Minnesota Mom Hit With $1.5 Million Fine for Downloading 24 Songs - Page 3

stubborn_d0nkey · 11-09-2010, 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mal

Bullshit. We wouldn't need a legal system if, say, only 10% of guys would rape a girl if there were no consequences? That's idiotic. A legal system isn't only required if the majority of your society can't help but kill each other unless you threaten them.

Damn, learn to read. I didnt say that no legal system would be needed, just that we wouldn't need one like we have today, or have less need for one like we have today.

**Mal** · 11-09-2010, 11:05 AM

Why? Explain to me how today's legal system could be improved to accommodate a greater number of legitimately honest citizens who aren't just doing what the law tells them to do.

stubborn_d0nkey · 11-09-2010, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mal

Why? Explain to me how today's legal system could be improved to accommodate a greater number of legitimately honest citizens who aren't just doing what the law tells them to do.

I must have overestimated OH. I was under the impression that a member would be able to see how today's legal system has elements that try to effect the "morality" of the masses and effect the decisions of the masses, not just punish them for doing something that goes against the law.

Anways, considering my laziness, it would take too much deliberation to provide you with a quality framework. Since you seem intent to put me down I see no reason why I should provide you with a poor estimation of how such a legal system would look like to give you material to do just that.

**Mal** · 11-09-2010, 11:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stubborn_d0nkey

I must have overestimated OH. I was under the impression that a member would be able to see how today's legal system has elements that try to effect the "morality" of the masses and effect the decisions of the masses, not just punish them for doing something that goes against the law.

But trying to affect the morality of society isn't a necessary part of today's legal system, anyway. Saying that we could have a system without it if only [blah blah blah] is inaccurate because we don't need it in the first place.

ask me anything · 11-09-2010, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axiom

@AMA
1st: I would not advertise the fact that you are a thief dude. Generally that is not something people consider to be cool. If anything similar to the following has ever happened to you then disregard my remarks.

Person A)"I steal shit because I can and, I'm entitled to it".
Person B)"Awesome please come hang out at my home with all my cool shit I worked hard as hell to pay for."

Well, I certainly don't advertise this shit in RL. But this is the internet, so whatever. There's only 1 person on this forum that actually knows me in RL, and he's my brother. Whether or not people find it "cool" is irrelevant. It simply is what it is.

Quote:

2nd:

I would hope that simply getting caught, and being punished. Is not your average joes motivation to keep from going on a raping spree.

I was merely speaking from a logical standpoint as to why most people would never commit rape. I wouldn't do it regardless, because of moral issues. Before anyone says anything, yes I do realize the hypocrisy in what I just said.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mal

Who are you to say they are charging too much? Just because you're a cheap bastard doesn't mean their prices are ridiculous.

In some items they are. I have first hand knowledge of this, since I am a truck driver who does deliveries to several of the grocery chains in my area. Most of the products I deliver are marked up about 120%-150% by the stores. That's insanely high. I've talked to several of the other deliver guys I run into, and they say the same things.

**Mal** · 11-09-2010, 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ask me anything

In some items they are. I have first hand knowledge of this, since I am a truck driver who does deliveries to several of the grocery chains in my area. Most of the products I deliver are marked up about 120%-150% by the stores. That's insanely high. I've talked to several of the other deliver guys I run into, and they say the same things.

That is how business works.

Let's suppose the store pays $0.50 for an apple then mark it up 100% and sell this apple for $1.00, making a $0.50 "profit." Assuming most employees are making a (ridiculously low) wage of $5/hour, they have to sell 10 apples per hour to pay a single employee.

Now let's imagine they use a "more reasonable" mark up of 30%, and sell the apple for $0.65. Now making a $0.15 profit, they have to sell 34 apples to pay that same, single employee.

That's not even taking into account that some employees will make more than this, and all the utility/rental costs incurred by the building itself.

ask me anything · 11-09-2010, 05:46 PM

While all that is true, there are other factors involved like competition, and availability. I live in is a very small town that has only 1 grocery store, and they charge higher then average prices just because they know the nearest competitor is 20 miles away. They no it's more convenient for people to shop their and pay more, then for people to drive 20 miles and pay less, but spend more time doing so. That's why I feel no guilt stealing from those guys, because they are price gouging me to begin with.

**Miburo** · 11-09-2010, 06:32 PM

Businesses making money though use of totally legitimate practices like taking advantage of location?! UNACCEPTABLE!

