kluang

So, who wanna go to Camp Crystal Lake?

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Numinous

Maybe someone might enlighten me on the matter, but how the fuck rating agencies (like Moody's, Standard & Poor's, etc) just cut the ratings of European countries in weeks they're getting back on their feet just to pull the rug and send everything to chaos?

Excuse my ignorance on such matters, but it feels like economical terrorism against the people on those countries, who end up paying the bill.

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Nerox

There are a lot of problems associated with the rating agencies. But the biggest thing is, they actually have no legitimacy to rate countries. They are right, though, and that makes it difficult to stop them. They are an indicator for people who invest in those countries/companies, and rely on the rating from these experts (Though the state has enough competent economists to see that for themselves).

There is talk of founding a european rating agency, but there you have the problem with the legitimacy again. What would be theirs? But there is also no law that forbids the analysis of the economies of countries.

The way Angela Merkel reacted is the only way to stop the agencies to have too much influence on the markets. Just say that it is irrelevant and the countries economy is not influenced by decisions of Moody's or whomever. We still have a economic growth rating of over 1% and no recession, so that shows that a reduction of the German rating would not be correct.

But you also have to see that they are right in some cases. Nothing against your homecountry Num, but Portugal is simply not a good area to invest in at the moment. Such is Greece, Spain. I assume that they want to pressure the EU to get the €-rescue going again.

Numinous

The thing I'm more concerned about is the fact Standard & Poor's used the guillotine in the end of a week where there was a lot of economical recovery for European countries. The agency could've waited a little more to actually have a legitimate reason for the cuts instead of looking like a troll.

About their legitimacy...

Such law to limit the scope of rating agencies is vital in the economical turmoil we're living in. That's why I'm in favor of having an European rating agency IF the scope is limited to country/union companies (not even countries), like S&P (among others) rating US companies only and the European agency rating European companies only.

Yeah, but not everyone is Germany, like you mention later. I speak for Portugal, we don't need any more money or further austerity measures, we just need stability to stay on the boat. Portugal can't simply say "oh, you agencies are nothing" because they're precisely stripping us of what we need.

I'll correct and say that those countries are not good areas for average economists to invest in at the moment. Any economist with enough wits and courage will see those countries as golden opportunities to have them by the balls.

You build some factory there and they'll worship you like a god. Of course profit will be scarce in the near future, but at the long run it'll pay off because those countries will give special benefits for helping them in a time of need. That's what I assume the Chinese who are buying almost everything have in mind, most companies they're buying look like failsauce but give it time and you'll see China-Europe commercial relationships heavily benefiting the former.

About pressuring further the crisis... did the guys running those agencies suddenly forget their XX century history classes?

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ACt

I'm not too concerned - all of global economics seems to be one giant shell game. If everyone was to call in what was owed, we'd probably have under 10,000 people with actual money left.

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It's amazing to me that, unlike in the real world, people on the internet will wear "everyone thinks I'm a moron" as a badge of honour.

kluang

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of..._credit_rating

I agree with law and the rating agency on each region. Not only that we need something to lower the credit rating influence on the economy, nationally.

But for the time being dont use US base credit rating to rate your country. Dagong from China have a recognizable credit rating even its not approve by the US since Dagong been downgrading US year by year

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Spiegel

Had a glass of Guinness with a BBQ bacon cheeseburger and garlic seasoned fries the Tilted Kilt. Best damn pub in Florida! Anyone else been there?

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"Inherited will, the destiny of the age, and the dreams of its people. These are things that will not be stopped. As long as people continue to pursue the meaning of freedom, these things will never cease to be!"
-Gol D. Roger

*Ex-Kakashi87*

ACt

Florida? no I haven't.

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It's amazing to me that, unlike in the real world, people on the internet will wear "everyone thinks I'm a moron" as a badge of honour.

Jaxon

This guy right here. Bacon Cheeseburger and Guinness is the shit.

Axiom

This freakin commercial tricked me into buying a bunch of vagina soap. God damn evil marketing geniuses.

kael03

What's really sad is that the commercial speaks the truth.

kluang

I thought the commercial was clever and funny. And somehow the comments turned it into a sexist and racist thing.

And it makes me wonder

Why do people argue in youtube?

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Jaxon

I have a Firefox addon called Youtube Comment Snob.

I'll let you assume what it does.

Numinous

Only needs to block the messages that quote the video and the arrow-to-the-knee jokes and it's a gift sent from heaven.

But at least the average intelligence of the comments duplicates when installed.

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ACt

Going back to the whole national credit ratings and whatnot, heard an economist on the radio this morning saying that the biggest problem with groups like Standard & Poors was not that they've gone around downgrading European countries now, which is drawing ire, but NOT doing it at the beginning of the crisis. A few years back, when the economic problems began, they refused to drop the credit rating of Greece, which allowed Greece to borrow so much more and dig themselves, and consequently, the rest of Europe into a deeper hole.

Better late than never may not apply here, but whatever. Just thought I'd share.

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It's amazing to me that, unlike in the real world, people on the internet will wear "everyone thinks I'm a moron" as a badge of honour.