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Old 08-29-2013, 10:20 PM   #76
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

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Originally Posted by kael03 View Post
Except it doesn't seal the person's soul. It seals a "word soul". The Japanese hold a belief that words have souls which give them certain powers. The Rope/Sword combo steals the "word soul" of the word most used by a person.
Shhhh.... don't go that deep kael. Do you want KYF writing his dissertations about his theories and how they pertain to Japanese history and mythos?

But back to the edo tensai topic... We now have a pretty good idea of where Orochimaru got DNA from Hashi. But where in the hell did he get it from Tobi?
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Old 08-29-2013, 11:25 PM   #77
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

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Originally Posted by kael03 View Post
Except it doesn't seal the person's soul. It seals a "word soul". The Japanese hold a belief that words have souls which give them certain powers. The Rope/Sword combo steals the "word soul" of the word most used by a person.
It does do that, however they do seal the body/soul of the victim if they should either say the word which has been sealed in the gourd or if they fail to speak at all. Atsui and Samui were sealed in them by those methods. No way of really telling how the fuck they get saved. It is a moot point as Big said since Tobirama could not have been revived had his soul been fully sealed so eh.

For the debate of how the fuck Tobirama lost to Kinkaku and Ginkaku, we can't forget that they were both capable of going 6-tails...remember how 6-tails Naruto was fully capable of leveling a city? Yeah. That'd do it. He wouldn't have just warped away at the first opportunity given since the entire point of his going 1v20 balls to the wall was to buy the other 6 time to escape.

Also, I wouldn't really be surprised if, to some extent, he really did just let himself die. Killing the 2nd Hokage could well have been trophy enough for them to not bother even going for the other 6, which would have fulfilled the purpose Tobirama was aiming for.

Still doesn't make perfect sense but it's not like he couldn't have possibly lost.
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Old 08-29-2013, 11:25 PM   #78
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

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Originally Posted by jekyl_hyde View Post
Shhhh.... don't go that deep kael. Do you want KYF writing his dissertations about his theories and how they pertain to Japanese history and mythos?

But back to the edo tensai topic... We now have a pretty good idea of where Orochimaru got DNA from Hashi. But where in the hell did he get it from Tobi?
I suspect he got those from medical records and samples collected during Tobi's reign as hokage. Tobi probably like all ninjas went through medical services and thus a samples of his blood and tissue were kept on record for further research and study. Kabuto being a medic ninja was able to get access to these samples thus allowing him all the needed material for an edo tensei.
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Old 08-30-2013, 12:04 AM   #79
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

I mean 20 nins..from those 20 only two we know of. So the particulars to how he died are all to be assumed. Gin and Kin would of given him a serious fight though he still should of been able to move around them. The five tools of the sage....The fan would of made Tobimara's offense hard to reach. Tobirama's fav word seems to be Brother....sure he thought about his brother and his era being that Tobirama's was soon to end. We saw Pain have difficulty with a six tailed Naruto....Motherfucking Pain...one of the power houses of this manga lol! Tobirama was going up against two of them with toys...For almost any kage level shinobi..that's fucking tough. Hell Naruto was getting side swiped by numbers of jinks in rage mode and he was in glow mode. (referring to Tobi's jink war against Bee and Naruto) Naruto is the fastest man alive (surpassing Raikage and his father is dead) and he was beaten like a rag doll. Speed is a factor but it doesn't make you invincible. Given the Sage's tools plus two raging jinks and 18 other hunters....that is tough shit to flush through.
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Old 08-30-2013, 12:59 AM   #80
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

