Us government's trick to violate civil liberties - Page 28

**Miburo** · 02-03-2012, 12:16 PM

Everyone should read and comment on PoF and DoBaW. Well, everyone that can.

Also, don't see why this AW dude is so adamant against answering a simple yes or no question with either a yes or no. It's like his actual goal in here is to be as dumb as humanly possible.

ACt · 02-03-2012, 12:47 PM

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Also, don't see why this AW dude is so adamant against answering a simple yes or no question with either a yes or no. It's like his actual goal in here is to be as dumb as humanly possible.

I'm going to go with an irrational fear of being wrong. He'll probably tell us that's incorrect but provide no reason why, which is an inherit trait of said fear. Always tell others what it isn't and never what it is thus preventing you from ever truly saying something incorrect.

Numinous · 02-03-2012, 12:57 PM

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Originally Posted by Miburo

Also, don't see why this AW dude is so adamant against answering a simple yes or no question with either a yes or no. It's like his actual goal in here is to be as dumb as humanly possible.

QFT.

Really, he keeps with the atheist=anti-god shit which is just stupid, guess AW doesn't know what an antitheist and/or a misotheist are (and gnosis too, since he thinks agnostics are only theistic by nature). And of course he likes to be the yellow in a red & blue equation, because he's special like that.

Let's see if I start reading OH stories and kill my hesitation.

ACt · 02-03-2012, 01:16 PM

Dude - you read the stories and there are potential kick ass characters vaguely based on yourself written into them. How can you lose?! (And honestly, if you have time to read and respond to this stuff... just saying.)

Here's something I never quite understood about theists (if I may hijack the thread again): how is they ~~always~~ usually stop at one god? Can anyone truly come up with a system where there is one of anything? (Assuming they believe their god is part of life, which isn't absolutely necessary for creation to work.) Doesn't believing in just one god put you on weak ground to deny the existence of all other gods? I mean, I've only ever seen one leopard (in the wild) in my life. But to get that one, I knew there had to be many many more.

Numinous · 02-03-2012, 01:33 PM

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Originally Posted by ACt

Dude - you read the stories and there are potential kick ass characters vaguely based on yourself written into them. How can you lose?! (And honestly, if you have time to read and respond to this stuff... just saying.)

I like to read things in one-go. 90 posts in one-go makes me hesitate. Irrational, I know.

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Here's something I never quite understood about theists (if I may hijack the thread again): how is they ~~always~~ usually stop at one god? Can anyone truly come up with a system where there is one of anything? (Assuming they believe their god is part of life, which isn't absolutely necessary for creation to work.) Doesn't believing in just one god put you on weak ground to deny the existence of all other gods? I mean, I've only ever seen one leopard (in the wild) in my life. But to get that one, I knew there had to be many many more.

That's a question more geared to monotheists, but the majority of
Christians I've talked about that just say they're not acquainted with the thousands of other Gods, so they just reject them like that. Which is a shame, it'd be interesting to see if, after gaining such acquaintance, they'd still reject said Gods.

ACt · 02-03-2012, 02:14 PM

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Originally Posted by Numinous

I like to read things in one-go. 90 posts in one-go makes me hesitate. Irrational, I know.

Well, I'm going full novel style (chapters run 5-to-8 full posts; which is 10,000 char by the way), so you can read a few chapters, come back to it the next day type of thing. But yeah, some are bothered by the fact that updates aren't immediate though i'm usually good for a chapter a month.

Human Rasengan · 02-03-2012, 06:45 PM

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Originally Posted by Numinous

Oops, meant "intersecting", not "interchangeable", my mistake. Thanks to Miburo for clearing that up.

As I said previously, the human brain evolved with the promotion of taking sides immediately due to survival issues. It is IMPOSSIBLE for you to acknowledge something and not form an opinion for or against it, even if feign.

That's why there are no neutral parties in politics, humans just can't be truly neutral about politics without either ignoring or avoiding them. The same goes for food, music, the existence of God, among others.

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Tell that to switzerland they make money off both sides

So what if my understanding of English does not recognize "neutral" under the category of God (non) beliefs? Mu understanding allows a Gnostic Theist, an Agnostic Theist, a Deist, a Spiritual Atheist, an Agnostic Atheist and a Gnostic Atheist vs your understanding of only having Theist, Atheist, Agnostic and Neutral. 6 terms vs 4 terms and I'm the limited one? Try harder, will you?

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so you break it down to a knowing believer an unsure beliver fence straddler , a person who believes in a higher power, a non beleiver who believes in "something" an un-believer who isn't sure if he should not believe and athiest light.. adding more options to the mix doesn't mke you more profound you're just splitting hairs.. either you Believe(with or without doubts) you Don't believe (with or without doubts) or you havent taken a stance

@ HR: I made a mistake, which I know is kind of silly after saying I have to know what I'm saying, but sometimes I slip. I'm only human,

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ok but I'm not gonna cherry pick your posts for what you really menat when you seem to do a good job at saying what you really mean.. I'll just overlook this

so listen to Miburo since he explained it nicely.

