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Old 02-06-2013, 08:09 PM   #106
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Re: Naruto_619

All of that still can't counter the fact that Tobirama is not bound by a mortal coil while Sasuke is. Tobirama can't die, can regenerate any damage dealt to him, and has an inexhaustible chakra pool. Sasuke, while extremely impressive in his own rights, doesn't have the means to counter Edo tensei. He doesn't know, and probably isn't will to use, the Shiki Fuujin, he doesn't know any binding seals, and he doesn't have the sword of totsuka last I checked.

I'm not saying it wouldn't be a hell of a fight, but even with what little we know about tobirama's skills he still has the advantage over Sasuke due to being immortal.
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Old 02-06-2013, 08:14 PM   #107
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Re: Naruto_619

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Originally Posted by kael03 View Post
All of that still can't counter the fact that Tobirama is not bound by a mortal coil while Sasuke is. Tobirama can't die, can regenerate any damage dealt to him, and has an inexhaustible chakra pool. Sasuke, while extremely impressive in his own rights, doesn't have the means to counter Edo tensei. He doesn't know, and probably isn't will to use, the Shiki Fuujin, he doesn't know any binding seals, and he doesn't have the sword of totsuka last I checked.

I'm not saying it wouldn't be a hell of a fight, but even with what little we know about tobirama's skills he still has the advantage over Sasuke due to being immortal.
Thats how Itachi said his final goodbye when Kabuto was stuck in Inazami, how could he not remember to hypnotize Oro into doing the handsigns? Actually he will have both tools that Itachi had with his eyetechs, when Itachi died they were attached to his eyes, how can they just disappear? Where'd they go, not being a bastard but after retrieved they don't have a choice in which to stay with the doujutsu or not.

I actually expected that in the storyline, those 2 tools are about the only thing that would keep Sasuke alive in a battle vs Madara until he gets Haras DNA somehow and generate his own Rinnengans.

Don't get me wrong, until or unless Sasuke can seal Tobirama, anything he does is kinda useless unless its something like Armaretsu. Or end the jutsu with Oro, but him dying to 20 Bounty Hunters gives him the most 'fragile' of all the Kages in death to this point. I'm sorry but it would have to be 20 awesome assed bounty hunters to take out Harahirma, or Minato IMHO, so whats that say about Tobirama's unbeatablility.
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Old 02-06-2013, 11:17 PM   #108
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Re: Naruto_619

What if these 20 Bounty hunters were equal to him or Hurizen?
It was never said the calibre or exact skill level of each Bounty Hunter.

For all we know it could have been 10 Gol brothers and 10 Silver brothers.
Just saying. We dont have any details to say, " tibirama can't be that great. Bounty hunters took him out."

See what I'm saying?
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Old 02-07-2013, 12:16 AM   #109
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Re: Naruto_619

I need wat neo has been smokin...they fought madara n his bro wit ms. Plus went to war wit the uchiha. Tobi knows sme shit trust me. U heard madara he was disappointed n the shinobi of the current time. Theses guy REALLY fought n did some things. Sasukes my fav character but until he gets his lil powere up er w.e or showcases something new I dnt see him doing it that's IMO
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Old 02-07-2013, 12:40 AM   #110
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Re: Naruto_619

C'mon Neo, don't go disregarding the strength of those 20 bounty hunters. They were likely some of the very best ninjas in their village. All that really matters is that Tobirama with a group of ninjas that included Danzo and Sarutobi didn't think he would win, therefore him without those guys definitely wouldn't win.

It's kinda like in the beginning of the manga when Sarutobi was holding a meeting of his jounin, and they were interrupted by naruto's scroll stealing nonsense. Most of those guys there have still yet to be seen again much less named, and honestly most looked ridiculously bland, BUT we can assume from them being in that room that they must have some level of skill regardless. Now imagine if Sarutobi (for whatever hypothetical reason) had tried to fight all guys at once. There's no way he would have beat them all right? Just Kakashi, Gai, Kurenai, and Asuma together would be extremely hard to fight, much less the other 20+ people. There's just no way to see, block or counter that many attacks coming from different people and places, unless you got some sort of ultimate defense (Gaara and Sasuke) or ridiculous Space/Time (Minato) jutsu which Sarutobi doesn't. Same thing applies for Tobirama.
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Old 02-07-2013, 02:11 AM   #111
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Re: Naruto_619

Neo, stop quoting narutowiki. It's kinda inconclusive with regards to Tobirama's complete abilities especially when you consider that the Senju brothers's complete abilities were never really disclosed hitherto - Hashirama being a prime example. Even Tobirama's S/T techniques have not been elaborated upon and we both know how much a a bitch they can be. Factor in the thought that he was user/master of S/T TECHNIQUES (plural) would make him a difficult opponent to face. Add to that, him being an Edo and you have one formidable opponent. As for him dying at the hand sof the Cloud Bounty Hunters, it could so easily be retconned for plot convenience, considering the innumerable examples we have to show for that phenomenon.
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Old 02-07-2013, 03:18 AM   #112
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Re: Naruto_619

