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Old 10-07-2013, 02:58 PM   #61
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Re: Reverse situation...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Senkradlol View Post
Kakashi almost took the bell of Minato when he was a kid. Sasuke almost took the bell from the guy who almost got it from the 4th.

Therefore Sasuke in part 1 = Minato.

hasira>sasuke>minato
Konohamaru can almost take a bell from current Juubito because he is distracted, does that make konohamaru=Juubito in speed... Fuck no!!!'


You idiots completely ignore the circumstances behind FEATS and since you resorting to comparing BELL TOUCHING o HOW kakashi almost took the bell and we know that kakashi was not taking sasuke seriously which is why he grazed the bell... It is easy enough to understand your an idiot drawing at very small straws that prove nothing other then your inability to come up with a remotely reasonable argument based on credible facts...

FACTS: Minato's physical speed/reflexes are on par with V2 raikage's as proven in their skirmish... a speed and level of reflexes that kakashi cannot even dream of having...
__________________
KNOWLEDGE TO LIVE BY...

No matter how POWERFUL/STRONG you are. If you cannot CATCH your Enemy, all you POWER/STRENGTH is no more USEFUL then a squirt gun....
And if You cannot possibly TRACK/REACT to your enemies attacks to Defend yourself, then how can you possibly stop him from DEFEATING you at WILL...


MINATO "KYF" NAMIKAZE.

People live relying on they're Knowledge and Perception, and thus are bound to them.....
Those Boundaries are what they tend to accept as "Reality".....
However..... Knowledge and Perception are both ambiguous....
so "Reality" could be nothing more....
then an illusion....


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Old 10-07-2013, 03:08 PM   #62
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Re: Reverse situation...

Obito's reflexes hardly matter anyway. We all know Uchiha move really well due to the sharingan (which allows the user to see even the most miniscule physical action of the opponent, generating a prediction based off how the opponent will follow through with the complete movement) and if the 1st was able to pin down Madara, who most certainly has a better doujutsu than Obito, the 1st wouldn't have any trouble dealing with how Obito evades and counters attacks. Again, let's not focus on Obito's reflexes, that's hardly the issue at hand.
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Old 10-07-2013, 04:11 PM   #63
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Re: Reverse situation...

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Special One View Post
Obito's reflexes hardly matter anyway. We all know Uchiha move really well due to the sharingan (which allows the user to see even the most miniscule physical action of the opponent, generating a prediction based off how the opponent will follow through with the complete movement) and if the 1st was able to pin down Madara, who most certainly has a better doujutsu than Obito, the 1st wouldn't have any trouble dealing with how Obito evades and counters attacks. Again, let's not focus on Obito's reflexes, that's hardly the issue at hand.
Do what? Reflexes mean everything because they determine the physical reaction fro the body... You cant act like the SG being able to see fast movements is enough while the reflexes to physically move the body to evade a seen attack or attack and opening is not more important...

Look at Minato, has no SG/MS/EMS yet was able to SEE and TRACK V2 raikage's movements which not even a sg/ms COULD DO then REACT to dodge the attack showing that reflexes are more important...

And since when did hashirama PIN down Madara who's EMS is supposed to be better then Kamui hax which it is not... a Single Kamui eye of Obito's is easily= so just imagine if Obito has both plus the extra jutsu that comes from using both eyes at once... Those Kmaui eyes would easily>EMS eyes...

Anways, hashirama brealy beat Madara who is just another power hourse while TOBITO is a power house with speed, ultimate defense and the ability get rid of his chakra signature and insatntly pop out an suck you into kamuand which hashirama has no way to even react to much less defend against... SO why even compare the two?

EMS madara vs Tobito... Madara dawns perfect susanoo and TOBITO literally jumps right into susanoo going through the defense using kamui and madara helpless inside gets impaled by Mokuton skewer and loses...

