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View Poll Results: who would win in Itachi vs. Pain
Pain 39 50.65%
Itachi 38 49.35%
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Old 03-19-2009, 06:04 PM   #31
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Re: Itachi vs Pain who would win

You ppl do realize Itachi is kage level?

Against Sasuke he used amateratsu two times, tsukuyomi one time, and Susanoo one time. And he was at 50 % of his strength at the time.
So do the math people, how many times can he use these MS techs, multiply with two.

Like I said, MS is an important part of the fight, but it's not the most important thing. Itachi can use other techniques to bring down lesser bodies.
And Pein's bodies are not immune to genjutsu. Jiraiya showed that. And Itachi is a genjutsu master.

Oh yeah, Itachi would of course hide himself, he wouldn't stand in the middle of the field staring at Pein.
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Also Kin and Gin as substitute for kyuubi chakra (the greatest amount of chakra in Naruto world) is something Kishi pulled out of his ass. I lost major respect. It would be like near the end of LOTR there happens to be another slightly weaker ring and Sauron is like "that will do". It kind of shits on everything established up to that point. It kind of insults my intelligence.

Last edited by superninja; 03-19-2009 at 06:06 PM.
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Old 03-19-2009, 06:05 PM   #32
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Re: Itachi vs Pain who would win

Lol, the DB stated and I quote: sasanoo can deflect corporial and noncorporial attacks. Meaning, any tensai, tenin will be reflected. The mirrior has all five elemental proporties that allows it to counter any. lol, sasnoo is the one jutsu that could win this fight for itachi. and as we saw in the fight with sasuke, itachi was able to move forward while still be protected by sasanoo. So, by whipping out sasanoo off the bat, all summons, demons and evas attacks will be deflected. So, all itachi has to do is whip out the sword of tetsuka and start sealing a chunk of nagatos spirit one realm at a time. Now, deva no doubt will make a run for it, but he cant avoid amaterasu or defend if the mirror of sasanoo will just deflect it. So, it is possible if itachi wips out sasanoo off the bat IMO. Other than that, itachi doesnt have the stamina to possible last IMO.
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KNOWLEDGE TO LIVE BY...

No matter how POWERFUL/STRONG you are. If you cannot CATCH your Enemy, all you POWER/STRENGTH is no more USEFUL then a squirt gun....
And if You cannot possibly TRACK/REACT to your enemies attacks to Defend yourself, then how can you possibly stop him from DEFEATING you at WILL...


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People live relying on they're Knowledge and Perception, and thus are bound to them.....
Those Boundaries are what they tend to accept as "Reality".....
However..... Knowledge and Perception are both ambiguous....
so "Reality" could be nothing more....
then an illusion....


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Old 03-19-2009, 06:06 PM   #33
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Re: Itachi vs Pain who would win

Quote:
Originally Posted by superninja View Post
You ppl do realize Itachi is kage level?
Do you not realize that Pain is also Kage level?

Quote:
Originally Posted by superninja View Post
Against Sasuke he used amateratsu two times, tsukuyomi one time, and Susanoo one time. And he was at 50 % of his strength at the time.
So do the math people, how many times can he use these MS techs, multiply with two.
& this means what exactly? His jutsu still cause negative effects which would make him extremely vulnerable. Amaterasu would be compleately useless same with tsukuyomi. Sasanoo drains his life force & since it's made up of chakra it can be taken down by Hungry Ghost.

Quote:
Originally Posted by superninja View Post
Like I said, MS is an important part of the fight, but it's not the most important thing. Itachi can use other techniques to bring down lesser bodies.
And Pein's bodies are not immune to genjutsu. Jiraiya showed that. And Itachi is a genjutsu master.
Jiraiya used sound genjutsu that hits the opponent by entering the ears. Pain does not have super ears he has super eyes which are the strongest eyes in the Naruto world. Pain also uses high level forms of genjutsu as well. Like I said before since he has the better eyes it means he'll be able to overpowetr Itachi's genjutsu since it's based on vision & not sound.