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already addressed that

This takes me back to proof vs suggestion. What you just said are suggestions of God, if they were proof they'd be unquestionable. So you presented no proof of God, or did anyone for that matter.

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OK well you should tell scientists to quit suggesting that there was a big bang and that there is dark matter in the universe or that the universe is finite or has multiple dimensions cause honestly they have no proof! which goes back to what i said about evidence not being adequate enough for the person who's in disbelief! I bet when Pompeii was about to blow someone knew that it wasn't snowing and that the smoke on the mountains wasn't just some storm clouds.. those that needed further information to believe their life was in danger are encased in ash on the island to this day

Miburo is right when he says everyone's agnostic about God's existence, because that's what is logically happening. The terms Gnostic (a)theist only comes up when people are so convinced of their (a)theism they proclaim to know that God does (not) indeed exist. It's illogical, but that's what you get with the flexibility of definition (oh wait, AW thinks I'm strict, it must be a contradiction, oh noes!!!).

highlighted for truth because that is the only thing that anyone can be certain of..and curious as to why yyou didn't include Ignostic into your realm of un/believers

Human Rasengan · 02-03-2012, 07:01 PM

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Originally Posted by ACt

Here's something I never quite understood about theists (if I may hijack the thread again): how is they ~~always~~ usually stop at one god? Can anyone truly come up with a system where there is one of anything? (Assuming they believe their god is part of life, which isn't absolutely necessary for creation to work.) Doesn't believing in just one god put you on weak ground to deny the existence of all other gods? I mean, I've only ever seen one leopard (in the wild) in my life. But to get that one, I knew there had to be many many more.

that's just an assumption there are many albeit unpopular forms of religion that allows for more than one God .. even forms of Christianity. Mormons for example believe that as man is God once was and how God is Man may become. .. also that "our" God had/ has a God of his own that showed him how to attain that level and if one lives righteously that they too will be in that role leading their spirit children on the same path of eternal progression.

The Bible mentions other deities all the time.. and there was a commandment that people take with a grain of salt" Have no other God's before me" if there weren't any other God's then how could you not put them before "HIM". many believe this pertains to Idol worship but that was taken care of with the no graven image commandment .. see it's two separate issues

Another example is the Nation of Islam who believe in 24 divine scientists who take turns being the dominant force in the world gaining the title of the best knower aka "God" or you can look at an Elohist for examples of people that believe in more than one god

xxMESTxx · 02-03-2012, 09:41 PM

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Originally Posted by Human Rasengan

OK well you should tell scientists to quit suggesting that there was a big bang and that there is dark matter in the universe or that the universe is finite or has multiple dimensions cause honestly they have no proof! which goes back to what i said about evidence not being adequate enough for the person who's in disbelief! I bet when Pompeii was about to blow someone knew that it wasn't snowing and that the smoke on the mountains wasn't just some storm clouds.. those that needed further information to believe their life was in danger are encased in ash on the island to this day

That's fucking stupid. There is a lot more proof of the big bang and dark matter than there is a god. Scientist are looking for answers through research and facts, not fear mongering a bunch of brainless dopes through faith and belief. You can't even accurately compare the two. So why blurt out stupid shit?

Human Rasengan · 02-03-2012, 10:30 PM

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Originally Posted by xxMESTxx

That's fucking stupid. There is a lot more proof of the big bang and dark matter than there is a god. Scientist are looking for answers through research and facts, not fear mongering a bunch of brainless dopes through faith and belief. You can't even accurately compare the two. So why blurt out stupid shit?

THe point .. which you obviously missed wasn't to discredit science I was simply pointing out how some view "suggested" evidence and deem it not adequate enough to be boiled down as being a fact .. because if this scientific evidence is soo concrete then the big bang theory would be the big bang fact and there would be no need for the religious zealots as you have painted them to keep harping about creationism..

The point once again if you didn't catch it was to show how someoen can be shown evidence and still not deem it adequate.

I prposed the fact that my body and it's complex functions (as I see them) can't be a product of sheer chance and is proof enough that there is a God.. others need more proof

and as you pointed out there is "suggested " evidence of Dark matter, parallel universes and the Big bang yet these aren't considered facts.

PLEASE TRY TO COMPREHEND WHATS BEING DEBATED BEFORE YOU DEBATE! THANK YOU !

ask me anything · 02-03-2012, 11:02 PM

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Originally Posted by Human Rasengan

The Bible mentions other deities all the time.. and there was a commandment that people take with a grain of salt" Have no other God's before me" if there weren't any other God's then how could you not put them before "HIM". many believe this pertains to Idol worship but that was taken care of with the no graven image commandment .. see it's two separate issues

LOL, don't go twisting words HR. That commandment just means don't attempt to worship other gods, and doesn't imply that the option exists. It's the thought that counts. It's really no different then you aiming a gun at me and pulling the trigger, not knowing that it's unloaded. You see, you don't actually have the option of killing me like that, but you still had the intent to do so.

