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Old 10-17-2012, 08:47 AM   #31
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Re: naruto_Manga_606

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Originally Posted by Numinous View Post
Sorry, I won't shut down my brain just because you ask. Specially in this flashback, this is the do-or-die moment for Kishimoto and he's pretty much fucking it up.

Edit:


That's even worse in terms of the plot hole because he had EMS before Rinnegan, so the age difference would be bigger.

At the rest, you didn't get what the plot hole is. The timeframe you mention was already spent up, Akatsuki vs Hanzou and Danzou already happened by this point and, somehow, Yahiko is alive when he should be dead. Mind you that Kakashi and Rin vs Kirigakure nins happened AFTER the war, since Kirigakure never partook in any war before the Fourth. So, if what you say happens, it doesn't somehow cover up the plot hole, it only makes it deeper.
I hear ya on the wars and the bridge timeframe as I didn't look it up...but the eyes can make sense....Remember the panel shows one eye...his eye that he replaced...he could of simply gave his actual eyes...before rinnegan to Nagato and awoke his rinnegan in his sole replaced eye.
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Old 10-17-2012, 08:49 AM   #32
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Re: naruto_Manga_606

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I'm not asking you to it's cool, I'm jus sayin we all had SOOO many questions about madara and obito. This chapter gave a lot of answers and your complaining about how "old" old ass madara looked when nagato was born? He didn't look young enough for you so your screaming plot hole? Do your thing, it just looks like reaching to me but I'll let you be..
Sorry, what answers? The only answer we got that wasn't already implied before is Black Zetsu's origin.

The pertinent questions weren't answered AT ALL. How did Madara know of Nagato? Why did Kirigakure want Rin for? Why didn't Obito wonder what the fuck was going on? Why Obito spared Kakashi if he was the source of his grief?

If you are honestly entertained by so little, be my guest, but don't even try to act condescending towards me.

Edit:

Quote:
but the eyes can make sense....Remember the panel shows one eye...his eye that he replaced...he could of simply gave his actual eyes...before rinnegan to Nagato and awoke his rinnegan in his sole replaced eye.
No. Notice what happens when people use Rinnegan: they can't turn it off. EdoMadara still has Rinnegan eyes despite not using them for quite some time and the same goes for Nagato and Obito. If that Rinnegan was indeed from the replacement eye, it would show, but it didn't.
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Old 10-17-2012, 09:03 AM   #33
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Re: naruto_Manga_606

U people are hilarious its a fiction manga stop talking about plot holes lmOoo and enjoy it.
This is a mana where Kids can creatig energy shit from their hands, an you expect it to be without plot holes.
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Old 10-17-2012, 09:05 AM   #34
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Re: naruto_Manga_606

I haven't read all of the posts, but I'll be the first if no one is ready to do this.... you were right KYF. From the GM to the "apparent" strong link between the Uzumaki and Senju.

With that being said.... this pretty f'n sad and messed up. I think we're averaging 2 major shitholes a chapter. I thought Nagato was Uzumaki... not Senju.
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Old 10-17-2012, 09:09 AM   #35
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Re: naruto_Manga_606

I am assuming with Madara references Senju lineage about Nagato he is saying that the Uzumaki are like the first sons of the Senju, something like that.

Two Rin theories:

1. Obvious one, Obito was in genjutsu and this never happened the way he thought.

2. Rin was Uzumaki and was going to be taken by the Mist to hold a tailed beast, and when there was no way left before Obito arrived on scene she asked Kakashi to kill her so she would not be taken by the enemy after what the Rock ninja did to her.
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2. Part Two started off alright, it introduced new characters and it continued to show the same potential, honestly, the story had a lot of promise up until the Pain Arc.

3. Pain Arc occurs and all Leaf ninja are revived after they were slaughtered, this started the failing of Kishi because he won't kill off main charcters.

4. Kage Summit was a tad disappointing simply because we didn't see any of the charcters that SHOULD have been introduced during the chuunin exams.

5. The War has been epicly disappointing because Kishi is killing off Edo's in a matter of one chapter when each edo (Kages, Swordsman, Nagato and Itachi) when they should get around 4 or 5 chapters of dedication.

Kishi started cutting the story shorter, his chapters have gotten shorter from 21 pages to 17 per week,

Now if you don't like this reasoning, you can simply go to another forum.
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Old 10-17-2012, 09:10 AM   #36
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Re: naruto_Manga_606

Quote:
Originally Posted by Myth View Post
U people are hilarious its a fiction manga stop talking about plot holes lmOoo and enjoy it.
This is a mana where Kids can creatig energy shit from their hands, an you expect it to be without plot holes.
So, in your opinion, fiction has plot holes by its nature?



Quote:
I haven't read all of the posts, but I'll be the first if no one is ready to do this.... you were right KYF. From the GM to the "apparent" strong link between the Uzumaki and Senju.