I think tobirama was killed. Nothing special just bad timing. I have to reread the chapter but it was him, the 3rd hokage, danzo and some others. Those three right there are pretty strong and they sent 20 BOUNTY HUNTERS after them. Tobirama decided to lure them away. He NEEDED to do that. It's not like he said ill take care of this you guys go so you don't get caught up. It was more like shit I HAVE to do something. I'm assuming the BOUNTY HUNTERS had information in tobirama and his jutsu... We're reading naruto. It's not always black and white. It's been shown plenty of times that if someone has knowledge of your jutsu and plan around it, AND sneak up on you, anyone can kill anyone. That's how I see it. They knew who they were chasing and they killed him. Ino, shika, cho is a pretty hard team to beat if they plan for you just imagine 20 bounty hunters planning for you. 20 diff ninja, 20 diff abilities that can/will kill you. There from another village so there are/could be jutsu the 2nd has never seen. We also have to remember the second rite now is spamming and looking good because he has infinite chakra. We don't know anything about his limits, how many times he can do things or anything. Just a thought

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Old 08-30-2013, 01:13 AM   #81
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

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Originally Posted by Amuro View Post
I think tobirama was killed. Nothing special just bad timing. I have to reread the chapter but it was him, the 3rd hokage, danzo and some others. Those three right there are pretty strong and they sent 20 BOUNTY HUNTERS after them. Tobirama decided to lure them away. He NEEDED to do that. It's not like he said ill take care of this you guys go so you don't get caught up. It was more like shit I HAVE to do something. I'm assuming the BOUNTY HUNTERS had information in tobirama and his jutsu... We're reading naruto. It's not always black and white. It's been shown plenty of times that if someone has knowledge of your jutsu and plan around it, AND sneak up on you, anyone can kill anyone. That's how I see it. They knew who they were chasing and they killed him. Ino, shika, cho is a pretty hard team to beat if they plan for you just imagine 20 bounty hunters planning for you. 20 diff ninja, 20 diff abilities that can/will kill you. There from another village so there are/could be jutsu the 2nd has never seen. We also have to remember the second rite now is spamming and looking good because he has infinite chakra. We don't know anything about his limits, how many times he can do things or anything. Just a thought

That would be true if Tobirama hadn't created Edo Tensai nor the FTG. With those two jutsus, Tobi should have been able to stand up to anyone excluding Hashi and Madara.
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Old 08-30-2013, 01:46 AM   #82
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

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Originally Posted by jekyl_hyde View Post
That would be true if Tobirama hadn't created Edo Tensai nor the FTG. With those two jutsus, Tobi should have been able to stand up to anyone excluding Hashi and Madara.
Well Edo Tensei is a forbidden jutsu and Tobirama seems to be the type to not resort to such methods. Using Shadow Clone with his FTG yeah he should of been able to at least escape....The threat obviously was real...but with those two jutsus it's hard to perceive how such a man went down. Using ET you need the material and a live body. Sure he could of took one down after the other but that all depends on the situation...If the men came at him one on one..he has the upper hand but if they came at him all at once...he had to maneuver in and out of attacks just to get dna, then go to a live body perform the ritual all while going on the offense and defense. Tobirama seems to only be capable of making two-four clones tops.. (He was only able to make two clones in this war.) Also sure using ET is cool and all but the resourcefulness of the jutsu comes from the talent of the shinobi. They didn't seal him or seal him in one of the sages weapons. As his body was found and later laid to rest.
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Old 08-30-2013, 02:54 AM   #83
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

Tobirama Senju, the faggot who created Shadow Clones/FTG/ET and who the heck knows... Heck, probably all the forbidden Jutsu's on the Forbidden Scroll are probably Tobirama's creations.

Just how the heck did he really die?
Also, is this just plainly going to be a Ninjutsu manga from now on? It's getting kind of gay.
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Old 08-30-2013, 03:08 AM   #84
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

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Originally Posted by CrustaceaN View Post
Tobirama Senju, the faggot who created Shadow Clones/FTG/ET and who the heck knows... Heck, probably all the forbidden Jutsu's on the Forbidden Scroll are probably Tobirama's creations.