So you want to compare Tobito to EMS madara... Tobito would beat him too!!! With the ability to walk right through ANY level of suasnoo to attack madara directly, as well as walk through any attack madara can throw at him plus having Minato level speed/reflexes and the ability ti time space transfer himself behind or above madara to attack him before he can react like he did KCM naruto or just suck him into Kmaui land...

Either way, I do not see how Madara with just large scale jutsu can beat TOBITO Much less the weaker version without an extra hashirama clone body to enhace all his abilities, Obito, who solo'ed BM naruto, hachibi KB, gai and kakashi at the same time...
__________________
KNOWLEDGE TO LIVE BY...

No matter how POWERFUL/STRONG you are. If you cannot CATCH your Enemy, all you POWER/STRENGTH is no more USEFUL then a squirt gun....
And if You cannot possibly TRACK/REACT to your enemies attacks to Defend yourself, then how can you possibly stop him from DEFEATING you at WILL...


MINATO "KYF" NAMIKAZE.

People live relying on they're Knowledge and Perception, and thus are bound to them.....
Those Boundaries are what they tend to accept as "Reality".....
However..... Knowledge and Perception are both ambiguous....
so "Reality" could be nothing more....
then an illusion....


ITACHI UCHIHA
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Old 10-07-2013, 04:33 PM   #64
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Re: Reverse situation...

Lol its hilarious how KYF is accusing people of bias when he is probably the biggest minato fanboy of all time. Most of us don't care about minato hashimara or tobirama. It's evident that hashimara is on another level.
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Old 10-07-2013, 04:43 PM   #65
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Re: Reverse situation...

No, the hilarious part is how serious and mad he's getting. I'm not even trying to troll, just posting shit from this manga that has happened and he's raging over it.

Seriously, relax.
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Old 10-07-2013, 05:03 PM   #66
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Re: Reverse situation...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Senkradlol View Post
No, the hilarious part is how serious and mad he's getting. I'm not even trying to troll, just posting shit from this manga that has happened and he's raging over it.

Seriously, relax.
Minato is obviously moar than a spoonful of ink to him, but what did we expect, he IS a Monkey after all.
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Old 10-07-2013, 06:23 PM   #67
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Re: Reverse situation...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Konnaha_yellow_flash View Post
Do what? Reflexes mean everything because they determine the physical reaction fro the body... You cant act like the SG being able to see fast movements is enough while the reflexes to physically move the body to evade a seen attack or attack and opening is not more important...

Look at Minato, has no SG/MS/EMS yet was able to SEE and TRACK V2 raikage's movements which not even a sg/ms COULD DO then REACT to dodge the attack showing that reflexes are more important...

And since when did hashirama PIN down Madara who's EMS is supposed to be better then Kamui hax which it is not... a Single Kamui eye of Obito's is easily= so just imagine if Obito has both plus the extra jutsu that comes from using both eyes at once... Those Kmaui eyes would easily>EMS eyes...

Anways, hashirama brealy beat Madara who is just another power hourse while TOBITO is a power house with speed, ultimate defense and the ability get rid of his chakra signature and insatntly pop out an suck you into kamuand which hashirama has no way to even react to much less defend against... SO why even compare the two?

EMS madara vs Tobito... Madara dawns perfect susanoo and TOBITO literally jumps right into susanoo going through the defense using kamui and madara helpless inside gets impaled by Mokuton skewer and loses...

So you want to compare Tobito to EMS madara... Tobito would beat him too!!! With the ability to walk right through ANY level of suasnoo to attack madara directly, as well as walk through any attack madara can throw at him plus having Minato level speed/reflexes and the ability ti time space transfer himself behind or above madara to attack him before he can react like he did KCM naruto or just suck him into Kmaui land...