With that being said.... this pretty f'n sad and messed up. I think we're averaging 2 major shitholes a chapter. I thought Nagato was Uzumaki... not Senju.
Care to expand on the first paragraph?

About Nagato being Senju, I'd hold my horses and wait for another translation/raw to confirm it. I think it'd stupid from Kishimoto to say Nagato was Uzumaki over and over again and now say he's Senju.
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Old 10-17-2012, 09:16 AM   #37
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Re: naruto_Manga_606

Did Obito just rape Rins corpse? WTF am I reading?!?
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1) There may well be some literary or map correlation between the Uzumaki and Ireland.
Check out this awesome manga called Magi.

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Old 10-17-2012, 09:21 AM   #38
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Re: naruto_Manga_606

Odds are we're going to find out what happened to Rin from Kakashi after this flashback is over. This is technically limited by Obito's memory, so if he never learned the reason it's not going to be in his flashback.

Madara being old as fuck on both ends of a twenty year timeframe isn't inherently plothole-ish. He'd been using the GM to extend his lifespan quite drastically as it was; it's not a far stretch to assume he was just as much of a geezer when he gave the Rinnegan to Nagato as when he met Obito given that he's shown to be using means to extend his lifespan past what it should have been. As for why he looked old way back then, it's again worth remembering that he's connected to the GM. When Nagato tried that shit he went from looking like 20 to looking about 60. I dunno. Doesn't seem bad compared to the horseshit we've seen before.

As for Yahiko not being dead, Nagato is still in "not fucking wheelchair-bound" mode. Ergo, the Hanzo incident hasn't happened yet. It also falls in line with Obito's statements when he was fighting Konan, since he said that he was the one who convinced Yahiko to form Akatsuki. The three Ame orphans are totally alone at this point, no apparent sign of an organized group of allies working with them yet. For the "war should be over by this point" statement with the Mist, we have to remember that we saw A and KB up against Minato during the Third War even though the Lightning country wasn't one of the big three warring nations. There's a definite sense that, even if they're not all-out parts of the battle, all the 5 great villages become entangled in the Great Wars, hence their significance (Leaf and Cloud had a 1 v 1 after Minato's death and that wasn't a "great war").

I'm just saying. We've seen so much worse than this.
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Old 10-17-2012, 09:26 AM   #39
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Re: naruto_Manga_606

So wait now that Tobi is revealed to be Obito Madara's actual clone was Black Zetsu? So let me get this straight Madara's clone was captured by the Mizukage & her fodder group? Herp derp...

O yeah everything is Madara's plan. Obito can die now.
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1) There may well be some literary or map correlation between the Uzumaki and Ireland.
Check out this awesome manga called Magi.

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Last edited by Vengeance; 10-17-2012 at 09:27 AM.
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Old 10-17-2012, 09:27 AM   #40
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Re: naruto_Manga_606

So... that's it? He witnesses the target of his wallflower obsession killed by a teammate he looked up to, wanted to best and eventually honoured with his own eye, kills a whole squad of ninja, kneels down to say good bye to the dead girl... and leaves?!

No Kakashi what happened. No I'm gonna kill you. No take your goddamn eye back. Just a "Ok, Madara, I'm in." sigh.

Oh, inb4 "But Obito, that's not what happened..." Kakashi flashback midbattle.


EDIT: No, seriously, what was the decision behind the Kakashi heart punch to Rin? Just seeing Kakashi beaten and Rin killed by enemy ninja is enough to push Obito down this path. His odds with Konoha would be naturally explained that they propagate the ninja violence and death. Why did Kakashi have to be the one to kill Rin? Seems unnecessary and Obito's reaction is completely discordant with it. Who doesn't dwell on the "why" of it? (Yes, I'm aware this is potentially all manipulation by Madara since he can create a whole world and suck you into it.)
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Old 10-17-2012, 09:30 AM   #41
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Re: naruto_Manga_606

Well, AOTK, that makes (a bit more) sense, although I still have issues:
  • Nagato didn't look old when hooked to Gedou Mazou, but rather eerily ill
  • Kannabi Bridge and Akatsuki vs Hanzou were both closing acts of the Third War, so they should happen in a similar timeframe, not months upon months like the flashback is implying
  • Akatsuki as a force beyond the Ame Orphans happened before/in the beginning of the Third War, not after/in the end of it.
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Old 10-17-2012, 09:32 AM   #42
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Re: naruto_Manga_606

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Sorry, what answers? The only answer we got that wasn't already implied before is Black Zetsu's origin.

The pertinent questions weren't answered AT ALL. How did Madara know of Nagato? Why did Kirigakure want Rin for? Why didn't Obito wonder what the fuck was going on? Why Obito spared Kakashi if he was the source of his grief?

If you are honestly entertained by so little, be my guest, but don't even try to act condescending towards me.

