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Old 08-28-2013, 07:25 PM   #61
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

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Originally Posted by ask me anything View Post
I would bet my own testicles that I know the exact premise of how the Kyuubi+Sage Combo will come about.
First intial though/reaction:

That's some mighty fine mountain oysters y'all servin' here.

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Old 08-28-2013, 08:02 PM   #62
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

Ok what techniques did Tobirama come up with.. Shadowclone Jutsu, Edo Tensei. Flying thundergod, Paper Explosion, He has T?S and Suiton Jutsu ( which I still wanan see from him)



Now How in the fuck did those bounty hunters take him out.. they had all better been on Kissame's level or Im calling bullshit.. they seriously need to do Tobirama's flashback@
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Old 08-29-2013, 12:18 AM   #63
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

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Originally Posted by ask me anything View Post
I would bet my own testicles that I know the exact premise of how the Kyuubi+Sage Combo will come about. Naruto will be all like "My sage attacks aren't really doing any real damage to Obitard.", and somebody (probably Hachibi/Bee) will be all like "Hey why don't you use combine the Kyuubi's into each hit.". *BOOM* *POW* *BANG*....oh wow, that actually worked, but I'm too dumb to explain how. Just...well...you know...BELIEVE IT!!!

Naruto held the combination for a short period facing Nagato. Nagato stuck naruto with one of those black rods in the gut...Naruto used both powers and gave Nagato a little kyuubi sage chakra buzz. Being that Naruto seems to remember every little detail from his past battles of late..he will realize that he can perform both modes at the same time. (Probably will get impaled by one of those black rods) NE has better range than his normal attacks. Combining that for offense with kyuubi attacks will certainly give Naruto enough power for impact/damage. With his father inevitably giving him the other half of Kurama's chakra Naruto's speed will increase. His regenerative skills will boost and this is before he becomes a full sage reborn. Obito will push Naruto's new mode to it's limit....in that time the bijuu will be like "ayyee bitch we are here with you!" BOOM BAM POW! Complete sage reborn unlike the still incomplete Obito. Naruto being of love and Obito of power and hate.....Naruto will show him the power of the rainbow....and the motherfucking curtains will fall.

Yeah at this point Human Rasengan they gotta show us a Tobirama flashback.
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Old 08-29-2013, 12:46 PM   #64
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

Basically Tobirama is a nobody. A character built on other chars jutsus and being called the creator of jutsus already used. Kishi really fucked him up, should've just stuck to genjutsu and water jutsu master.
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Old 08-29-2013, 01:15 PM   #65
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

Those bountyhunters had to be on god's lvl for them to capture/kill this guy. I'm calling bullshit on that story.
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Old 08-29-2013, 02:20 PM   #66
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

It would be kind of a waste if Minato's Kurama doesn't fuse back with Naruto's Kurama. I don't see the Hokage's, except for maybe Hashirama, staying there for the full battle against Obito. Naruto can now control bijuu's because they're all BFFs so it would make sense if he harnessed the full power of the Kyuubi to fight the Juubi. Hopefully we don't get anymore chapters like these anymore. Who was it that mentioned it here, its stupid having these guys explain in full details how their ninja techniques work in the middle of a life-or-death battle where death can catch you at the blink of an eye.
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Old 08-29-2013, 03:27 PM   #67
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

Kishi can' win. He wrote himself into a corner.

If he explains how these combinations of justsus work, people will complain that in a life and death situation like this, there's no time for that shit.

If he doesn't explain anything, people will complain that he's just making shit up as he goes and that the manga doesn't make sense.

He could of avoided this by doing character development prior to the fight, not during.

All the stuff we learned about tobirama hit most of us like a wall while the explanation of how Naruto and father were able to teleport everyone away seemed like wasted panels.

Last edited by MrBIG; 08-29-2013 at 03:29 PM.
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Old 08-29-2013, 03:37 PM   #68
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

Oh yea, I created that one too!
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Old 08-29-2013, 04:05 PM   #69
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrBIG View Post
Kishi can' win. He wrote himself into a corner.

