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Old 01-26-2012, 08:31 AM   #316
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Re: Us government's trick to violate civil liberties

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Originally Posted by almightywood View Post
I don't care how you operate on your own, whenever you choose not to give respect, you don't deserve to get it. When you resort to disrespect, then that's exactly what happens to you in return. I'm a firm believer in the golden rule...
For a "firm believer" in the Golden Rule, you sure do break it a hell of a lot.


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...that's why I treat people like they treat me.
Oh, because you have no idea what the Golden Rule is. That explains that, then. But that's what happens when you "believe" in the Golden Rule, I guess since it can't be known you get to decide for yourself if it's applicable.
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Old 01-26-2012, 08:55 AM   #317
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Re: Us government's trick to violate civil liberties

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Originally Posted by Mal View Post
For a "firm believer" in the Golden Rule, you sure do break it a hell of a lot.


Oh, because you have no idea what the Golden Rule is. That explains that, then. But that's what happens when you "believe" in the Golden Rule, I guess since it can't be known you get to decide for yourself if it's applicable.
Well, I am a firm believer in the golden rule. I start off applying it forwards, but if it starts to break, I put it in reverse to keep it intact.

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Originally Posted by Numinous View Post
Yes, it does make you wrong because you keep hammering a word with a connotation it does not have directly when another word is much better to express that connotation. And people will reply to the original connotation, not the one you're misusing. So yeah, use faith, not belief.
It does indeed have the direct connotation I stated it did. Maybe not where you're from, but connotations of words assuredly vary depending on who you're talking to.

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Except it was not using logic, it was using algebra. Algebra =/= logic. Logically, that statement is false.
Algebra is a system of logic.

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Except logic can't be abused if everyone has a clear understanding of it. It's only abused if someone involved in the debate doesn't know his/her logic all that well.
Miburo pulled some shit on me in this thread, linking together two separate statements and insisting that I prove the combined one. You also have pulled some shit on me and called it logic. Such as insisting that a carefully worded neutral post was a positive claim. The type of shit pulled by both of you is just as asinine as the example I used, so if it doesn't fall under your understanding of logic, then use one of the previous ones.

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And I'm sorry, what is "layman's logic"? Because logic, as far as I know, is universal, there can't be two versions of it.
The type of logic that has prevailed with pretty much every other group of people I have had a discussion with. The type that can't be used to alter the meaning of a person's words.


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You equate that Steve having skin cells from her breasts is proof that he got boob. What about the knowledge of feeling the breast skin itself and the underlying mammary glands and adipose tissue? Because skin cells aren't specialized in the area they're in, the skin cells from her breasts aren't any different from the skin cells of her feet.
I am saying that Steve equated having skin cells from her breasts as proof that he got boob.
It was an example of twisted logic (which is perfectly possible based on the rules you all are following for logic, you all have already proved it for me)

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Yes, it does. Flat Earth was a belief extremely common before Pythagoras and Parmenides disproved it back in the VI and V centuries A.D and it still lingers as a belief today, or else the Flat Earth Society wouldn't exist. So that makes it both a belief and a possibility, only science deemed it so improbable it can be dismissed as impossible.
I disagree.

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The last 3 definitions are pertinent to Theological Faith, while the others are to regular faith. Based on this quote:
Faith fits much better than belief.
Look faith is as unacceptable a word to me as belief is to you for much the same validity of a reason. Both have an extra connotation to them that doesn't apply that we each find distasteful to have when being used in the current discussion.

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Subjective proof does not exist, proof is objective by nature. Either you prove something or you don't, there's no middle ground where the term proof is applicable. Now the word suggestion is the word that covers that middle ground, since it means "the sequential process by which one thought or mental image leads to another". That's why there's no proof of God, if there was there'd be only one religion and everybody would subscribe to it (with the exception of stubborn idiots). Now what there might be is the suggestion of God, something that makes you think of God's existence.
There is such a thing as subjective proof. Since beliefs and understandings are subjective by nature, proof can only be objective if it uses understandings and beliefs that are universal to all included in the unveiling of the proof. If it doesn't include such, it is still proof, but not to everybody, making it subjective proof.