Either way, I do not see how Madara with just large scale jutsu can beat TOBITO Much less the weaker version without an extra hashirama clone body to enhace all his abilities, Obito, who solo'ed BM naruto, hachibi KB, gai and kakashi at the same time...
I'm saying using Obito's reflexes as an argument to support his superiority over Madara or the 1st Hokage is a null argument. The 1st Hokage beat Madara at some point which suggests that Madara's superior reflexes didn't win him the fight. And Madara has a superior ocular vision than Obito, which suggests his perception of his opponent's movements is greater, therefore, his reaction time should also be greater than Obito's when factoring in that Madara had a lot of years to adjust his body to his visual perception. Obito, like Minato, relies on manipulating the space-time continuum a lot, you are mistaking that for raw speed, when it is anything but. That's how Minato caught the Raikage off guard, with FTG, not with his superior reflexes or foot speed.
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Old 10-07-2013, 06:26 PM   #68
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Re: Reverse situation...

But gaiz! Circles! Circles and poorly cropped panels that ignore everything else in the page that could damage the claim!
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Old 10-07-2013, 08:20 PM   #69
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Wink Re: Reverse situation...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Konnaha_yellow_flash View Post
Do what? Reflexes mean everything because they determine the physical reaction fro the body... You cant act like the SG being able to see fast movements is enough while the reflexes to physically move the body to evade a seen attack or attack and opening is not more important...

Look at Minato, has no SG/MS/EMS yet was able to SEE and TRACK V2 raikage's movements which not even a sg/ms COULD DO then REACT to dodge the attack showing that reflexes are more important...

And since when did hashirama PIN down Madara who's EMS is supposed to be better then Kamui hax which it is not... a Single Kamui eye of Obito's is easily= so just imagine if Obito has both plus the extra jutsu that comes from using both eyes at once... Those Kmaui eyes would easily>EMS eyes...

Anways, hashirama brealy beat Madara who is just another power hourse while TOBITO is a power house with speed, ultimate defense and the ability get rid of his chakra signature and insatntly pop out an suck you into kamuand which hashirama has no way to even react to much less defend against... SO why even compare the two?

EMS madara vs Tobito... Madara dawns perfect susanoo and TOBITO literally jumps right into susanoo going through the defense using kamui and madara helpless inside gets impaled by Mokuton skewer and loses...

So you want to compare Tobito to EMS madara... Tobito would beat him too!!! With the ability to walk right through ANY level of suasnoo to attack madara directly, as well as walk through any attack madara can throw at him plus having Minato level speed/reflexes and the ability ti time space transfer himself behind or above madara to attack him before he can react like he did KCM naruto or just suck him into Kmaui land...

Either way, I do not see how Madara with just large scale jutsu can beat TOBITO Much less the weaker version without an extra hashirama clone body to enhace all his abilities, Obito, who solo'ed BM naruto, hachibi KB, gai and kakashi at the same time...
"Why, Mr. Kyf? Why do you do it? Why get up? Why keep fighting? Do you believe you're fighting FOR something? For more than your Characters survival? Can you tell me what IT is? Do you even know? Is IT freedom? Or truth? Perhaps peace? Yes? No? Could it be for love? Illusions, Mr. Kyf. Vagaries of perception. The temporary constructs of a feeble human intellect trying desperately to justify a shinobi that is without meaning or purpose. And all of them as artificial as the Matrix itself, although only a human mind could invent something as insipid as love. You must be able to see it, Mr. Kyf. You must know it by now. You can't win. It's pointless to keep fighting. Why, Mr. Kyf? Why? Why do you persist?"



The funny thing, like Agent Smith, if you look at him during that part in the movie, he seems genuinely confused, like Neo's speaking another language, like us to Kyf.

Fixed.
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Old 10-08-2013, 01:13 PM   #70
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Re: Reverse situation...

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrBIG View Post
Lol its hilarious how KYF is accusing people of bias when he is probably the biggest minato fanboy of all time. Most of us don't care about minato hashimara or tobirama. It's evident that hashimara is on another level.
Keep up the name calling to try and support your argument... call me BIAS, but i can prove my claims while you can just cry about them and use name calling to support your argument...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Senkradlol View Post
No, the hilarious part is how serious and mad he's getting. I'm not even trying to troll, just posting shit from this manga that has happened and he's raging over it.