Nah, I'm pretty sure AMA is black. So he can't help it. Whatever. = )

I'm cool with stealing if it's done out of necessity to survive, or when more honorable methods of dealing with scum aren't legitimate options. Like, if I was working at walmart and my store manager treats me like ass, but won't accept my challenge to unarmed combat and will press charges if I assault him... I'd find stealing shit from his store to be an acceptable alternative, since he had to be a pussy about shit. His fault, he should have fought me like a man when he had the chance.

ask me anything · 11-09-2010, 06:48 PM

Nope, I'm white.

**Mal** · 11-09-2010, 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ask me anything

While all that is true, there are other factors involved like competition, and availability. I live in is a very small town that has only 1 grocery store, and they charge higher then average prices just because they know the nearest competitor is 20 miles away. They no it's more convenient for people to shop their and pay more, then for people to drive 20 miles and pay less, but spend more time doing so. That's why I feel no guilt stealing from those guys, because they are price gouging me to begin with.

So you should be able to avoid travel expenses and pay the same for goods, but the store isn't allowed to recoup the additional cost they pay to have their products shipped that extra distance?

Kinako · 11-09-2010, 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miburo

Businesses making money though use of totally legitimate practices like taking advantage of location?! UNACCEPTABLE!

Nah, I'm pretty sure AMA is black. So he can't help it. Whatever. = )

I'm cool with stealing if it's done out of necessity to survive, or when more honorable methods of dealing with scum aren't legitimate options. Like, if I was working at walmart and my store manager treats me like ass, but won't accept my challenge to unarmed combat and will press charges if I assault him... I'd find stealing shit from his store to be an acceptable alternative, since he had to be a pussy about shit. His fault, he should have fought me like a man when he had the chance.

QFT. The boss should have taken an ass whooping behind Door # 1.

edit: Us negroes know bout them bidness thangs too

KillerNN · 11-09-2010, 06:59 PM

Not all blacks steal.

Fuck that.
Also, I understand where both sides are coming from - but AMA your situation is unique. Most people (or urban folks) don't have to drive 20 miles to the nearest store. [and the store that is close overprices shit]
But what Mal is saying, is that is what business is about - obviously - gaining profit. Paying employees, Billboards, Building costs, etc. is generally the reason prices are higher at some stores.

A gallon of milk at Walmart is about 3 dollars, but at the corner store its about 5-6. Corner stores make less money, so they charge more.

Edit:This discussion has strayed from the original topic.

Axiom · 11-09-2010, 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ask me anything

Well, I certainly don't advertise this shit in RL. But this is the internet, so whatever. There's only 1 person on this forum that actually knows me in RL, and he's my brother. Whether or not people find it "cool" is irrelevant. It simply is what it is.

Poor word choice. My meaning was.
cool=/=popular
cool=morally acceptable

It just seemed like an odd thing to brag about. As Miduro said under extenuating circumstances I would not look at it so harshly either. However wobbling into your local Walgreens, and walking out with a pack of disposable bic razors. Does not equal you battling against a perceived injustice.

Plus I feel a certain satisfaction being able to plop down the plastic, and pay for the things I need. May not be able to afford the biggest TV or the nicest car, but I don't need those things either.

Quote:

While all that is true, there are other factors involved like competition, and availability. I live in is a very small town that has only 1 grocery store, and they charge higher then average prices just because they know the nearest competitor is 20 miles away. They no it's more convenient for people to shop their and pay more, then for people to drive 20 miles and pay less, but spend more time doing so. That's why I feel no guilt stealing from those guys, because they are price gouging me to begin with.

It has been while since I worked in a retail environment, but the company I worked for had an acceptable/expected amount of loss per day/week/month. Now just having you steal their merchandise might not exceed that limit. Imagine though that a dozen or 100 people are stealing, and the loss is driven higher than whats acceptable. Your grocery store would then be forced to try and recover that money through 'raising prices'.

Thus you may inadvertently be battling against your own cause.

**Mal** · 11-09-2010, 11:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KillerNN

Also, I understand where both sides are coming from - but AMA your situation is unique. Most people (or urban folks) don't have to drive 20 miles to the nearest store. [and the store that is close overprices shit]
But what Mal is saying, is that is what business is about - obviously - gaining profit. Paying employees, Billboards, Building costs, etc. is generally the reason prices are higher at some stores.

Not to mention I (and my parents) never had a problem paying for what we needed in the small town in which I lived for 8 years. It was also 20ish miles from the nearest city.

ask me anything · 11-10-2010, 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axiom

Poor word choice. My meaning was.
cool=/=popular
cool=morally acceptable

It just seemed like an odd thing to brag about. As Miduro said under extenuating circumstances I would not look at it so harshly either. However wobbling into your local Walgreens, and walking out with a pack of disposable bic razors. Does not equal you battling against a perceived injustice.