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Wrong. Laws aren't proven theories. Laws are mathematical explanations of facts, while theories are worded explanations of facts. That's why you don't have a Law of Evolution for the fact of evolution, you have the Theory of Evolution. And that's why you can have the Laws of Thermodynamics and the Theory of Thermodynamics.
Laws are indeed proven theories. The scientific society has established a very rigorous standard that must be met before a theory is worthy of becoming a law. Newton's law of gravitation used to be his theory of gravitation. Einstein's theory of relativity is a theory because we can't study what happens to matter when it reaches the speed of light.

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Again, laws are mathematical explanations of facts, not facts themselves. And think of the empirical method's core for a bit. It says "Here are the facts, what conclusions can we draw from them?", not "Here are the conclusions, what facts can we use to support them?". So facts prove laws/theories, not the other way around.
Laws mean something different when referring to mathematics than when referring to science. Science has laws too, you are just confusing the two.
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Old 01-26-2012, 09:07 AM   #318
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Re: Us government's trick to violate civil liberties

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Originally Posted by almightywood View Post
Well, I am a firm believer in the golden rule. I start off applying it forwards, but if it starts to break, I put it in reverse to keep it intact.
That makes no fucking sense at all. It "starts to break" only when you no longer feel like following it; the actions of others have no effect on its integrity. Your way of "keeping it intact" is the only thing that breaks it.
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Old 01-26-2012, 09:32 AM   #319
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Re: Us government's trick to violate civil liberties

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Originally Posted by Mal View Post
That makes no fucking sense at all. It "starts to break" only when you no longer feel like following it; the actions of others have no effect on its integrity. Your way of "keeping it intact" is the only thing that breaks it.
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

I would have them treat me as I treat them.

By turning the rule around, it makes both true.
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Old 01-26-2012, 09:59 AM   #320
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Re: Us government's trick to violate civil liberties

No, it doesn't. And you're still stupid.
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Old 01-26-2012, 10:19 AM   #321
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Re: Us government's trick to violate civil liberties

Quote:
Originally Posted by almightywood View Post
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

I would have them treat me as I treat them.

By turning the rule around, it makes both true.
Let's try a more accurate translation: "And as ye would that men should do to you, do ye also to them likewise." Surely your default position is not to want everyone to treat you like shit, and your basic desire for what way people should treat you doesn't change just because they aren't treating you in that way.
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Old 01-26-2012, 10:30 AM   #322
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Re: Us government's trick to violate civil liberties

Pretty sure I never stated that I'd like to track you down and brutally murder you in this thread. So might as well stop pretending you're not a horrible person with this reverse golden rule shit. Not fooling anyone except yourself, bro.
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Old 01-26-2012, 10:33 AM   #323
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Re: Us government's trick to violate civil liberties

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mal View Post
Let's try a more accurate translation: "And as ye would that men should do to you, do ye also to them likewise." Surely your default position is not to want everyone to treat you like shit, and your basic desire for what way people should treat you doesn't change just because they aren't treating you in that way.
More accurate translation of what?
I didn't translate anything.

All that I want from people is that they treat me with the same respect that I treat them.

If they don't respect me, well I don't respect them right back, at which point we are both treating each other with the same level of respect making my wishes be fulfilled, not to mention that if they are followers of the golden rule, well I did them a solid by giving them what they wanted.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Miburo View Post
Pretty sure I never stated that I'd like to track you down and brutally murder you in this thread. So might as well stop pretending you're not a horrible person with this reverse golden rule shit. Not fooling anyone except yourself, bro.
Disrespect is disrespect. That's the only "bad" thing any of us can do to each other here, and I certainly didn't disrespect you first.