If he explains how these combinations of justsus work, people will complain that in a life and death situation like this, there's no time for that shit.

If he doesn't explain anything, people will complain that he's just making shit up as he goes and that the manga doesn't make sense.

He could of avoided this by doing character development prior to the fight, not during.

All the stuff we learned about tobirama hit most of us like a wall while the explanation of how Naruto and father were able to teleport everyone away seemed like wasted panels.
I think if you're this far into the story where there is a lot of shit going on then explain how techniques work would be stupid. I understand the fans (for this series in particular) need to have things like techniques and strategies explained in detail but that's something that's better left for databooks to explain. Plot progression would move along quite smoothly and story development would be that much better appreciated because we wouldn't be dragged back by everything little detail going on.

One Piece (for example) does an excellent job in this department. When random power-ups and techniques appear, Oda doesn't bother going into too much detail, at least not during critical times. This made memorable moments like the Water 7/Enies Lobby fights and Marineford War that much better.

Yu Yu Hakusho is another good example, the first half the series was much like Naruto in the sense that powers and techniques were explained but as the story got closer to the Dark Tournament minor details like that were minimized so that readers can enjoy the story more without any intermission that didn't deserve time apart to for certain plot events to be explained. Things like when Yusuke started getting demon powers did deserve time apart for an explanation which brought in a history lesson and tied the story better for that particular arc.

What this Naruto chapter did was literally a waste of pages. If they were going to take a break from the Minato/Tobirama/Naruto/Sasuke vs Obito fight it would probably make more sense to switch over to the Hashi/Madara fight or see what Orochimaru is up too, which can't be of any benefit for anyone else except for himself. That would be a more interesting intermission from the main fight.
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Old 08-29-2013, 05:17 PM   #70
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

@Spiegal and MR Bigs.

I personally think there is good reason for Kishi to explain how things happen in the manga. It certainly helps keep useless debates from happening, as people tend to try and fill in the informational black holes with their own theories. KYF comes to mind in this regard.

That said I agree there are better ways to do it then having the main characters take time out of their life and death battles to explain the shit directly. That's when you have a super smart side character step in and explain things to the audience in the form of a "thought bubble" to himself or explaining it to people standing directly around him. We've seen Zetsu do this exact same type of commentary in the sasuke/Itachi fight and it worked quite well.

A very good example of how it could be done better would have been for Shikamaru to have observed the situation and use his vast intellect to deduct the answer. It's not that hard for someone who can supposedly think 200 steps ahead to connect a few simple facts.
1) Minato is known for FTG and everyone seems to have been teleported in just that manner.
2) Minato is a Jink, and he fist bumped Naruto.
3) KillerBee is also a Jink and he has been seen fist bumping Naruto before, to use jutsu.
4) Everyone is also connected to Naruto via kyuubi chakra.

Shikimaru could have put it all together and delivered his conclusion to the reader in a very slick and informative way, and also have made himself still relevant to story. Instead we got panels of him commenting how he had no fucking clue what he should do next in order to hype up Naruto's and Minato's intelligence.
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Old 08-29-2013, 06:04 PM   #71
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spiegel View Post
I think if you're this far into the story where there is a lot of shit going on then explain how techniques work would be stupid. I understand the fans (for this series in particular) need to have things like techniques and strategies explained in detail but that's something that's better left for databooks to explain. Plot progression would move along quite smoothly and story development would be that much better appreciated because we wouldn't be dragged back by everything little detail going on.

One Piece (for example) does an excellent job in this department. When random power-ups and techniques appear, Oda doesn't bother going into too much detail, at least not during critical times. This made memorable moments like the Water 7/Enies Lobby fights and Marineford War that much better.

