in time (Hindsight doesn't count, you don't have time to weigh the pros and cons of different defensive methods when you're subjected to a surprise attack. Something you also seem to not being taking into account).

Gotta look at things in her point of view. She was attacked out of nowhere and didn't have much time to think. She had to stop that guy as quickly as possible, because who knows what the hell he's going to do to her. You can say "Oh, she should have done this or this" all day long because you have time to think about it. She wasn't afforded that luxury though. Add that to the weeks of stalking or whatnot, and one can only imagine how mentally debilitating that whole situation must have been. Empathy, man. It's useful shit sometimes.

Not to mention how utterly ridiculous it is that anyone in this thread could be douchebaggish enough to criticize a woman for defending herself against a potential rapist in any way. Let alone a way that is legally and (easily argued to be) morally acceptable. She was a god damn victim, for fuck's sake. You don't blame them. >.<
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Old 12-24-2008, 06:10 PM   #47
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Re: A Women Who Took Justice Into Her Own Hands

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Originally Posted by Miburo View Post
Kinda. If you justifiably feel your life is in danger then you can use whatever force necessary to protect yourself from harm and stop the attack as swiftly and safely as possible. Could she try to knock him out with the butt end of the sickle? Yeah, maybe. But that's a lot more difficult, and therefore more risky, to do. Just like I can try shooting the kneecaps of a guy with a handgun to stop his attack, but it's a hell of a lot safer and more reliable to just pop him in the chest. Bottom line is that she was attacked and could rationally conclude that her life could be in danger, and she didn't use any more force than necessary to stop the attack. Meaning no foul.

Also, you seem to be misunderstanding the whole "more force than necessary" thing. If you attacked me and I slammed you on your head, knocking you out, then it's all good. If I slam you on your head, knock you out, then kick you in the teeth a couple dozen times then I became the aggressor since you were no longer a threat to me once you were knocked out. If you punched me, then ran away and I chased you down and knocked you out then I'm still in the wrong because you were no longer a threat to me once you started running away. That's what that means. You can't become the aggressor and still claim self defense. It has hardly anything to do with what action you take to defend yourself against an aggressor. The only exception is if you had a clear alternative that would be just as effective in stopping the attack, just as safe to you (No extra risk), and if you were aware of the alternative at that moment in time (Hindsight doesn't count, you don't have time to weigh the pros and cons of different defensive methods when you're subjected to a surprise attack. Something you also seem to not being taking into account).
I understand everything you're saying. I'm not against the fact that she killed him; that was easily the quickest and most effective way to stop him using the sickle, and of course, it was a reflex. But it seems to me like cutting off the dude's head would take more effort than simply killing him as quickly and easily as possible, with no practical advantage. If she'd just slit his throat or something, I'd totally be on her side. However, your earlier point that killing him and then mutilating the body isn't really a crime still stands. Still a bit fucked up, but not a crime.
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Old 12-24-2008, 07:59 PM   #48
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Re: A Women Who Took Justice Into Her Own Hands

Well, we don't know if she lobbed the head clean off, or cut it off afterwards. Who knows?

Either way though, after that kind of traumatic attack it would be completely understandable that she wouldn't be in the most rational mindset. Of course walking around with a severed head is kind of fucked up, but what happened to her directly prior to that was also pretty fucked up. Again, it's pretty low to fault someone who just went through what must have been a unbelievably traumatic situation for not being at the peak of sanity shortly after the fact. She is a victim. She didn't do anything wrong.
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Old 12-24-2008, 11:51 PM   #49
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Re: A Women Who Took Justice Into Her Own Hands

so its understandable to cut someones head off and parade around town with it as a trophy. thats a little crazy. i have no problem with her killing the guy, just what came afterward makes me question her sanity
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Old 12-25-2008, 12:19 AM   #50
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Re: A Women Who Took Justice Into Her Own Hands

How sane do you expect someone to be after they are attacked.. they arent sane. How can that even be possible when you go through such a tramatic experience.

What are they supposed to do.. get attacked and get raped and wonder am i going to die and after its all and done with go back to being normal. Some women never go back to normal and some end up killing themselves afterwards. It kinda makes me sick how some of you act like that guy even had rights. How bout talk to some of the families of women who were raped and murder while the guy who did it was let go out of prison and back on the loose while their wife and daughter are dead. They have no freaking rights. Who cares if there head was chopped off. Luckily for her although she isnt lucky cause she had to even go through that but lucky she had something to fight back with cause if not she would be dead. However according to some of you i guess that would be ok.

Edit: he is dead and he won't be missing his head trust me

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Old 12-25-2008, 12:36 AM   #51
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Re: A Women Who Took Justice Into Her Own Hands

It's one thing to kill your attacker & another to decapitate them & parade around town holding the head like a trophy. I find it hard to believe that she was able to take off the head in one swing. This just leads me to believe that she killed him then decided f*** it I'm cutting this f***er's head off for my collection. The woman was probably temporarily insane because of the attack but one must question her general sanity when she decides to do something like that. I personally wouldn't want to be her husband after hearing something like this. I'd be afraid to even glance at another woman. This woman has some serious issue's not related to this attack.
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Old 12-25-2008, 12:42 AM   #52
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Re: A Women Who Took Justice Into Her Own Hands