Quote:
Originally Posted by superninja View Post
Oh yeah, Itachi would of course hide himself, he wouldn't stand in the middle of the field staring at Pein.
Hide & do what piss his pants?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Konnaha_yellow_flash View Post
Lol, the DB stated and I quote: sasanoo can deflect corporial and noncorporial attacks. Meaning, any tensai, tenin will be reflected. The mirrior has all five elemental proporties that allows it to counter any. lol, sasnoo is the one jutsu that could win this fight for itachi. and as we saw in the fight with sasuke, itachi was able to move forward while still be protected by sasanoo. So, by whipping out sasanoo off the bat, all summons, demons and evas attacks will be deflected. So, all itachi has to do is whip out the sword of tetsuka and start sealing a chunk of nagatos spirit one realm at a time. Now, deva no doubt will make a run for it, but he cant avoid amaterasu or defend if the mirror of sasanoo will just deflect it. So, it is possible if itachi wips out sasanoo off the bat IMO. Other than that, itachi doesnt have the stamina to possible last IMO.
Is Sasanoo not made up of chakra? I still say Hungray Ghost would eat it .
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Old 03-19-2009, 06:14 PM   #34
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Re: Itachi vs Pain who would win

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vengeance View Post
Is Sasanoo not made up of chakra? I still say Hungray Ghost would eat it .
HG would have to be very close to do that if he could.but What would stop a kamikaze suiton clone from putting HG out since hes weak against physical attacks or something else? Well, the more I think about it, HGs abilitiy to absorb should be delected as well IMO. IDK, let me check out the DB on this one, lol.

ANd I quote:The reason why Susano-o is boasted to be flawless in both offense and defence is due to the "spiritual equipments" held in both hands. The right hand wields the Totsukano Tsurugi sword that can bring down any enemies; the left hand holds the Yatano Kagami (Eight Span Mirror), which can repel all attacks. Be it physical or spiritual, ninjutsu or physical attacks, all these become futile in front of such godly effects.
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KNOWLEDGE TO LIVE BY...

No matter how POWERFUL/STRONG you are. If you cannot CATCH your Enemy, all you POWER/STRENGTH is no more USEFUL then a squirt gun....
And if You cannot possibly TRACK/REACT to your enemies attacks to Defend yourself, then how can you possibly stop him from DEFEATING you at WILL...


MINATO "KYF" NAMIKAZE.

People live relying on they're Knowledge and Perception, and thus are bound to them.....
Those Boundaries are what they tend to accept as "Reality".....
However..... Knowledge and Perception are both ambiguous....
so "Reality" could be nothing more....
then an illusion....


ITACHI UCHIHA

Last edited by Konnaha_yellow_flash; 03-19-2009 at 06:17 PM.
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Old 03-19-2009, 06:19 PM   #35
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Re: Itachi vs Pain who would win

If HG was too close to Susanoo he would get sealed by Susanoo's sword.
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The great off panel war has begun...also called the war of one panel because most fights started and ended in one panel.

Also Kin and Gin as substitute for kyuubi chakra (the greatest amount of chakra in Naruto world) is something Kishi pulled out of his ass. I lost major respect. It would be like near the end of LOTR there happens to be another slightly weaker ring and Sauron is like "that will do". It kind of shits on everything established up to that point. It kind of insults my intelligence.
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Old 03-19-2009, 06:20 PM   #36
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Re: Itachi vs Pain who would win

Quote:
Susanoo possesses a flawless offense and defense thanks to the "incorporeal tools" he holds in both of his hands. The "Sword of Totsuka" in his right hand cuts down any opponent, while the "Mirror of Yata" in his left hand rejects any attack. Material, incorporeal, ninjutsu, physical attacks: all these have no meaning in front of the god."
Material- Physical objects

Incorporeal- Genjutsu

Ninjutsu- all elements

Physical- self explanatory

Gravity is one of the forces of the universe, present everywhere. Its not an element, its not an object, its not genjutsu its just everywhere.

That is the weapon Pein wields, how is Susano'O going to guards against something that can't be seen, felt or touched ?? Where does it say Susano'O can negate gravity ??

What is stopping Deva from smashing Itachi with the forces that are ever present everywhere ??

Face it Itachi is completely outmatched by all 6.

Nagato has way more stamina, summons, can eat any jutsu, can revive his fallen bodies on top of that the rinegan.