Yu Yu Hakusho is another good example, the first half the series was much like Naruto in the sense that powers and techniques were explained but as the story got closer to the Dark Tournament minor details like that were minimized so that readers can enjoy the story more without any intermission that didn't deserve time apart to for certain plot events to be explained. Things like when Yusuke started getting demon powers did deserve time apart for an explanation which brought in a history lesson and tied the story better for that particular arc.

What this Naruto chapter did was literally a waste of pages. If they were going to take a break from the Minato/Tobirama/Naruto/Sasuke vs Obito fight it would probably make more sense to switch over to the Hashi/Madara fight or see what Orochimaru is up too, which can't be of any benefit for anyone else except for himself. That would be a more interesting intermission from the main fight.
I really do agree with you, some of these explanations are long for no reason and only drag out this manga. But in the case of Tobirama we really did need more information about him before he started fighting.

Literally this dude is second only to Hashirama, and from the looks of it created every jutsu known to man yet he died from an ambush?

I think Kishi should of just gave us a flashback when the first and second were talking to sasuke. We already got a glimsp of Hashirama's life, it would of made sense to have seen Tobirama's life and death.

It would of also fit in with the whole sacrificing yourself for your comrades/village notions that they were trying to convey to sasuke.
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Old 08-29-2013, 07:45 PM   #72
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

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Those bountyhunters had to be on god's lvl for them to capture/kill this guy. I'm calling bullshit on that story.
I have a theory exactly on that. I suspect it might have been Kinkaku and Ginkaku that did him in. That jug by my estimation can probably hold someone for a certain amount of time until they eventually die. Since the storage itself seems to incapacitate those who are sucked it, it would make sense that he would no longer be able to teleport out. As a result, he was trapped in there until his body was no longer able to support him. Then he just suddenly died. As for why no country claimed any jutsu from him after he was killed, it was because the brothers shortly thereafter were also killed. As a result, the secrets of releasing those who were captured in the jug died with them thus forever sealing away the body of the second hokage. This is all theory of course but there is no exact time line for when those two existed so I can only assume that part of their legendary status came from capturing the second hokage.

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Old 08-29-2013, 08:39 PM   #73
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

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I have a theory exactly on that. I suspect it might have been Kinkaku and Ginkaku that did him in. That jug by my estimation can probably hold someone for a certain amount of time until they eventually die. Since the storage itself seems to incapacitate those who are sucked it, it would make sense that he would no longer be able to teleport out. As a result, he was trapped in there until his body was no longer able to support him. Then he just suddenly died. As for why no country claimed any jutsu from him after he was killed, it was because the brothers shortly thereafter were also killed. As a result, the secrets of releasing those who were captured in the jug died with them thus forever sealing away the body of the second hokage. This is all theory of course but there is no exact time line for when those two existed so I can only assume that part of their legendary status came from capturing the second hokage.
Well we already know they almost killed the 2nd Hokage during their coup d'etat. So they later on finished the job?

Plus we know that the tools they use seals the body and soul. So if that's what did Tobirama in, he wouldnt be able to be revivied with edo tensei?

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Old 08-29-2013, 09:00 PM   #74
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

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Well we already know they almost killed the 2nd Hokage during their coup d'etat. So they later on finished the job?

Plus we know that the tools they use seals the body and soul. So if that's what did Tobirama in, he wouldnt be able to be revivied with edo tensei?
Not unless maybe he died just as his body was about to be sucked in. That way his soul would still be free to leave the living world while the body itself was sucked up. Then again that destroys my theory about the jug being the thing that killed him which leaves only the possibility that kinkaku and ginkaku some how managed to kill him with just their skills alone. Their pretty powerful but managing something like that suggests that maybe Darui must be really lucky to have beaten them. hmm This one is a real puzzler.

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Old 08-29-2013, 10:06 PM   #75
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

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Plus we know that the tools they use seals the body and soul.
Except it doesn't seal the person's soul. It seals a "word soul". The Japanese hold a belief that words have souls which give them certain powers. The Rope/Sword combo steals the "word soul" of the word most used by a person.
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