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Old 07-09-2012, 01:49 PM   #1
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Tobi's "Moons eye" plan...

IMO, tobi's recent preaching has revealed more then it seems...

here..http://www.mangakong.com/manga/Naruto/564/15
and here...http://www.mangakong.com/manga/Naruto/564/16

Tobi believed himself in actuality to be no one...

He does not want to be ANYONE....

And all he cares about is completing the "moons eye" plan...

He also believes the world is completely worthless... with nothing, but misery in it...
He even thinks KB and naruto should understand that misery growing up as host
s for tailed beasts....

There are a couple things we can determine from this preaching IMO...

:Tobi must have served a role where he was forced to see the ugly side of the ninja wolrd... to take on many names and even forget his original identity... or just shun it and the very concept of identity by dawning a mask with no identity to cover his original...

:after such a role he only uses certain names like "madara uchiha" to achieve a specific goal... but has no desire to have any identity at all... he doesn't want to be anyone...

IMO, I believe tobi Originally was a spy... someone who saw the dark side of the shinobi world while playing the role of a nameless shinobi in the darkness.
Tobi likely believes that the many different identities of the world create the misery and hate, thus if the world can be united into one ultimate identity... there would be no differences to clash over and the hate would be gone...

I believe tobi's mask is not just hiding his identity... but is his identity... he is no one with his mask... only showing the SG and RG as his only connection to any identity... the identity, IMO, he wants from the "moons eye" plan... as no one he wants to become everyone... thus gain an identity by creating one single identity that the world shares when tobi becomes one with everyone..(reference here...http://www.mangakong.com/manga/Naruto/467/11

Tobi is similar to kabuto in that both are searching for identity... kabuto just attains others power and knowledge to gain identity by being someone else... the more power and information he gains the more Identity he gains as well.. all because kabuto has no identity of his own...
However, tobi does not seem to be interested in gaining identity through power or info... but rather accepts his lack of identity and even prefers to not have identity... but, still has some yearning for identity which is why he is so determined to complete the moons eye plan in order to gain a single ultimate identity through uniting everyone...

When the fight comes to its climax, IMO, tobi will be broken down by naruto... talk no jutsu to death until tobi is willing to reclaim his identity which will be symbolized by the removal of the mask... thus his "No one identity" the mask represented will be thrown away along with the ideal to attain a single ultimate identity through uniting everyone with the power of the juubi....

This^^^ for consideration of tobi's true identity...
someone who was a spy... took on many names, but had no real identity... someone who could have lost what its means to be someone after being no one for so long... or even someone who could have been greatly injured gaining amnesia thus forgeting his orignial identity which spurs him on to gain an identity....

A couple people I can imagine...

(rather random, but still plausible in this manga unfortunately..) OBITO: After being crushed by the boulders, for some random reason the act of giving his eye for a cause reminded madara or zetsu of izuna.... so obito was rescued from under the rubble... implanted with hashirama's cells in order to heal his injuries... but obito forgot who he was which is why he is such a douche now trying to gain one ultimate identlity from the moons eye plan...
I know... WTF kishi...

Next: still keep coming back to shisui... he was said by itachi to believe that a true shinobi protected peace from the shadows... NAMELESS... and self sacrifice... all this tobi is and has done... serving akatsuki from its shadows... likely controlling the 4th mizukage from the mist's shadows... and as a nameless shinobi... shisui would truely see himself to be No ONE... or by his philosophy not WANT TO BE ANYONE just like tobi... Shisui as the nameless shinobi from the shadows has lost all desire for identity... but still believes that the world would be better off as one single ultimate identity with him...

Last I would imagine that a madara Zetsu clone could be tobi... As merely madara's copy... he is madara, but is not him as well... thus tobi as a madara zetsu clone is trying to attain his own identity through the moons eye plan...

Take from this what you will...
__________________
KNOWLEDGE TO LIVE BY...

No matter how POWERFUL/STRONG you are. If you cannot CATCH your Enemy, all you POWER/STRENGTH is no more USEFUL then a squirt gun....
And if You cannot possibly TRACK/REACT to your enemies attacks to Defend yourself, then how can you possibly stop him from DEFEATING you at WILL...