Last edited by Dagoro; 03-19-2009 at 06:23 PM.
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Old 03-19-2009, 06:22 PM   #37
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Re: Itachi vs Pain who would win

Quote:
Originally Posted by Konnaha_yellow_flash View Post
HG would have to be very close to do that if he could.but What would stop a kamikaze suiton clone from putting HG out since hes weak against physical attacks or something else? Well, the more I think about it, HGs abilitiy to absorb should be delected as well IMO. IDK, let me check out the DB on this one, lol.
DB won't help you here. What makes you think Itachi has enough chakra to simultaneously mantain Sasanoo, fight off summons with it from the outside, create, suiton clones all at the same time? Look at how quickly Hungry Ghost got Naruto out of sage mode. Even with this setup I'll throw something else at you now. Say Itachi does create a clone like this what's stopping Demon Realm from entering a hole in Susanoo created by Hungry Ghost(he drains extremely fast) & using his laser on Itachi's face?

Edit: Anyway I'm going out so have fun. I'll respond later if this thread isn't closed by then.
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FOOLS! Time is no obstacle for utter lunacy! Reality is but an illusion that can be ignored if the insane demand it!
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1) There may well be some literary or map correlation between the Uzumaki and Ireland.
Check out this awesome manga called Magi.

Wanna join me come and play, but I mite shoot you in your face. Bombs and bullets will do the trick. What we need here is a little bit of panic! ~ Get Jinxed

Last edited by Vengeance; 03-19-2009 at 06:25 PM.
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Old 03-19-2009, 06:26 PM   #38
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Re: Itachi vs Pain who would win

My opinion -- Pain wins.

I'm not going to go into all of my reasonings.
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Old 03-19-2009, 06:33 PM   #39
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Re: Itachi vs Pain who would win

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dagoro1988 View Post
Material- Physical objects

Incorporeal- Genjutsu

Ninjutsu- all elements

Physical- self explanatory

Gravity is one of the forces of the universe, present everywhere. Its not an element, its not an object, its not genjutsu its just everywhere.

That is the weapon Pein wields, how is Susano'O going to guards against something that can't be seen, felt or touched ?? Where does it say Susano'O can negate gravity ??

What is stopping Deva from smashing Itachi with the forces that are ever present everywhere ??

Face it Itachi is completely outmatched by all 6.

Nagato has way more stamina, summons, can eat any jutsu, can revive his fallen bodies on top of that the rinegan.
Gravity is force that Physically/externaly effects things so its counts as a ninjutsu/physical attack. How else does deva use it? Its ninjutsu sir so it can be deflected as said in the DB.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vengeance View Post
DB won't help you here. What makes you think Itachi has enough chakra to simultaneously mantain Sasanoo, fight off summons with it from the outside, create, suiton clones all at the same time? Look at how quickly Hungry Ghost got Naruto out of sage mode. Even with this setup I'll throw something else at you now. Say Itachi does create a clone like this what's stopping Demon Realm from entering a hole in Susanoo created by Hungry Ghost(he drains extremely fast) & using his laser on Itachi's face?

Edit: Anyway I'm going out so have fun. I'll respond later if this thread isn't closed by then.
After finding out HG cant absorb the attack, itachi doesnt need anyother jutsu exept sasanoo to fight. And even if he needs, itachi can use one amaterasu to catch deva trying to escape. So, itachi with sasanoo off the bat, with full chakra may very well be able to defeat pain IMO.
__________________
KNOWLEDGE TO LIVE BY...

No matter how POWERFUL/STRONG you are. If you cannot CATCH your Enemy, all you POWER/STRENGTH is no more USEFUL then a squirt gun....
And if You cannot possibly TRACK/REACT to your enemies attacks to Defend yourself, then how can you possibly stop him from DEFEATING you at WILL...


MINATO "KYF" NAMIKAZE.

People live relying on they're Knowledge and Perception, and thus are bound to them.....
Those Boundaries are what they tend to accept as "Reality".....
However..... Knowledge and Perception are both ambiguous....
so "Reality" could be nothing more....
then an illusion....


ITACHI UCHIHA

Last edited by Konnaha_yellow_flash; 03-19-2009 at 06:40 PM.
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Old 03-19-2009, 06:36 PM   #40
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Re: Itachi vs Pain who would win

Quote:
Originally Posted by superninja View Post
You ppl do realize Itachi is kage level?

Against Sasuke he used amateratsu two times, tsukuyomi one time, and Susanoo one time. And he was at 50 % of his strength at the time.
So do the math people, how many times can he use these MS techs, multiply with two.

Like I said, MS is an important part of the fight, but it's not the most important thing. Itachi can use other techniques to bring down lesser bodies.
And Pein's bodies are not immune to genjutsu. Jiraiya showed that. And Itachi is a genjutsu master.