Decent chapter seems to be leading into answering a few fundamental questions about the clans and the history of the sharingan. Some might not enjoy the story bits but they do make the fighting more interesting.
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Old 02-07-2013, 07:59 AM   #113
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Re: Naruto_619

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Originally Posted by kael03 View Post
All of that still can't counter the fact that Tobirama is not bound by a mortal coil while Sasuke is. Tobirama can't die, can regenerate any damage dealt to him, and has an inexhaustible chakra pool. Sasuke, while extremely impressive in his own rights, doesn't have the means to counter Edo tensei.
No. Just no. That was pretty much the entire point of Itachi and Sasuke vs. Kabuto, shutting down Edo Tensei in even the most extreme of situations.
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Old 02-07-2013, 09:26 AM   #114
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Re: Naruto_619

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Originally Posted by jericho Uzimaki View Post
What if these 20 Bounty hunters were equal to him or Hurizen?
It was never said the calibre or exact skill level of each Bounty Hunter.

For all we know it could have been 10 Gol brothers and 10 Silver brothers.
Just saying. We dont have any details to say, " tibirama can't be that great. Bounty hunters took him out."

See what I'm saying?
Yeah, you make a point, but name any other Bounty Hunters in the history of the manga, ANY, never heard of ANY so bad besides the 2 Kyuubi Chakra eating brothers. If it was so easy to take out 1 Kage with 20 shinobi, and the Leaf was then being ran by Hiruzen at age what 8 or 9, why didn't the Cloud keep going an wipe out the Leaf, inconsistent to just send someone after the Hokage and stop.

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I need wat neo has been smokin...they fought madara n his bro wit ms. Plus went to war wit the uchiha. Tobi knows sme shit trust me. U heard madara he was disappointed n the shinobi of the current time. Theses guy REALLY fought n did some things. Sasukes my fav character but until he gets his lil powere up er w.e or showcases something new I dnt see him doing it that's IMO
What are you smoking? Tobirama prolly had skirmishes but no fight to the death with any relevant character, let alone Uchiha, you're inputing your best guess since he's a Kage. He went to war with old school Uchiha's, and how many of us believe that all the bloodline limts alone for example by other parts of the Alliance were in existance at that time. When did he ever fight a group as promenint or badass as the Akatsuki.... never, and heres the better question, why the rush to diminish Sasuke Uchiha? Just say I don't like the Dude, and because of that no matter what his feat are I'll put him behind some random character.

I've stated the former 2nd Hokage has skills, but IMHO I don't see a defense against Amaretsu, and the time required to release his major offensive weapons, water is far to long to survive Amaretsu, and or a Genjutsu from this class Uchiha. The only logical opinions I've gotten is from Kael, Num, and Ask, IMHO. To assume that Sasuke with EMS, Itachi Eye Techs, and sorry, the Boy has a LOT of experiences, more than 97% of all Jounins, and held his own vs. 4 Kages when backed into a corner. I don't even care about the haters thats shitting on him, just do it logically, stop attempting to put lessor thans like Rock Lee, on par with him because it makes those spewing the shit sound more retarded by the sentence.

Lastly as EOJ states, Sasuke would be named Naruto if he didn't remember how to turn off Edo Tensei. Thats no disrespect either, just honest.

Btw Ask, Tobirama does have a T/S Jutsu, it didn't work well vs. the Bounty Hunters, and not being an ass, just following the 'press' Kish wrote up on the Dude.

Last bit, since Itachi's eyes were transplanted into Sasuke, and he has the Yata Mirror, and the Sealing Sword, what would Tobirama's answer be, I've heard about how he could 'generally' take out Sasuke, how does Tobirama get pass this?
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Old 02-07-2013, 09:53 AM   #115
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Re: Naruto_619

lol the only threats to Sasuke now are Madara,Obito,Naruto, Hashirama, Minato, & Orochimaru. Hiruzen is old and Tobirama has no feats except water lol...Chidori anyone?

Tobirama has no chance against Sasuke. Sasuke has mastered lightning jutsu and Tobirama only uses water.Who gives a shit if hes a Hokage, so is Tsunade and i believe even she is stronger than him. We have NEVER heard of Tobirama being some sort of powerhouse.
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Old 02-07-2013, 10:32 AM   #116
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Re: Naruto_619

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lol the only threats to Sasuke now are Madara,Obito,Naruto, Hashirama, Minato, & Orochimaru. Hiruzen is old and Tobirama has no feats except water lol...Chidori anyone?