MINATO "KYF" NAMIKAZE.

People live relying on they're Knowledge and Perception, and thus are bound to them.....
Those Boundaries are what they tend to accept as "Reality".....
However..... Knowledge and Perception are both ambiguous....
so "Reality" could be nothing more....
then an illusion....


ITACHI UCHIHA
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Old 07-09-2012, 02:27 PM   #2
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Re: Tobi's "Moons eye" plan...

Neither of this are logical for who fought Minato and used the Kyuubi to attack the Leaf.
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1. Naruto's act 1 was really good

2. Part Two started off alright, it introduced new characters and it continued to show the same potential, honestly, the story had a lot of promise up until the Pain Arc.

3. Pain Arc occurs and all Leaf ninja are revived after they were slaughtered, this started the failing of Kishi because he won't kill off main charcters.

4. Kage Summit was a tad disappointing simply because we didn't see any of the charcters that SHOULD have been introduced during the chuunin exams.

5. The War has been epicly disappointing because Kishi is killing off Edo's in a matter of one chapter when each edo (Kages, Swordsman, Nagato and Itachi) when they should get around 4 or 5 chapters of dedication.

Kishi started cutting the story shorter, his chapters have gotten shorter from 21 pages to 17 per week,

Now if you don't like this reasoning, you can simply go to another forum.
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Old 07-09-2012, 03:05 PM   #3
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Re: Tobi's "Moons eye" plan...

Quote:
Originally Posted by krurk View Post
Neither of this are logical for who fought Minato and used the Kyuubi to attack the Leaf.
Why not???

And.... off topic... IMO...
Off topic, but, it was likely the uchiha in league with danzou who freed the kyuubi then had it attack the village... All so the uchiha could regain the kyuubi while danzou got to become Hokage... i mean why esle was the uchiha nowhere to be found during the attack along wiht tobi wearing no akatsuki cloak... tobi was clearly not working for them, but rather some other cause like the uchiha trying to regain their prowess as a powerful caln like they were when madara was alive and in control of the kyuubi...
This is for another thread though...
__________________
KNOWLEDGE TO LIVE BY...

No matter how POWERFUL/STRONG you are. If you cannot CATCH your Enemy, all you POWER/STRENGTH is no more USEFUL then a squirt gun....
And if You cannot possibly TRACK/REACT to your enemies attacks to Defend yourself, then how can you possibly stop him from DEFEATING you at WILL...


MINATO "KYF" NAMIKAZE.

People live relying on they're Knowledge and Perception, and thus are bound to them.....
Those Boundaries are what they tend to accept as "Reality".....
However..... Knowledge and Perception are both ambiguous....
so "Reality" could be nothing more....
then an illusion....


ITACHI UCHIHA
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Old 07-09-2012, 03:15 PM   #4
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Re: Tobi's "Moons eye" plan...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Konnaha_yellow_flash View Post
Why not???

And.... off topic... IMO...
Off topic, but, it was likely the uchiha in league with danzou who freed the kyuubi then had it attack the village... All so the uchiha could regain the kyuubi while danzou got to become Hokage... i mean why esle was the uchiha nowhere to be found during the attack along wiht tobi wearing no akatsuki cloak... tobi was clearly not working for them, but rather some other cause like the uchiha trying to regain their prowess as a powerful caln like they were when madara was alive and in control of the kyuubi...
This is for another thread though...
Obito would more than likely be still too young for a fight against the fastest shinobi ever.

We were discussing Shisui in the other thread so I won't repeat myself but neither character is really logical.

I won't lie I do think the Uchiha knew the Leaf was going to be attacked because none of them are shown fighting the Kyuubi and I highly doubt Sasuke's father would not be in the frey. I do agree there, it is strange, but I do not think that means Shisui is Tobi, he wouldn't fit the personality disorder.
__________________
1. Naruto's act 1 was really good

2. Part Two started off alright, it introduced new characters and it continued to show the same potential, honestly, the story had a lot of promise up until the Pain Arc.

3. Pain Arc occurs and all Leaf ninja are revived after they were slaughtered, this started the failing of Kishi because he won't kill off main charcters.

