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Old 06-13-2007, 01:03 PM   #1
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Catholicism and Christianity

Personal note:
I was asked to explain how “Catholic Christians” and Catholicism are different from the rest of Christianity, or at least non-denominational Christians. It took me a while, but here it is Miburo. ^_^ I was happy to oblige, sorry it took so long.

I am going to try to explain some of the basic doctrinal differences in these two religions. In the end it may not seem like much to you, but some of the beliefs of the Catholics are a direct contradictory of what the Bible says and what the rest of Christianity teaches.


Catholicism vs. Christianity

Christianity is based primarily on the teachings of Christ and the Bible. In Roman Catholicism they have a different bible, with extra books in it, and 2 other governing pieces of literature; “The Sacred Tradition” and the “Catechism of the Catholic Church.” The Catechism of the Catholic Church was created at the second Vatican, by a host of catholic leaders and the Pope John Paul II. It was created and printed (in French) in 1996 to replace the “Catechism of the Council of Trent,” which was created in 1566. Both were basically a set of guidelines for any one in the Catholic faith.

The Sacred Tradition is said to be from many different sources, but the main one is the oral transmission of stories and words of the apostils of Christ that were not recorded originally.

The Sacred Tradition was spoken of often by early church leaders, especially when referring to “apostolic succession.”


Due to the Catholics gathering more writings and treating them also like Gods laws and teachings, they have many different practices than the rest of Christianity, such as apostolic succession, power of religion leaders and the sacraments. The list may seem short, but there are 7 sacraments and the things that will be discussed are at the very foundation of the Christian religion, and very important.


1st
The apostolic succession is the belief that the Holy Order, or rather, the hierarchy of the Catholic Church leaders, is comprised of the direct successors of the apostles of Jesus Christ. The successor of the apostle Peter is the head of the church; the Pope. The Bishops underneath him are the successors of the other apostles.

Lower yet are the priests, then the deacons. At the bottom is the rest of the Catholic congregation; the lays. (Regular people) these have been listed in order of “holiest” to “least holy”.

In this system each level has different “abilities” and privileges. Also there is a code that you must match in order to move up each level. For example, an ordained men is prohibited from getting married, bishops must be celibate. It is also believe that being ordained configures you into a new person. (Ex: priests are configured to Christ the Head and celebrate divine worship, and “to confect the sacrament of Eucharist, acting “in persona Christi,” that is, in the person of Christ.” –Wikipedia-Sacraments of Sacred Mysteries-The Sacrament of the Holy Order)


Now in “non-denominational Christianity” we believe none of us is more holy or superior to another, we’re all equal in the fact that we each have the Holy Spirit. We do believe that we are blessed with different gifts though, and different places in ministry that we were meant to serve god in, but none are more holy or better than the others.


The bible says: “But to each one is given the manifestation of the Spirit for the common good. For to one is given the word of wisdom through the Spirit, and to another the word of knowledge according to the same Spirit; to another faith by the same Spirit, and to another gifts of healing by the one Spirit, and to another the effecting of miracles, and to another prophecy, and to another the distinguishing of spirits, to another various kinds of tongues, and to another the interpretation of tongues. But one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing to each one individually just as He wills”

-1 Corinthians 12:7-11, the NAS Bible

Also, Catholics believe that only members of the “Hole Order” (Priests, Bishops and the Pope) are aloud to interpret and teach on the scriptures.

“The Catechism of the Catholic Church, 85 states that authentic interpretation of the Word of God is entrusted to the living Magisterial of the Church, namely the Bishops in communion with the successor of Saint Peter. Catholic theology places the authoritative interpretation of Scriptures in the hands of constant judgement of the Church down through the ages, rather than the private judgement of individuals.”

-wikipedia- the roman catholic church- the church (ecclesiology)

But the bible says to every one to be filled with Christ and to teach!

“Let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts, to which indeed you were called in one body; and be thankful. Let the word of Christ richly dwell within you, with all wisdom teaching and admonishing one another with psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with thankfulness in your hearts to God.”

- Col 3:15-16, the NAS Bible

So this means that in Catholicism you can not build your own relationship with god through studying his work and his word, while the complete focus of other Christianity IS to build your own meaningful relationship with Christ.