Edit:

No. Notice what happens when people use Rinnegan: they can't turn it off. EdoMadara still has Rinnegan eyes despite not using them for quite some time and the same goes for Nagato and Obito. If that Rinnegan was indeed from the replacement eye, it would show, but it didn't.
W.e like I said if u wanna complain about madara not looking "young" enough in a flash back ill let u be. Your pertinent questions..ill try to hlp you out. How did madara know about nagato? The color of his hair and the fact that he has multiple zetsu that can travel anywhere they want. Probably scouting around for what he's looking for. Why did kirigakure want rin? That's going to be answered by kakashi when the flash backs are over. To me that's obvious. Kakashi is going to tell obito why he killed rin. He didn't just kill her for lol's there was a reason. Obito didnt bother to ask because he didn't care, rin was dead. I got the impression that it didn't matter why to him it's the fact that she died. I don't even think he was pissed that kakashi killer her if he was he would have killed him. He just didnt want rin to die that was the promise. If he wanted kakashi dead he could have killed him then, any time in part 1 and any 1 of the many times he encountered kakashi in part 2. His reasoning will PROBABLY be explain later. That's the only unknown that in my opinion can't be deduced rite now. Just chill and wait for it..

Edit: damn ppl beat me to it...but you see evn other ppl cn see your answers coming up. Just wait for it..

Last edited by Amuro; 10-17-2012 at 09:35 AM.
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Old 10-17-2012, 09:34 AM   #43
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Re: naruto_Manga_606

Rin should have been in Kabuto's secret coffin. Would have been more interesting.


Anyone think Rin will be brought back to life with the intention of explaining what happened?
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1. Naruto's act 1 was really good

2. Part Two started off alright, it introduced new characters and it continued to show the same potential, honestly, the story had a lot of promise up until the Pain Arc.

3. Pain Arc occurs and all Leaf ninja are revived after they were slaughtered, this started the failing of Kishi because he won't kill off main charcters.

4. Kage Summit was a tad disappointing simply because we didn't see any of the charcters that SHOULD have been introduced during the chuunin exams.

5. The War has been epicly disappointing because Kishi is killing off Edo's in a matter of one chapter when each edo (Kages, Swordsman, Nagato and Itachi) when they should get around 4 or 5 chapters of dedication.

Kishi started cutting the story shorter, his chapters have gotten shorter from 21 pages to 17 per week,

Now if you don't like this reasoning, you can simply go to another forum.
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Old 10-17-2012, 09:39 AM   #44
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Re: naruto_Manga_606

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Well, AOTK, that makes (a bit more) sense, although I still have issues:
  • Nagato didn't look old when hooked to Gedou Mazou, but rather eerily ill
  • Kannabi Bridge and Akatsuki vs Hanzou were both closing acts of the Third War, so they should happen in a similar timeframe, not months upon months like the flashback is implying
  • Akatsuki as a force beyond the Ame Orphans happened before/in the beginning of the Third War, not after/in the end of it.
http://www.mangapanda.com/93-452-11/...apter-447.html Not to the same extent as Madara would have to be, but he definitely doesn't look quite his age there.

Kannabi Bridge still happened roughly a year before Obito attacked Konoha, no? There has to be time accounted for in which Obito recovers from the ridiculous-that-he-survived rocks, but that still leaves time for the Hanzo incident and Rin's death to occur. Especially given Obito's out-of-fucking-nowhere "natural proficiency" with all of Madara's powers.

Didn't know that last point, I don't think you're bullshitting but could you spare a panel? Just need confirmation. If that's the case, either it's a plot hole or Obito was lying out the ass. As he has been want to do.
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Old 10-17-2012, 09:41 AM   #45
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Re: naruto_Manga_606

Amuro, I'm not gullible enough to accept pure speculation. All I want from this flashback is answers and I'm not getting them, all I see is more questions and the plot getting hurled around.

I'm truly waiting for this flashback to end to decide if this manga is worth following anymore or not and if the flashback fails at clinging positive attention from me, so I won't sit and have faith on something because you say so. It either gives the warranted answers or not, simple as that.

You may convince yourself of anything, but don't think I'll be convinced by the same fickle reasons. I'm a skeptic first and a reader only after.

Edit:
Quote:
Kannabi Bridge still happened roughly a year before Obito attacked Konoha, no? There has to be time accounted for in which Obito recovers from the ridiculous-that-he-survived rocks, but that still leaves time for the Hanzo incident and Rin's death to occur. Especially given Obito's out-of-fucking-nowhere "natural proficiency" with all of Madara's powers.
Possible, but it's a REALLY tight schedule that is being advocated there. We have less than an year between Kannabi Bridge and Kyuubi incident, the war was already over by some time in the latter and Obito already spent many months in Madara's hideout if the hair is to be believed.

Quote:
Didn't know that last point, I don't think you're bullshitting but could you spare a panel? Just need confirmation. If that's the case, either it's a plot hole or Obito was lying out the ass. As he has been want to do.
If Obito was lying around Konan, it's possible it's one more lie to count. But, as you asked, here's a panel suggesting Akatsuki with multiple members was already a thing in the (beginning of) Third War.
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