4. Kage Summit was a tad disappointing simply because we didn't see any of the charcters that SHOULD have been introduced during the chuunin exams.

5. The War has been epicly disappointing because Kishi is killing off Edo's in a matter of one chapter when each edo (Kages, Swordsman, Nagato and Itachi) when they should get around 4 or 5 chapters of dedication.

Kishi started cutting the story shorter, his chapters have gotten shorter from 21 pages to 17 per week,

Now if you don't like this reasoning, you can simply go to another forum.
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Old 07-09-2012, 06:16 PM   #5
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Re: Tobi's "Moons eye" plan...

Quote:
Originally Posted by krurk View Post
Obito would more than likely be still too young for a fight against the fastest shinobi ever.

We were discussing Shisui in the other thread so I won't repeat myself but neither character is really logical.

I won't lie I do think the Uchiha knew the Leaf was going to be attacked because none of them are shown fighting the Kyuubi and I highly doubt Sasuke's father would not be in the frey. I do agree there, it is strange, but I do not think that means Shisui is Tobi, he wouldn't fit the personality disorder.
Shisui's age is unconfirmed... but his height difference with itachi suggests he is a fully grown adult or just a giant 14 year old... either way shisui's height matches up with tobi so all we need is his age and to find out where his body is...

And why wouldn't shisui fit the personality disorder??? all tobi did was play a role as a bumbling annoying fool in order to be disarming... its not a personality disorder at all... its called acting... ninja did it for espionage... for assassinations and even for reconnaissance... There is no evidence to suggest whoever tobi really is was doing nothing more then playing a role in order to achieve a goal... just like he did with madara... just like he did as the 4th mizukage as well... perhaps even as shisui himself... maybe tobi infiltrated the uchiha using his double Kotoamatsukami to control the clans mind and make them believe he was always there... who knows....

Either way the so called personality disorder is not a disorder at all... its simple acting and any spy would be capable of doing it... So that doesn't disprove shisui, obito or anyone since acting is not so hard for a ninja when thats what they are trained to do for certain occasions...
__________________
KNOWLEDGE TO LIVE BY...

No matter how POWERFUL/STRONG you are. If you cannot CATCH your Enemy, all you POWER/STRENGTH is no more USEFUL then a squirt gun....
And if You cannot possibly TRACK/REACT to your enemies attacks to Defend yourself, then how can you possibly stop him from DEFEATING you at WILL...


MINATO "KYF" NAMIKAZE.

People live relying on they're Knowledge and Perception, and thus are bound to them.....
Those Boundaries are what they tend to accept as "Reality".....
However..... Knowledge and Perception are both ambiguous....
so "Reality" could be nothing more....
then an illusion....


ITACHI UCHIHA
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Old 07-09-2012, 06:48 PM   #6
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Re: Tobi's "Moons eye" plan...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Konnaha_yellow_flash View Post
Shisui's age is unconfirmed... but his height difference with itachi suggests he is a fully grown adult or just a giant 14 year old... either way shisui's height matches up with tobi so all we need is his age and to find out where his body is...

And why wouldn't shisui fit the personality disorder??? all tobi did was play a role as a bumbling annoying fool in order to be disarming... its not a personality disorder at all... its called acting... ninja did it for espionage... for assassinations and even for reconnaissance... There is no evidence to suggest whoever tobi really is was doing nothing more then playing a role in order to achieve a goal... just like he did with madara... just like he did as the 4th mizukage as well... perhaps even as shisui himself... maybe tobi infiltrated the uchiha using his double Kotoamatsukami to control the clans mind and make them believe he was always there... who knows....

Either way the so called personality disorder is not a disorder at all... its simple acting and any spy would be capable of doing it... So that doesn't disprove shisui, obito or anyone since acting is not so hard for a ninja when thats what they are trained to do for certain occasions...

Even as an adult, you are suggesting he was in his mid thirties during the conversation with Itachi, which would have made him a high ranking member of the Uchiha clan with his gifts. It just isn't logical.
__________________
1. Naruto's act 1 was really good

2. Part Two started off alright, it introduced new characters and it continued to show the same potential, honestly, the story had a lot of promise up until the Pain Arc.