2nd
The catholic church feels it has been granted the power to decide whether some one is forgiven or not. They feel they have the right to judge. “Only a priest has the power to administer absolution [forgiveness]”
-wikipedia-sacrament or sacred mysteries- Reconciliation of a Penitent (confession)

But God said: “God raised Him up on the third day and granted that He become visible, not to all the people, but to witnesses who were chosen beforehand by God, that is, to us who ate and drank with Him after He arose from the dead. And He ordered us to preach to the people, and solemnly to testify that this is the One who has been appointed by God as Judge of the living and the dead.”

-Acts 10:40-42, the NAS Bible

“Who will bring a charge against God's elect? God is the one who justifies; who is the one who condemns? Christ Jesus is He who died, yes, rather who was raised, who is at the right hand of God, who also intercedes for us.”

-Romans 8: 33-34, the NAS Bible

In those verses they clarify exactly who it is who can judge, and that is the man god raised from the dead after 3 days, that is Jesus. Only Jesus can judge the salvation of the living and the dead.


3rd
Purgatory

In the Catholic religion it is believed that any sins that have not been absolved by a priest will hold you back from heaven. In order to pay for these sins you must suffer through purgatory.

Purgatory acts as a refining furnace, burning away the sins till you are left spotless and righteous. You are made to reside in purgatory long enough to pay for your transgressions. A certain amount f time in Purgatory pays for a certain amount of sins.

Main stream, non-Catholic Christianity believes something very different based on 2 verses:

The first verse has to do with when you get to heaven, is there time for purgatory at all?

“One of the criminals who were hanged there was hurling abuse at Him, saying, "Are You not the Christ? Save Yourself and us!" But the other answered, and rebuking him said, "Do you not even fear God, since you are under the same sentence of condemnation? "And we indeed are suffering justly, for we are receiving what we deserve for our deeds; but this man has done nothing wrong." And he was saying, "Jesus, remember me when You come in Your kingdom!" And He said to him, "Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise."”

-Luke 23:39-43 NAS Bible

This man here was being put to death for his sin, yet Jesus said “Today you will be with Me in heaven.” Jesus told a man who had committed a mortal sin so bad that he was getting capital punishment, but he was able to go straight to heaven. That doesn’t line up with the purgatory theory.

The second verse has to do with the sin aspect of it. In non-denominational Christianity it is believed that Jesus’ Death is a final payment for all our sins. Once you accept Jesus all your past, present, and future sins are forgiven.

“When you were dead in your transgressions and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He made you alive together with Him, having forgiven us all our transgressions”

-Colossians 2:13 NAS Bible

Jesus paid for everything, so we wouldn’t have to.

*Purgatory note 1: all information on purgatory can be found on wikipedia.
*Purgatory note 2: circumcision was a sign of being a Jew. Before Jesus’ death only Jews (Hebrews) were Gods children, or chosen people; only they could get into heaven. After Jesus sacrificed himself anyone could become Gods child and get into heaven.

Last edited by Tabris; 06-13-2007 at 01:08 PM.
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Old 06-13-2007, 01:06 PM   #2
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Re: Catholicism and Christianity

4th
Communion: In the Christian Church, the service which commemorates the meal taken by Christ with His disciples before His crucifixion” - Kernerman English Multilingual Dictionary (Beta Version)

Catholic communion (Eucharist) and transubstantiation are practiced at evening mass. The priest recites a specific prayer while holding up the communion bread (usually a round cracker) and wine.

The Cracker and wine are believed to be transformed by the priest into the living flesh and blood of Jesus Christ, and that in taking communion you are re-sacrificing Jesus for your sins.

The Bible happens to have a verse that plainly states that this is not so, or rather, it should not be so.

“Nor was it that He would offer Himself often, as the high priest enters the holy place year by year with blood that is not his own. Otherwise, He would have needed to suffer often since the foundation of the world; but now once at the consummation of the ages He has been manifested to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself. And inasmuch as it is appointed for men to die once and after this comes judgment, so Christ also, having been offered once to bear the sins of many, will appear a second time for salvation without reference to sin, to those who eagerly await Him.”

- Hebrews 9:25-28 NAS Bible

It is very specifically said that Jesus was to suffer and die once for all of our sins, and not repeatedly.

Now please understand that other Christians do celebrate communion, but we are not sacrificing Christ again. The standard church holds communion once a month and it is but a symbol, a reminder of what Christ did for us; not another means of forgiveness for un-absolved sins, as it is for the Catholics. Communion is a celebration of the fact that we are forever free from sin because of what Jesus did.