I wasn't bragging about anything. I just used that to give some sense of perceptive in the example I gave. Nothing else. And I'm not saying I steal shit to fight injustice or anything. Not sure where you got that from. I'm just saying I don't lose any sleep at night over it.

Also I'm not even trying to make the argument that my actions are legitimate simply because I may have a reason behind it. Stealing is wrong, anyway you look at it. I just don't care. My sense of what is "morally acceptable" is just different then the normal views of society. I do what I do because it rewards me for doing so. Bottom line, I'm just a greedy person.

Quote:

It has been while since I worked in a retail environment, but the company I worked for had an acceptable/expected amount of loss per day/week/month. Now just having you steal their merchandise might not exceed that limit. Imagine though that a dozen or 100 people are stealing, and the loss is driven higher than whats acceptable. Your grocery store would then be forced to try and recover that money through 'raising prices'.

Thus you may inadvertently be battling against your own cause.

Not even trying to sound like an asshole or anything, but what others do is not my concern. I could care less if 100 people steal shit. They're the ones in charge of their own lives, and have to face the penalty for being caught. I do get what your saying though, and it sucks that my actions might effect other peoples lives. Though I will say the people who work at my local store are the biggest thieves of them all. I've seen many cashiers "sliding groceries" through the register to people they know. Every time the store has some promotional give-a-way (like a BBQ grill) the store manager (who is suppose to give it away to the customers) ends up taking the shit home. So yeah, I don't lose sleep over my actions, when there are others doing far worse.

11-09-2010, 11:05 AM	#32
Mal Scotch Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 3,103 Thanks: 12,878 Thanked 10,830 Times in 3,841 Posts	Re: Minnesota Mom Hit With $1.5 Million Fine for Downloading 24 Songs Why? Explain to me how today's legal system could be improved to accommodate a greater number of legitimately honest citizens who aren't just doing what the law tells them to do.

11-09-2010, 05:46 PM	#37
ask me anything Simply AMAzing Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Impel Down Posts: 3,061 Thanks: 8,850 Thanked 3,367 Times in 1,502 Posts	Re: Minnesota Mom Hit With $1.5 Million Fine for Downloading 24 Songs While all that is true, there are other factors involved like competition, and availability. I live in is a very small town that has only 1 grocery store, and they charge higher then average prices just because they know the nearest competitor is 20 miles away. They no it's more convenient for people to shop their and pay more, then for people to drive 20 miles and pay less, but spend more time doing so. That's why I feel no guilt stealing from those guys, because they are price gouging me to begin with. __________________

11-09-2010, 06:32 PM	#38
Miburo Deos Fortioribus Adesse Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Valhalla Posts: 3,543 Thanks: 34,417 Thanked 17,643 Times in 5,442 Posts	Re: Minnesota Mom Hit With $1.5 Million Fine for Downloading 24 Songs Businesses making money though use of totally legitimate practices like taking advantage of location?! UNACCEPTABLE! Nah, I'm pretty sure AMA is black. So he can't help it. Whatever. = ) I'm cool with stealing if it's done out of necessity to survive, or when more honorable methods of dealing with scum aren't legitimate options. Like, if I was working at walmart and my store manager treats me like ass, but won't accept my challenge to unarmed combat and will press charges if I assault him... I'd find stealing shit from his store to be an acceptable alternative, since he had to be a pussy about shit. His fault, he should have fought me like a man when he had the chance.

11-09-2010, 06:48 PM	#39
ask me anything Simply AMAzing Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Impel Down Posts: 3,061 Thanks: 8,850 Thanked 3,367 Times in 1,502 Posts	Re: Minnesota Mom Hit With $1.5 Million Fine for Downloading 24 Songs Nope, I'm white. __________________

11-09-2010, 06:59 PM	#42
KillerNN Λυρικής Σκέψεις Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Vagabond Posts: 2,097 Thanks: 3,614 Thanked 4,322 Times in 1,976 Posts	Re: Minnesota Mom Hit With $1.5 Million Fine for Downloading 24 Songs Not all blacks steal. Fuck that. Also, I understand where both sides are coming from - but AMA your situation is unique. Most people (or urban folks) don't have to drive 20 miles to the nearest store. [and the store that is close overprices shit] But what Mal is saying, is that is what business is about - obviously - gaining profit. Paying employees, Billboards, Building costs, etc. is generally the reason prices are higher at some stores. A gallon of milk at Walmart is about 3 dollars, but at the corner store its about 5-6. Corner stores make less money, so they charge more. Edit:This discussion has strayed from the original topic. __________________ The Cap'n Last edited by KillerNN; 11-09-2010 at 07:04 PM.

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