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Originally Posted by Human Rasengan

Another example is the Nation of Islam who believe in 24 divine scientists who take turns being the dominant force in the world gaining the title of the best knower aka "God"

Wut? Care to post me a link of something that mentions this? I just googled this shit, and I found nothing.

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Originally Posted by Human Rasengan

or you can look at an Elohist for examples of people that believe in more than one god

No. The term Elohim in the Jewish text, describes more then just God. It can also apply to angels, demons, spirits of the dead, kings, prophets, and just about anything else that's supernatural in nature.

xxMESTxx · 02-03-2012, 11:12 PM

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Originally Posted by Human Rasengan

THe point .. which you obviously missed wasn't to discredit science I was simply pointing out how some view "suggested" evidence and deem it not adequate enough to be boiled down as being a fact ..

No I got your incredibly stupid point. You missed me pointing out how stupid of an example it was, obviously.

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because if this scientific evidence is soo concrete then the big bang theory would be the big bang fact and there would be no need for the

See, you're spouting stupid shit again. Nobody claims that the big bang is fool proof, what I stated was that there is more evidence proving the big bang, than there is proving a god exists.

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and there would be no need for the religious zealots as you have painted them to keep harping about creationism..

Except the fact that they're religious zealot's. Some people(you included) are just to fucking stupid to rationalize life without the existence of a god.

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The point once again if you didn't catch it was to show how someoen can be shown evidence and still not deem it adequate.

Bro, unlike you, I use more than half my brain. You can keep thinking I missed your point, or you can accept that I could give a fuck what you were "debating" and was primarily addressing the stupidity you posted trying to back your shit up.

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I prposed the fact that my body and it's complex functions (as I see them) can't be a product of sheer chance and is proof enough that there is a God.. others need more proof

They're only complex because you're uneducated. The human body's "complex functions" are easily explained, learn Anatomy, man.

I can't believe you're so easily convinced.

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and as you pointed out there is "suggested " evidence of Dark matter, parallel universes and the Big bang yet these aren't considered facts.

Right, they're just theory's with mountains of evidence supporting them, while all you jesus freaks stay convinced by answering all your unknowns with "God".

Oh gee, I aren't smart enough to understand how my body workz since I don't knows, IT MUST BE GOD!

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PLEASE TRY TO COMPREHEND WHATS BEING DEBATED BEFORE YOU DEBATE! THANK YOU !

Is that what you call what you're doing here? Debating? How cute. No, from what I saw, you were just saying stupid shit that other people were proving wrong, so you decided to back it up, with stupid shit, that I called you on.

Again, I have no problem following your simplistic and narrow minded posts.

Human Rasengan · 02-03-2012, 11:16 PM

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Originally Posted by ask me anything

LOL, don't go twisting words HR. That commandment just means don't attempt to worship other gods, and doesn't imply that the option exists. It's the thought that counts. It's really no different then you aiming a gun at me and pulling the trigger, not knowing that it's unloaded. You see, you don't actually have the option of killing me like that, but you still had the intent to do so.

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No i take it as literal.. the Bible mentions other gods. Baal , Ashera, ect if that were the case why wasn't the commandment.. "hey it's just me up here" but i get what you're saying but your belief if you are a believer wont allow that concept to play around in your head because it's blasphemous

Wut? Care to post me a link of something that mentions this? I just googled this shit, and I found nothing.

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Yea I couldn't find it either but there was a book on it that someone let me read .. he was a member of the Nation of Islam not the traditional kind... it went on to say that there is a pantheon of 24 men who are all Gods and one sits on the throne for a set season of 24,000 years or great processional year.. and that Yahweh or Jehova who is represented by the fish rules the age of Pices and there will be a battle on (mt Horeb) or whatever the mountain of god is to determine the ruler of the Age of aquarious

No. The term Elohim in the Jewish text, describes more then just God. It can also apply to angels, demons, spirits of the dead, kings, prophets, and just about anything else that's supernatural in nature.

I know Elohim describs god and his angels and other spirits but an Elohist believes in plurality of god http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elohim#Elohist

Human Rasengan · 02-03-2012, 11:38 PM

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Originally Posted by xxMESTxx

See, you're spouting stupid shit again. Nobody claims that the big bang is fool proof, what I stated was that there is more evidence proving the big bang, than there is proving a god exists.

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yet neither are concrete facts yet

Except the fact that they're religious zealot's. Some people(you included) are just to fucking stupid to rationalize life without the existence of a god.