Seriously, relax.
Yea, of all the "NO" people I take seriously on here, it must be you becuase you say so...
Lets use your kind of random claim argument..


Seriously, You need to quit bashing the jews while still fapping to old testament porn...

Your such a damn hypocrite...

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Special One View Post
I'm saying using Obito's reflexes as an argument to support his superiority over Madara or the 1st Hokage is a null argument. The 1st Hokage beat Madara at some point which suggests that Madara's superior reflexes didn't win him the fight. And Madara has a superior ocular vision than Obito, which suggests his perception of his opponent's movements is greater, therefore, his reaction time should also be greater than Obito's when factoring in that Madara had a lot of years to adjust his body to his visual perception. Obito, like Minato, relies on manipulating the space-time continuum a lot, you are mistaking that for raw speed, when it is anything but. That's how Minato caught the Raikage off guard, with FTG, not with his superior reflexes or foot speed.

Uuum...

1). never said that reflexes ALONE win the fight for Obito.. I believe you misuderstood my argument...
But that his superior reflexes plus kamui hax to be able to literally walk right through any Mokuton attack while being able to pop up and suck hashirama into kamuiland before hashi can even react uch less defend himself, to die later in kamuiland.... Is why Tobito will and would beat hashirama...

2). Madara's reflexes are exactly the same as base/SM hashirama's as proven by all their combat... And yet hashirama ONLY beat madara due to Madara falling for a SNEAK attack wood clone that he had already confirmed he could see through so it was likely set up by madara, thus it was likely a draw in the end... Madara let hashirama think he killed him while stealing hashi's DNA to continue his goal....

3). LAMO, how do you think that the V2 raikage was able to be tracked which even the SG could not do along with being able to activate the FTG in time to avoid his attacks? REFLEXES for gods sakes!!!

So many of you have no idea how the human body even works... acting like reflexes had nothing to do with Minato's feat of tracking V2 rai's attack and activating the FTG to avoid V2 raikage's attack as well...

Not to mention, Minato was able to physically throw up his Kunai tag to use a level 2 FTG, react to teleport to another tag to move, react to teleport back to the Kunai tag he threw up by raikage, physically move to grab the kunai with both hands then sense KB tentacle coming form behind, physically kick raikage out of the way the dodge the tentacle, tag it then cut it in half so hard it created a small crater in the ground...

THIS^^ all happened with the the perceived INSTANT that V2 Lightning armour raikage can full speed shushin just a couple of feet...



Thus, In the time it took V2 raikage to react one time to use shushin at full speed to move a coupled feet, Minato was able to react and physically move many times to do what he did.... Allowing Minato to move so fast that the V2 riakage, the second fastest shinobi ever, way faster then hashirama, was left helpless against minato's speed...

And yet you want to tell me that Minato's reflexes/physical speed had nothing to do with it... Yet if Minato's reflexes and physical speed were no on the same level, then Minato would not have been able to react and physically move in that instant...

You Also want to tell me that Minato;s Foot Speed/shushin is not on par with V2 riakage's... Well then why is minato able to beat the other hokage by 30 seconds to the battle field with a foot race and disappear and reappaer when he uses the shushin...
as shown here: (a 20 yard shushin in an instant...)


So do not tell me what reflexes do not have to do with speed...

And time space speed>>>raw speed any day of the week... So your argument makes no sense what so ever... a shinobi with high level reflexes and a time space jutsu can move faster then even the fastest raw speed shinobi...

Thus Why minato is able to make raw speed V2 riakage look like he is standing still in comparison to his FTG speed/reflexes...

And why Obito was able to blitz KCM naruto, who was able to dodge a V2 riakage attack using a full speed Head start and a shushin yet could not even sense and react to Obito's attack without kakashi from another perspective warning him to move...