Last edited by almightywood; 01-26-2012 at 10:43 AM.
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Old 01-26-2012, 10:38 AM   #324
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Re: Us government's trick to violate civil liberties

"Treat me how I want to be treated or I'll threaten to track you down and kill you."
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Old 01-26-2012, 10:45 AM   #325
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Re: Us government's trick to violate civil liberties

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Originally Posted by Miburo View Post
"Treat me how I want to be treated or I'll threaten to track you down and kill you."
More like, if you don't want to be treated like shit, don't treat people like shit.
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Old 01-26-2012, 10:50 AM   #326
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Re: Us government's trick to violate civil liberties

No, it's more like exactly what I said. I never threatened to physically attack you. Let alone track you down, mutilate you, then kill you. If you honestly can't tell the difference between someone disrespecting you on the internet and death threats then you're just proving my point: You're a horrible person.
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Old 01-26-2012, 10:55 AM   #327
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Re: Us government's trick to violate civil liberties

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Originally Posted by almightywood View Post
More accurate translation of what?
I didn't translate anything.

All that I want from people is that they treat me with the same respect that I treat them.

If they don't respect me, well I don't respect them right back, at which point we are both treating each other with the same level of respect making my wishes be fulfilled, not to mention that if they are followers of the golden rule, well I did them a solid by giving them what they wanted.
A more accurate translation of the text the (Western) Golden Rule is based on. And of course you didn't translate anything, you took the standard phrasing as it was translated by others.

If that is how you interpret the Golden Rule, then feel free to continue claiming you follow it, but specify you mean the Babylonian Golden Rule (ie reciprocity).
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Old 01-26-2012, 10:59 AM   #328
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Re: Us government's trick to violate civil liberties

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Originally Posted by Miburo View Post
No, it's more like exactly what I said. I never threatened to physically attack you. Let alone track you down, mutilate you, then kill you. If you honestly can't tell the difference between someone disrespecting you on the internet and death threats then you're just proving my point: You're a horrible person.

So now you are attempting to try and tell me what your morals and beliefs are based on your understandings.

An insult is something that is intended to make the person feel bad, whether sad, angry, hurt, or fearful. All that was intending to do was something along those lines. The whole point was to get you to imagine the sensation for a minute, not to go through with it in any wise. If you think that a death threat from someone on the internet who you purposefully antagonized to the point where you knew they were about to snap on you is in any way an example of how "righteous" that person is, you are sorely mistaken. It's really only an example of how much of a manipulative disrespectful bastard you are, that you could push someone to that point.
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Old 01-26-2012, 11:03 AM   #329
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Re: Us government's trick to violate civil liberties

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Originally Posted by almightywood View Post
Usually the more irrational the belief is that someone has, the greater the chance that belief is the only thing that is keeping them sane. I've seen more than one person snap, and I've never seen it happen due to application of someone's beliefs, it has always been through them being questioned.
There is some truth to this. Those crazy bastards in the Westboro Baptist church have some pretty extreme beliefs, and snap every time they are questioned about it. But then again, they don't seem half as nutty as you. I mean, if they suddenly got 20 text messages from Jeezus, I bet they wouldn't be all secretive about it. Fuck, they'd be telling everyone they know about it while screaming "PROOF". Plus while those guys are extremely Anti-gay, I don't recall them every accusing anyone of doing anything remotely insane as what you said to Num.

So then, are you willing to acknowledge that your own beliefs are irrational?


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If you reason away the meaning of someone's life, then there is no man left with to be reasoned with anymore.
Care to elaborate a bit more about what you mean?

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I've had to attempt to convince people...
I thought you were against telling people what to think.


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...of the truth of facts...
I thought there were no absolute truths, only beliefs.

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...that they are clearly mistaken about...
Mistaken according to you. Which of course is your belief, that you apparently think is superior to theirs. It sounds to me, that by labeling their beliefs as "mistaken", you are in fact eliminating a possibility of it being true, which completely goes against your life philosophy of being open minded to ALL things. nice job.
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Old 01-26-2012, 11:05 AM   #330
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Re: Us government's trick to violate civil liberties

@AW-So you're saying that you threatening to kill someone because they made you feel bad on the internet actually proves that the person being threatened is a dick? You actually think you're entirely justified in threatening to kill people because of stuff posted on the interweb? Seriously?

You are an immoral monster.
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