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and the same case can be made about un-believers on the converse

Bro, unlike you, I use more than half my brain. You can keep thinking I missed your point,

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I know you missed it casue of this lil rant here

or you can accept that I could give a fuck what you were "debating" and was primarily addressing the stupidity you posted trying to back your shit up.

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fix this so I can get your true meaning

They're only complex because you're uneducated. The human body's "complex functions" are easily explained, learn Anatomy, man.

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anatomy explains the inner workings of the human body but not how all the shit is regulated and timed .. there is an appear-ant design to make a system that complex to function in the way it does on auto pilot...THE POINT IS WHO'S THE DESIGNER

I can't believe you're so easily convinced.

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and I can't believe that you blatantly ignore the obvious.. see what i did there.. which if you would stop for a second you'd see what the point of this is

Right, they're just theory's with mountains of evidence supporting them, while all you jesus freaks stay convinced by answering all your unknowns with "God".

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and I present actual mountains as proof of god and you don't accept them thats on you .. which is the point .. but hey you already sated you understood that

Oh gee, I aren't smart enough to understand how my body workz since I don't knows, IT MUST BE GOD!

Is that what you call what you're doing here? Debating? How cute. No, from what I saw, you were just saying stupid shit that other people were proving wrong, so you decided to back it up, with stupid shit, that I called you on.

Again, I have no problem following your simplistic and narrow minded posts.

No what you did was see my name and thought you'd enjoy having a trolling fest .. by all means go ahead.. you missed the topic to say what you wanted to say and now that you've done that whats next on your agenda?

xxMESTxx · 02-04-2012, 12:45 AM

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Originally Posted by Human Rasengan

yet neither are concrete facts yet

You're right, one just has way, way more evidence. Want to guess which one it is?

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and the same case can be made about un-believers on the converse

Not really, the majority of unbelievers, do so because of the substantial amount of evidence, which leads them to the completely logical, and rational belief, that there isn't some magic dude in the sky.

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I know you missed it casue of this lil rant here

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fix this so I can get your true meaning

I didn't know not giving a fuck was ranting. Also, I can't fix English, because it isn't broken. Reread, since you probably have to.

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anatomy explains the inner workings of the human body but not how all the shit is regulated and timed .. there is an appear-ant design to make a system that complex to function in the way it does on auto pilot...THE POINT IS WHO'S THE DESIGNER

What are you talking about? What shit regulated and timed? I'm sure you just have no fucking clue what you're talking about. Also, say hello to the theory of Evolution.

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and I can't believe that you blatantly ignore the obvious.. see what i did there.. which if you would stop for a second you'd see what the point of this is

I don't see what you did there. It's probably pretty stupid though. Don't need to stop. Understand just fine. What don't you get about that?

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and I present actual mountains as proof of god and you don't accept them thats on you .. which is the point .. but hey you already sated you understood that

Really? You're going to try and make a point with more stupid shit? Again, if you're that easily convinced, you're one of the brainless dope's I was referring to.

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No what you did was see my name and thought you'd enjoy having a trolling fest .. by all means go ahead..

Egotistical AND stupid, you're just a complete package huh?

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you missed the topic to say what you wanted to say and now that you've done that whats next on your agenda?

Again, I could give a fuck about the topic you were discussing. I saw you say stupid shit, I called you out, you're trying to defend yourself by posting things that make little sense and don't even help your point.

02-03-2012, 12:16 PM	#406
Miburo Deos Fortioribus Adesse Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Valhalla Posts: 3,543 Thanks: 34,417 Thanked 17,643 Times in 5,442 Posts	Re: Us government's trick to violate civil liberties Everyone should read and comment on PoF and DoBaW. Well, everyone that can. Also, don't see why this AW dude is so adamant against answering a simple yes or no question with either a yes or no. It's like his actual goal in here is to be as dumb as humanly possible.

02-03-2012, 01:16 PM	#409
ACt Heart Wizard Join Date: May 2009 Location: The Halls of Irreverence Posts: 3,249 Thanks: 5,321 Thanked 18,674 Times in 4,842 Posts	Re: Us government's trick to violate civil liberties Dude - you read the stories and there are potential kick ass characters vaguely based on yourself written into them. How can you lose?! (And honestly, if you have time to read and respond to this stuff... just saying.) Here's something I never quite understood about theists (if I may hijack the thread again): how is they ~~always~~ usually stop at one god? Can anyone truly come up with a system where there is one of anything? (Assuming they believe their god is part of life, which isn't absolutely necessary for creation to work.) Doesn't believing in just one god put you on weak ground to deny the existence of all other gods? I mean, I've only ever seen one leopard (in the wild) in my life. But to get that one, I knew there had to be many many more. __________________ It's amazing to me that, unlike in the real world, people on the internet will wear "everyone thinks I'm a moron" as a badge of honour.

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