3. Pain Arc occurs and all Leaf ninja are revived after they were slaughtered, this started the failing of Kishi because he won't kill off main charcters.

4. Kage Summit was a tad disappointing simply because we didn't see any of the charcters that SHOULD have been introduced during the chuunin exams.

5. The War has been epicly disappointing because Kishi is killing off Edo's in a matter of one chapter when each edo (Kages, Swordsman, Nagato and Itachi) when they should get around 4 or 5 chapters of dedication.

Kishi started cutting the story shorter, his chapters have gotten shorter from 21 pages to 17 per week,

Now if you don't like this reasoning, you can simply go to another forum.
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Old 07-10-2012, 12:15 AM   #7
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Re: Tobi's "Moons eye" plan...

If you love the No One tag so much then you must not miss out on listing Uchiha Kagami as one of your possible choices for Tobi.

Cause in the manga he is indeed "no one" apart from being the 2nd hokage student and rather strange for an uchiha who were part of high profile group to just be a nobody unless he is really dead.
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Old 07-10-2012, 12:57 AM   #8
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Re: Tobi's "Moons eye" plan...

Quote:
Originally Posted by krurk View Post
Even as an adult, you are suggesting he was in his mid thirties during the conversation with Itachi, which would have made him a high ranking member of the Uchiha clan with his gifts. It just isn't logical.
Could of been... its not confirmed... IMO shisui was probably about kakashi's age plus one or two more years... close enough...

And yes he was a high ranking member of the uchiha if he truly was a shushin master with special chakra and MS abilities that surpasses all others... Still, no confirmation exactly how shisui fit into the uchiha clan...

Remember the conversation sasuke had with itachi... that because of itachi's comment about sasuke gaining the same eyes as him would make him the third person to have the same eyes... by this sasuke realized itachi was assisted in the killing of the uchiha and that person was the other MS user.... however though, itachi told sasuke that madara was the other MS user...
However, Itachi knew shisui had the MS... that shisui was the only other MS user besides him since not even tobi has ever showed any MS fuuin on his SG despite the jutsu he uses...

and since we found out that madara was dead before nagato grew up (probably a couple years before hte massacre)... along with no other uchiha who possess the MS... who could have been that MS user other then shisui...? Just a random thought considering the topic of three MS users back then....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamabunta View Post
If you love the No One tag so much then you must not miss out on listing Uchiha Kagami as one of your possible choices for Tobi.

Cause in the manga he is indeed "no one" apart from being the 2nd hokage student and rather strange for an uchiha who were part of high profile group to just be a nobody unless he is really dead.
Do what?? There is nothing about kagami other then he is an uchiha... thats not much of a qualification considering tobi could turn out to not even be uchiha, but from some other clan with a transplanted MS eye....
__________________
KNOWLEDGE TO LIVE BY...

No matter how POWERFUL/STRONG you are. If you cannot CATCH your Enemy, all you POWER/STRENGTH is no more USEFUL then a squirt gun....
And if You cannot possibly TRACK/REACT to your enemies attacks to Defend yourself, then how can you possibly stop him from DEFEATING you at WILL...


MINATO "KYF" NAMIKAZE.

People live relying on they're Knowledge and Perception, and thus are bound to them.....
Those Boundaries are what they tend to accept as "Reality".....
However..... Knowledge and Perception are both ambiguous....
so "Reality" could be nothing more....
then an illusion....


ITACHI UCHIHA
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Old 07-10-2012, 02:34 AM   #9
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Re: Tobi's "Moons eye" plan...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Konnaha_yellow_flash View Post
Do what?? There is nothing about kagami other then he is an uchiha... thats not much of a qualification considering tobi could turn out to not even be uchiha, but from some other clan with a transplanted MS eye....
the two least possible choices obito and shisui are uchiha... so you are stepping on your own shit...
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Old 07-10-2012, 05:01 PM   #10
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Re: Tobi's "Moons eye" plan...

This is a really great theory except...Shisui wanted to protect Konoha and had the same ideals as Itachi. Shisui died to give Itachi MS and then Itachi asks him to help in Uchiha Massacre when hes blind?? No.
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