Tobirama has no chance against Sasuke. Sasuke has mastered lightning jutsu and Tobirama only uses water.Who gives a shit if hes a Hokage, so is Tsunade and i believe even she is stronger than him. We have NEVER heard of Tobirama being some sort of powerhouse.
While I agree, Kishi did throw the 2nd a couple of nice bones that would make him a very hard out, but IMO Sasuke would get him...

Tobirama was highly skilled in Space–Time Ninjutsu. Tobirama was also shown to have great physical prowess and a considerable amount of skill in the area of taijutsu, as well as good teamwork with his elder brother, Hashirama Senju. In the anime, it was shown that he was also a powerful genjutsu user, able to shroud the area in darkness that even the Third Hokage couldn't dispel. It was said that he wielded the Sword of the Thunder God, a blade with electrical abilities, and was said to have mastered its use despite the blade's lethal nature.

Saying that, I believe I'm being rational, like Kael whom states it'd be a good long battle. Physically as an Edo, Sasuke couldn't outlast him, thats impossible, but being an Uchiha, and seeing the process in how to 'break' Edo Tensei, he has that in his back pocket as well. Perhaps they'res a way he can get out of Amaretsu, but the totality of Sasuke's bag of tricks (especially if it is as I suspect that he has Itachi's Eye Techs as well) would be to overwhelming. Remember the basic theme of the manga is the generations surpassing constantly. Minato made the Rasengen, look at it now; Kakashi created Raikiri which was the shit, Kirin anyone?; and its obvious in the make up that this generation is supposed to surpass the previous.

But good open mind, at least you threw out some possible jutsu's and abilities Sasuke could win with. Thats a lot better than 'Legend', and Kage, and thats enough. I say that because I've brought up Tobirama's techs, and prolly HR, Ask, but not many other Tobirama Cock Riders, at least have a reason to jock his wood. In the same breath they'll shit on Tsunade like nothing, who's titles are 'Kage', and 'Legendary, Sannin', roflmao.

Btw, not clowning anyone, but using Wiki because Tobirama's Legendaryness ain't detailed in the manga, its paragraphs of never seen, and will never be seen dreams of Kishi to attempt to make him at least in the neighborhood of Harashirma.
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Old 02-07-2013, 10:33 AM   #117
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Re: Naruto_619

The 2nd was probably powerful, but that's going off what we're told about him now. Hell if we are all basing his previous outing (when Orochimaru used him against Sarutobi), we should also say that the 1st Hokage is equally as unimpressive, considering Sarutobi beat him (well, more like killed himself in the process of stopping Edo Tensei) as well.

The 2nd has Edo Tensei and space time techniques. There's only been a select few opponents capable of mitigating Edo Tensei and even a sharingan would have trouble with space time techniques (See Tobi vs. Minato).
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Old 02-07-2013, 10:51 AM   #118
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Re: Naruto_619

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No. Just no. That was pretty much the entire point of Itachi and Sasuke vs. Kabuto, shutting down Edo Tensei in even the most extreme of situations.
He knows how, I never said he didn't. I said he didn't have the means. He can't control people with his genjutsu like Itachi can, and I don't foresee him using Izanami to negate Oro if it comes to that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NeoKakarott023 View Post
why the rush to diminish Sasuke Uchiha?

Last bit, since Itachi's eyes were transplanted into Sasuke, and he has the Yata Mirror, and the Sealing Sword, what would Tobirama's answer be, I've heard about how he could 'generally' take out Sasuke, how does Tobirama get pass this?
I'm not rushing to diminish Sasuke, as I know he powerful and is equal only to glowing jesus for the story's sake.

As for "he has Itachi's eyes so he has the Sword and Mirror", that hasn't been shown to be true. In fact, just the opposite. He's used Susano'o several times since he obtained EMS, hasn't shown the sword's gourd. Each time he's used Susano'o, it's held the Amaterasu orb where the gourd was held with Itachi's Susano'o.
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Old 02-07-2013, 11:59 AM   #119
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Re: Naruto_619

I think that Itachi's tools follow his soul. Yes Sasuke has bis eyes BUT Itachi used that sword against Nagato. It can't be owned y two different people.
Bottom line i dont think Sasuke has it be has that black flames sword and throwing discs.

I think experince and stamina will defeat Sasuke vs Tobirama or any of the Kage Edos.

I wonder how he will react when he finds out Minato is Naruto's Dad?
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Old 02-07-2013, 12:21 PM   #120
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Re: Naruto_619

Orochimaru was commented as looking for the Sword of Totsuka all his life. Considering he's over twice Itachi's age, and the sword had apparently gained enough notoriety that people like him have heard of it, somebody else must have been wielding it long before Itachi did. That means it's an actual separate entity from "Itachi's soul" or whatever.
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