Oh yeah, Itachi would of course hide himself, he wouldn't stand in the middle of the field staring at Pein.

Thanks for reminding me about this
Yes,Genjutsu work against Pains puppets (Corpses)
It's seem that Jiraiya's genjutsu finished Pain 3 bodies off
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/379/05/

then Itachi's genjutsu which is High genjutsu level (and best genjutsu user through the story) what will do
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Old 03-19-2009, 06:40 PM   #41
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Re: Itachi vs Pain who would win

Quote:
Gravity is force that Physically/externaly effects things
That part alone pokes a huge hole in your argument. Gravity is everywhere, Susano'O can protect itachi from any attack ( even tough it was only tested against Kunai and kirin ) but does not exemp itachi from being effected by other forces and elements of Nature.

Deva can use gravity to effect anything no matter the size. What is stopping Deva from bypassing Susano'O's defense and enact that force on Itachi's body ??

@Namee

Itachi's genjutsu work through sight, Jiraya's was a sound based genjutsu which paralized their nerves giving jiraya a chance to stab them with those blades.

Last edited by Dagoro; 03-19-2009 at 06:48 PM.
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Old 03-19-2009, 06:43 PM   #42
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Re: Itachi vs Pain who would win

I can agree that itachis gen is top notch, but the more bodies itachi putts under with tsukuyomi, the more the effectiveness might be loss IMO. So, I would say three or four bodies at the most, but that would take alot of chakra as well. So, its seems that sasanoo is the only way for itachi to win against pain IMO.
__________________
KNOWLEDGE TO LIVE BY...

No matter how POWERFUL/STRONG you are. If you cannot CATCH your Enemy, all you POWER/STRENGTH is no more USEFUL then a squirt gun....
And if You cannot possibly TRACK/REACT to your enemies attacks to Defend yourself, then how can you possibly stop him from DEFEATING you at WILL...


MINATO "KYF" NAMIKAZE.

People live relying on they're Knowledge and Perception, and thus are bound to them.....
Those Boundaries are what they tend to accept as "Reality".....
However..... Knowledge and Perception are both ambiguous....
so "Reality" could be nothing more....
then an illusion....


ITACHI UCHIHA
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Old 03-19-2009, 06:49 PM   #43
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Re: Itachi vs Pain who would win

Damn, I thought someone wouldve posted by now. Sorry for the double post.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dagoro1988 View Post
That part alone pokes a huge hole in your argument. Gravity is everywhere, Susano'O can protect itachi from any attack ( even tough it was only tested against Kunai and kirin ) but does not exemp itachi from being effected by other forces and elements of Narute.

Deva can use gravity to effect anything no matter the size. What is stopping Deva from bypassing Susano'O's defense and enact that force on Itachi's body ??

@Namee

Itachi's genjutsu work through sight, Jiraya's was a sound based genjutsu
The shield deflects all attacks! All pain does is use chakra along with some kind of elements to bind the fabric of Time/space allowing attraction and repeling. So, since what should be a T/S jutsu, is a ninjutsu, it should be reflected. Im not saying deva cant minupulate the gravity outside sasanoo, but ninjutsu cant get through as stated by the DB. The moment the force tries to penitrate the sasanoo, it will just be delfected.
__________________
KNOWLEDGE TO LIVE BY...

No matter how POWERFUL/STRONG you are. If you cannot CATCH your Enemy, all you POWER/STRENGTH is no more USEFUL then a squirt gun....
And if You cannot possibly TRACK/REACT to your enemies attacks to Defend yourself, then how can you possibly stop him from DEFEATING you at WILL...


MINATO "KYF" NAMIKAZE.

People live relying on they're Knowledge and Perception, and thus are bound to them.....
Those Boundaries are what they tend to accept as "Reality".....
However..... Knowledge and Perception are both ambiguous....
so "Reality" could be nothing more....
then an illusion....