Not true i have to disagree.. just because she did that with being attacked doesn't mean she would literally do that just to do it to a guy that ticked her off. When your attacked and so on you have tons of different emotions going on. I hate to say it but a strong one is hatred. Like say if a woman was attacked and she stabbed the guy and then she is in such a state of shock and hatred for that person she doesnt stop at one stab but sits there and constantly stabs him. Thats pretty much the same case. Its not like she is taking it back home to put it on it her wall. More and likely she was dazed and in shock, scared , mad and all that jumbled into one. So no woman is sane after being attacked. In time they finally calm down and go back to normal but as i said some never go back to being completely normal.
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Old 12-25-2008, 12:49 AM   #53
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Re: A Women Who Took Justice Into Her Own Hands

She was getting grass for her cattle which meant she must of been on some type of farm. She then took the severed head & walked for who knows how long to get to a market area so she could show off her kill. These are not the actions of a sane individual. There comes a point during this long walk where one must ask themselves if parading around town with this head is really a good idea. She had time to think this action over & really didn't care. Unless the walk was less then a mile I really don't see how these are the actions of a woman who wasn't already mental disturbed before this attack.
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Old 12-25-2008, 09:24 AM   #54
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Re: A Women Who Took Justice Into Her Own Hands

^Dumbest shit I've read in this thread, by far. Like it's totally outside the realm of possibilities that it really was that dramatic of an experience that she would be a off the rocker for more then an hour afterwards. Or that the only thing wrong with her is that some guy tried to reap the shit outta her. Right? Ugh.

Just because someone reacts in a crazy way after a ridiculously traumatic event doesn't mean that there has always been something wrong with her. Seriously, what a douchebaggish thing to say about someone who was victimized.
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Old 12-25-2008, 10:11 AM   #55
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Re: A Women Who Took Justice Into Her Own Hands

Self-defense is self-defense. Whether you blow it out of proportion or not, if someone is violating your rights, you should be able to take whatever means you can to defend yourself. Forget what the law says. Now if she was raped and then 2-3 days later killed him, that would be vigilantism and that would not be rational. However, self-defense is always rational.
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Old 12-26-2008, 05:05 AM   #56
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Re: A Women Who Took Justice Into Her Own Hands

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She was getting grass for her cattle which meant she must of been on some type of farm. She then took the severed head & walked for who knows how long to get to a market area so she could show off her kill. These are not the actions of a sane individual. There comes a point during this long walk where one must ask themselves if parading around town with this head is really a good idea. She had time to think this action over & really didn't care. Unless the walk was less then a mile I really don't see how these are the actions of a woman who wasn't already mental disturbed before this attack.
So.... 5,279 feet would have been more acceptable?

She was being stalked, if I'm not mistaken...and was going to be raped. R.A.P.E.D. Have you ever been raped? Or violated in the slightest? That's the most insensitive thing I've heard in a while.

Yes, maybe not a completely normal reaction, but to be sexually violated, even the idea of it, is completely and utterly nerve wrecking =/

Her reaction was not a reflection of some non-existent string of faulty sanity that wound it's way to some surface in a pool of fear. Being defiled that way does shit to people, especially women. A lot of people don't have the opportunity to repay the people that have victimized them. If anything, I envy her, even if it's only slight :|
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Old 12-26-2008, 05:07 AM   #57
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Re: A Women Who Took Justice Into Her Own Hands

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So.... 5,279 feet would have been more acceptable?

She was being stalked, if I'm not mistaken...and was going to be raped. R.A.P.E.D. Have you ever been raped? Or violated in the slightest? That's the most insensitive thing I've heard in a while.

Yes, maybe not a completely normal reaction, but to be sexually violated, even the idea of it, is completely and utterly nerve wrecking =/

Her reaction was not a reflection of some non-existent string of faulty sanity that wound it's way to some surface in a pool of fear. Being defiled that way does shit to people, especially women. A lot of people don't have the opportunity to repay the people that have victimized them. If anything, I envy her, even if it's only slight :|
yes i agree with this but still, she killed the guy...
i mean an eye for an eye and the world would b blind
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Old 12-26-2008, 05:17 AM   #58
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Re: A Women Who Took Justice Into Her Own Hands

You're right.... dying was honestly far too kind =]

Should strung him up by his ankles, chopped off his package, dipped him in "Buba's" favorite stake sauce and left him hanging in his cell at perfect tea-bagging level.
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Old 01-27-2009, 08:12 PM   #59
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Re: A Women Who Took Justice Into Her Own Hands

I would kill the guy, get my cell and call the cops, then go change clothes and watch tv... lol (Although im not a girl, theres still gay rapists... or ugly girls... hot ones ide enjoy a bit then kill em lulz)
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Old 01-28-2009, 03:49 AM   #60
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Re: A Women Who Took Justice Into Her Own Hands

I think you you should definitely defend yourself if you're about to be raped. And if the person dies in the process that's not the victim's fault. I even think hacking the head the rest of the way off is justifiable in that situation because being stalked for 3 months would put anybody on edge plus it's traumatizing. You'd want to make sure he was dead. That's how I see things, because in so many horror shows, you think the guy is dead but he gets up and kills you from behind and I always think. God if you'd just shot him one more time you'd be alive still. I'd probably have shot him one more time u_u or in this case hacked him randomly several times.

However, usually right after the act people in these situations go into shock which is heavy breathing or hyperventilation, fetal position, denial and maybe even a fainting spell. I think prancing through a public food market with severed head shows signs of mental queerness. I think even having the strength to walk proudly while covered in blood is strange. Whether that's caused by the adrenaline of victory or there was something going on in her head beforehand should be decided by a psychologist not a jury of her peers. I don't think she should be tried for homicide.
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