Just how the heck did he really die?
Also, is this just plainly going to be a Ninjutsu manga from now on? It's getting kind of gay.
How do you mean? It is a story about ninjas fighting other ninjas....though now it's a story about the world coming together to fight a few ninjas for a greater future. Any less ninjutsu and it would be a complete soap opera.
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Old 08-30-2013, 04:59 AM   #85
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

I doubt a 20 man ambush would be enough to stop someone that created the shadow clone jutsu.

Plus considering god like chakra levels, Im guessing he could pull of the multi-clone jutsu just as well.

I think Tobirama could have been sick (think the rare virus Goku had during the android-saga) or severely injured prior to the ambush. It's probably something stupid like that.

Don't put that beyond Kishi, remember when Naruto broke his ankle after hitting a mountain to fast/hard?


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How do you mean? It is a story about ninjas fighting other ninjas....though now it's a story about the world coming together to fight a few ninjas for a greater future. Any less ninjutsu and it would be a complete soap opera.
A lot of us appreciate some good taijutsu here and there.

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Old 08-30-2013, 05:00 AM   #86
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

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Originally Posted by MrBIG View Post
A lot of us appreciate some good taijutsu here and there.
I love proper fighting in a ninja world..but at this point whose taijutsu can withstand a bijuu bomb?

If you are referring to when Naruto first got glow mode...he injured himself putting too much power into his step. Not a mountain.. There is no guess that he can pull off multiple shadow clones...he can

http://www.mangapanda.com/naruto/637/6
http://www.mangapanda.com/naruto/637/11

as I said earlier Tobirama's chakra seems to only allow him MAX 2-4 clones...while obviously Hashi's chakra is far greater...(four clones)

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Old 08-30-2013, 06:40 AM   #87
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

Not tryin to start but you have to remember the seconds edo tends I was incomplete. Oro built off his and made it better and kabutos built off oro so the edo tensei we see now isn't what the second had. Shadow clones yea he made that but he made SHADOW clone jutsu not all clone jutsu the shadow clone jutsu is forbidden also. U still hve mud clones, water clones, rock clones, ect. Isn't the shadow clone jutsu just a better version/ diff cersion those? If that's so then people have seen "clone" jutsu before just not "shadow" clone rite? So that's nothing too huge either. Idc who you are anyone in this manga except maybe the first. The rite 20 ppl will kill anyone

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Old 08-30-2013, 08:17 AM   #88
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

Great chapter, Narutos doing his thang, but for all the fanning, please be aware that THE Uchiha, Sasuke has yet to truly begin. It's a given that Edo Madara, or Obito won't perish until Sasuke advances to Rinnengan, just saying.

On the 20 shinobi can kill anyone, I call bullshit. That's stupidly general, because were talking the Cloud Village specifically. If the 2nd Raikage, Ao, Killer Bee, Ginaku, and Kinaku, were at least some of the shinobi there, maybe we could talk, but that wasn't the case. Understand as great as Tobirama has been, he's the greatest water jutsu user in the whole manga, and he hasn't opened his mouth to produce a drop of water. He's also tha smartest shinobi currently on the battlefield,, and the only one the understood that Obito was negating all ninjutsu. I wonder how 20 combined on they're best day of life was equal to Ridoku Obito. Also since he supposedly perished on that day, Tobirama has learned nothing new since then, he's had everything from the current battle, except being an Edo. For those who want to add Omoi, or Darui, or any of those other Cloud Puppies, shut the freak up.
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Old 08-30-2013, 10:37 AM   #89
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

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Originally Posted by Sensei-Q View Post
Those bountyhunters had to be on god's lvl for them to capture/kill this guy. I'm calling bullshit on that story.
Or, they are just fodder because tobirama is not really that strong a shinobi, just a good inventor.