And yet you think that just huge scale attacks and large power level, but with average kage level speed/reflexes not even on par with V1 raikage.... can compete against Obito much less Minato who is even stronger then Obito...

At least give me a reasonable argument based on canon, not your idea of time space speed>raw speed... thus hashirama with his very littel raw speed>Obito and Minato...
__________________
KNOWLEDGE TO LIVE BY...

No matter how POWERFUL/STRONG you are. If you cannot CATCH your Enemy, all you POWER/STRENGTH is no more USEFUL then a squirt gun....
And if You cannot possibly TRACK/REACT to your enemies attacks to Defend yourself, then how can you possibly stop him from DEFEATING you at WILL...


MINATO "KYF" NAMIKAZE.

People live relying on they're Knowledge and Perception, and thus are bound to them.....
Those Boundaries are what they tend to accept as "Reality".....
However..... Knowledge and Perception are both ambiguous....
so "Reality" could be nothing more....
then an illusion....


ITACHI UCHIHA
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Old 10-08-2013, 01:20 PM   #71
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Re: Reverse situation...

Quote:
Originally Posted by NeoKakarott023 View Post
"Why, Mr. Kyf? Why do you do it? Why get up? Why keep fighting? Do you believe you're fighting FOR something? For more than your Characters survival? Can you tell me what IT is? Do you even know? Is IT freedom? Or truth? Perhaps peace? Yes? No? Could it be for love? Illusions, Mr. Kyf. Vagaries of perception. The temporary constructs of a feeble human intellect trying desperately to justify a shinobi that is without meaning or purpose. And all of them as artificial as the Matrix itself, although only a human mind could invent something as insipid as love. You must be able to see it, Mr. Kyf. You must know it by now. You can't win. It's pointless to keep fighting. Why, Mr. Kyf? Why? Why do you persist?"



The funny thing, like Agent Smith, if you look at him during that part in the movie, he seems genuinely confused, like Neo's speaking another language, like us to Kyf.

Fixed.
Because you actually believe that becuase Edo Madara can create 25 wood clones able to use v2 susanoo that EMS madara with wood clones, any clones>Minato... LMAO...

And that there is no difference between a rasengan and a Fuuton rasengan, despite one being an energy ball and the other being an energy ball filled with wind to enhance it...

So why do I keep fighting... Because it is not hard to fight the likes you and the other delusional fools who just make random claims based on nothing more then the conformation of their own bias, preconceived ideas and prejudice for my ideas...
Then even claim despite ALL the panels and LINKS of evidence I provide to support my claims, I never show evidence... LMAO... Just using that oh so retarded selective perception to make all my LINKS and PANELS just irrelevant Pics and shinny words...
__________________
KNOWLEDGE TO LIVE BY...

No matter how POWERFUL/STRONG you are. If you cannot CATCH your Enemy, all you POWER/STRENGTH is no more USEFUL then a squirt gun....
And if You cannot possibly TRACK/REACT to your enemies attacks to Defend yourself, then how can you possibly stop him from DEFEATING you at WILL...


MINATO "KYF" NAMIKAZE.

People live relying on they're Knowledge and Perception, and thus are bound to them.....
Those Boundaries are what they tend to accept as "Reality".....
However..... Knowledge and Perception are both ambiguous....
so "Reality" could be nothing more....
then an illusion....


ITACHI UCHIHA
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Old 10-08-2013, 01:31 PM   #72
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Re: Reverse situation...

Quote:
Originally Posted by kael03 View Post
But gaiz! Circles! Circles and poorly cropped panels that ignore everything else in the page that could damage the claim!
1). Using an Appeal to RIDICULE (as a Red Herring) which is just yet another fallaciously unreasonable argument from you again... just consistently having no reasonable argument to use which is why you resort to such red herring jack assery to hide you lack of a good argument by ridiculing mine...

2). PROOF That I am ignoring evidence in my own panels that could damage my CLAIM????

ANSWER: There is NONE!!!