ITACHI UCHIHA

Last edited by Konnaha_yellow_flash; 03-19-2009 at 06:58 PM.
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Old 03-19-2009, 06:58 PM   #44
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Re: Itachi vs Pain who would win

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vengeance View Post
Jiraiya used sound genjutsu that hits the opponent by entering the ears. Pain does not have super ears he has super eyes which are the strongest eyes in the Naruto world. Pain also uses high level forms of genjutsu as well. Like I said before since he has the better eyes it means he'll be able to overpowetr Itachi's genjutsu since it's based on vision & not sound.
You are right and I agree with you but about the part Pain's Genjutsu can I overpowered Itachi's Genjutsu
as we know Pain can use any class (Genjutsu one of them) but he didn't use Genjutsu so that we don't know how it's work and I guess Sharingan Genjutsu are more powerful than Rinnegan Genjutsu

Sharingan,Byakugan and Rinnegan each one have their unique ability (All I know Sharingan are best in Ninjutsu & Genjutsu)
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Old 03-19-2009, 07:06 PM   #45
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Re: Itachi vs Pain who would win

Pain probably wins.
He has far more chakra and can easily outlast Itachi.

Sure, Itachi is strong and has an awesome array of jutsu, and plus, we never saw him in a real battle, so we don't know how would be fare, but with the evidence we now have, Pain is the most probable victor.

I am not saying that Itachi does not have a chance, because, like stated I stated in my arguments below, he does have one.

Pain's summons would be turned against him though, since genjtusu easily affects summons as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dagoro1988 View Post
Amateratsu- The flames are not hotter than the sun. If they were these trees would be nothing but ash.

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/396/09/
It is said that the flames are hotter then the Sun, so they are.
You could also say that if they were even regular flames, Karin's back would be burned, but they weren't because Kishimoto didn't want them to burn her.

If it burned Frog Stomach, they will burn a Path like butter. Plus, Itachi can redirect it to the next target right away.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dagoro1988 View Post
Tsukuyomi- The six paths are corpses controlled with chakra. even if Tsukoyomi was to have an effect on one of Pein's bodies he can just release control returning that bodie back into a useless corpse.
I am not sure if a Path would be affected, but if he would Nagato would too - everything that a Path sees, Nagato sees as well. So if a Path drinks up Tsukiyomi, Nagato screams.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dagoro1988 View Post
Susano'O- This thing was tested against Kunai, great. The mirror shield blocks all jutsu, fair enough, however Pein manipulates gravity at will and that shit is everywhere. No where does it say the mirror shield can negate the forces of Nature.
Don't be ridiculous.
If it's said that Yata's mirror can block anything, then it can.
Shinra Tensei will NOT be effective on him because he does not posses a physical form.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dagoro1988 View Post
So please refrain from retarted arguments such as:

Itachi can kill them all with amateratsu, itachi can kill them all with tsukuyomi and Susano'o will kO all of Pein's bodies, which is true however there is no evidence that Susano'o can move meaning all Pein has to do is move away and wait till it kills itachi. Also, Itachi cannot machine gun amateratsu, we all have seen the effects it has on him after a few uses.
We have seen a diseased, and eye-fucked Itachi.
Not full powered, and bloodlusted Itachi.

[quote=Databook3]
The reason why Susano-o is boasted to be flawless in both offense and defence is due to the "spiritual equipments" held in both hands. The right hand wields the Totsukano Tsurugi sword that can bring down any enemies; the left hand holds the Yatano Kagami (Eight Span Mirror), which can repel all attacks. Be it physical or spiritual, ninjutsu or physical attacks, all these become futile in front of such godly effects.

Small caption of the gourd:
The sake that spills from the gourd forms the shape of a sword and the Totsukano Tsurugi appears! Also, spirits absorbed by the sword gets sealed back into the gourd.

Small caption of Totsukano Tsurugi:
In the same line as Kusanagi no Tsurugi, this sword has the power to eternally seal the person it stabs in a hypnotic world. The sword itself possesses "Fuuinjutsu" (sealing technique).

Small caption of Yata no Kagami:
A spiritual shield that does not possess a physical form. It has all the "Seishitsu Henka" (Element modifying ability) capabilities and can nullify all jutsu by changing its own elemental nature accordingly.[/qoute]

This is how powerful Susano-O is.

One thing more - you said that all Pain has to do is move away from Susano-O and let it kill Itachi.
That means that Pains knows all the jutsu of Itachi. Then you should count that Itachi knows all about Pain, which would make his chances grow insanely. I dare say that he stomps Pain if he knows his every move.

Itachi's handseals and speed are insane, even Kakashi couldn't see it with his Sharingan. The same Kakashi who followed Deva in battle very well. He was defeated eventually, but anyway.

---------

You totally took one side, which was obvious. The fact that you hate Uchihas makes you biased and thus, a bad debating opponent.
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