Tobirama/Edo tobirama FEATS...
: Mortally wounds izuna who is not even using ANY MS jutsu, thus a basic SG version Izuna.
: Almost gets killed by KIN and GIN with the 2nd raikage helping him fight them.
: Dies against the Kinaku squad of 20 fodder nobodies...
: Gets one shoted by the lower level version of Juubito without even reacting.
: Is attacking Perfect Juubito using the FTG, but Juubito is clearly not even trying to attack tobirama back, thus all tobirama is doing, is attacking an enemy not trying to attack him back which ANYONE can do...
CONCLUSION:
Not very good feats at all... Tobirama is clearly an average kage level shinobi compared to the top dogs.

But as an inventor.
: Invented Kage bushin.
: Invented Edo tensai.
: Invented hiraishin/FTG.

Shows he is a much better inventor then shinobi.
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KNOWLEDGE TO LIVE BY...

No matter how POWERFUL/STRONG you are. If you cannot CATCH your Enemy, all you POWER/STRENGTH is no more USEFUL then a squirt gun....
And if You cannot possibly TRACK/REACT to your enemies attacks to Defend yourself, then how can you possibly stop him from DEFEATING you at WILL...


MINATO "KYF" NAMIKAZE.

People live relying on they're Knowledge and Perception, and thus are bound to them.....
Those Boundaries are what they tend to accept as "Reality".....
However..... Knowledge and Perception are both ambiguous....
so "Reality" could be nothing more....
then an illusion....


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Old 08-30-2013, 10:45 AM   #90
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Re: Naruto 644 For Real Ya'll

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Originally Posted by ask me anything View Post
Technically the only chakras to be "mixed" were the 2 halves of the kyuubi. Minato and Naruto didn't actually mix chakras, they "linked" them, which is a little different. I don't know why you would argue with SD over this issue when THIS PAGE illustrates in a fairly easy to understand way how the process works.

To clarify (and put this issue to rest), Naruto's connection to the rest of the shinobi alliance (via chakra cloak) is similar to an electrical circuit that runs through your house powering the various appliances that plug into it. By fist bumping with Naruto, Minato was able to access that circuitry (like an electrical generator during a power outage) and send his own power through that circuitry.
When I read this I for one was completely astounded. If you think of it from the opposite direction it's even more revealing.

It's not just Naruto. It's Naruto, Minato, and the fully complete version of the kyuubi combined that Hashirama was comparing to his own chakra. Meaning OMG levels of chakra that astound enemies and allies alike are what Hashirama walks around with on a daily basis like its nothing special.

I think it's clear from this who the strongest hokage of all time is. (HINT: He doesn't have blonde hair.....har har.)
Power level of full power Kyuubi, creates a buddha the size of 10 Kyuubi's, revered by Madara Uchiha and is a god of the shinobi from the war area...

Yet, can be killed by a simple kunai... SPpppppppppppppppppp *thumbs down* Minato wins!!!!

Sorry, it takes minato already holding back from guilt and having his kunai defense to fail against perfect Juubito level shinobi just to TOUCH him... thus hashirama is not going to touch him!!!
especially since Minato and his clone utterly tanked the speed spin kick attack from imperfect Juubito without even using hiriashin and he was Already stronger then hashirama, admitted it himself....
But owned hashirama clone, tobirama, Naruto and sasuke so easily...

minato is the superior kage obviously. when it comes to striking, SPEED>POWER all day everyday...
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KNOWLEDGE TO LIVE BY...

No matter how POWERFUL/STRONG you are. If you cannot CATCH your Enemy, all you POWER/STRENGTH is no more USEFUL then a squirt gun....
And if You cannot possibly TRACK/REACT to your enemies attacks to Defend yourself, then how can you possibly stop him from DEFEATING you at WILL...


MINATO "KYF" NAMIKAZE.

People live relying on they're Knowledge and Perception, and thus are bound to them.....
Those Boundaries are what they tend to accept as "Reality".....
However..... Knowledge and Perception are both ambiguous....
so "Reality" could be nothing more....
then an illusion....


ITACHI UCHIHA
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