Fact of the matter is, you are just trying to rationalize why the panels I use to prove my CLAIMS should be just ignored because I circle the points in them I am making as well as cropping panels together to save space as opposed to posting many pages at once, thus my panels must not be credible evidence despite being the DAMN manga which is the ONLY credible evidence besides the databooks... and saying exactly what I CLAIMED TOO...

Yea, Keep up the Delusions... Just like the one where I was not right about danzou with Izanagi theory... LAMO, the mental gymnastics on that one is just legendary...

IMO, NF is starting to show far more logic and common sense then you people...
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No matter how POWERFUL/STRONG you are. If you cannot CATCH your Enemy, all you POWER/STRENGTH is no more USEFUL then a squirt gun....
And if You cannot possibly TRACK/REACT to your enemies attacks to Defend yourself, then how can you possibly stop him from DEFEATING you at WILL...


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People live relying on they're Knowledge and Perception, and thus are bound to them.....
Those Boundaries are what they tend to accept as "Reality".....
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then an illusion....


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Old 10-08-2013, 02:36 PM   #73
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Re: Reverse situation...

I never said you were ignoring evidence in your panels. I said you were, poorly, cropping pages that could damage your claims and focusing solely on one panel while misinterpreting said panel.
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Old 10-08-2013, 03:00 PM   #74
Konnaha_yellow_flash
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Re: Reverse situation...

Quote:
Originally Posted by kael03 View Post
I never said you were ignoring evidence in your panels. I said you were, poorly, cropping pages that could damage your claims and focusing solely on one panel while misinterpreting said panel.
You said thisVVVV

Quote:
Originally Posted by kael03 View Post
But gaiz! Circles! Circles and poorly cropped panels that ignore everything else in the page that could damage the claim!
You are clearly claiming that I am circling and poorly cropping panels that ignores everything else in the page that could be detrimental to my CLAIM, which is UNTRUE!!!

What in my circles and cropping panels is possibly damaging to my CLAIM??? And What is being misinterpreted in the panels I circle and crop???

PROOF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

yet again all I get is pure Bullshit claims backed by nothing more then a BIAS opinion...
__________________
KNOWLEDGE TO LIVE BY...

No matter how POWERFUL/STRONG you are. If you cannot CATCH your Enemy, all you POWER/STRENGTH is no more USEFUL then a squirt gun....
And if You cannot possibly TRACK/REACT to your enemies attacks to Defend yourself, then how can you possibly stop him from DEFEATING you at WILL...


MINATO "KYF" NAMIKAZE.

People live relying on they're Knowledge and Perception, and thus are bound to them.....
Those Boundaries are what they tend to accept as "Reality".....
However..... Knowledge and Perception are both ambiguous....
so "Reality" could be nothing more....
then an illusion....


ITACHI UCHIHA
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Old 10-08-2013, 04:14 PM   #75
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Re: Reverse situation...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Konnaha_yellow_flash View Post
So why do I keep fighting... Because it is not hard to fight the likes you
Careful with spewing so much denial that is almost at its lethal dose, you might kill someone!

The very fact you have to make several threads about the issue and jump in the very moment you see the issue being discussed tells you're having hard time even catching up to others, much less claim any advantage. The very fact you have to bring up the same, already debunked arguments and panels and there's an absurdly high chance that the so called evidence is completely taken out of context (being the prime examples linking a moment of character development and another of comic relief and twist them beyond recognition) tells that you're desperate to be proven right and somehow have some retribution from all the egging you had.

Sorry, but all signs point out that you lost from the start and you're on a excruciatingly long session of damage control. Why not just stop this foolishness and stay put. After all, if you're indeed right, Kishimoto surely will do something about it, don't you think? Why waste your breath if you're not convincing anyone at the time?

Like I said before, why don't you focus on something more constructive (and that people here might like a lot considering past experiences) and start that fiction you talked about? Personally, I'd rather enjoy reading that instead of your incessant ramblings.
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