*Eucharist (Catholic Communion) note 1: Information on transubstantiation and catholic communion was gathered from the “Catholicism: crisis of Faith” Video study.
*Eucharist (Catholic Communion) note 2: Eucharist is the 3rd Sacrament


5th
Another Sacrament, the first actually, is Catholic Baptism. Most Catholic Baptism is performed soon after birth, because baptism is “’for the remission of sins’ not only personal sins, but also original sin… Expressed positively remission of sin means bestowal of sanctifying grace” –wikipedia- Sacraments or sacred mysteries- baptism (related information: Nicene Creed)

Catholicism leads you to believe that “Original sin” is only paid for by baptism and not just belief and faith in Jesus.

Now I’ve already mentioned Colossians 2:13 in the 8th paragraph of the purgatory section, which shows that Jesus paid for all sins, including original sin from the Garden of Eden.

Also Acts 2:40-42 says:
“And with many other words he solemnly testified and kept on exhorting them, saying, "Be saved from this perverse generation!" So then, those who had received his word were baptized; and that day there were added about three thousand souls. They were continually devoting themselves to the apostles' teaching and to fellowship, to the breaking of bread and to prayer.”

The people in this passage came to belief and then they were baptised, not the other way around, and not in order to earn forgiveness.
In non-Catholic Christianity baptism is a public display, statement and commemoration of the faith and forgiveness you have in God.


6th
Prayer to Mary and other saints/statues.

In Catholicism it is very common to find little statues of saints being sold and in people’s houses. People bow before the likeness of the priest and pray for certain things; a different priest is prayed for in the case of a financial trouble than you would in the case of a lost family member. The saints are believed to be closer to Jesus, so they can mediate between us and God.

There are images and/or statues of Mary in almost every Catholic Church (I haven’t been to all of them, so I can’t say for sure) so that people may pray to her, to ask Jesus, to ask God, for his help and forgiveness.

Often times the prayers are more of a ritual and recitation than a conversation, for instance, The Rosary. “The Rosary combines vocal (or silent) prayer and meditation centered around sequences of reciting the Lord's Prayer followed by ten recitations of the "Hail Mary" prayer and a single recitation of "Glory Be to the Father"; each of these sequences is known as a decade.” –Wikipedia- Rosary. The Hail Mary’s are so numerous so as to incline Mary to talk to her son, Jesus, in order that he mediates between humans and God.

In other branches of Christianity we’re taught that there is only one person who can mediate for us and God, and keep us “clean from sin” in his sight. Jesus is the only one who can do it and the Bible states that plainly.

“For there is one God, and one mediator also between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.”

-1 Timothy 2:5 NAS Bible

“Jesus said to him, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me.””

-John 14:6 NAS Bible

It is plainly stated that Jesus is the only mediator between humans and God, not Mary or the saints, or even the priest (although praying together is encouraged by Jesus).

There is also another problem with the doctrine of praying to the statues and other people besides Jesus and God.

In the Ten Commandments the first and second commandments says, “You shall have no other gods before Me. You shall not make for yourself an idol, or any likeness of what is in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the water under the earth. You shall not worship them or serve them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children, on the third and the fourth generations of those who hate Me, but showing loving kindness to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.” – Exodus 20:3-6 NAS Bible. Praying to a statue, whether it’s against a saint or not, goes directly against these commandments.

In the Catholic bible, which I have already mentioned is different then the average bible, the 2nd commandment is omitted. They do still manage to get 10 commandments in their bible, because they split the tenth commandment into 2.

*Prayer to Mary and other saints/statues note: Information on Prayer to Mary and other saints/statues was gathered from the “Catholicism: crisis of Faith” Video study, as well as at Wikipedia, under the search of “Rosary” and “The Roman Catholic Church.”

7th
This final point I will make is on the matter of the Sacrament of Penance.

“penance: a penalty voluntarily undertaken; a sacramental rite practiced in the Roman, Eastern and some Anglican churches consisting of private confession, absolution and a penance directed by the confessor” –Webster’s New Dictionary and Thesaurus, (Concise Edition)

That is a very simple definition of Penance. During confession the priest will prescribe a certain task or prayers for the confessor to carry out in order to redeem themselves of their transgressions. This is often what the practise of reciting rosaries is for.

One of the most commonly quoted verses in the Christian community is Ephesians 2:8-9, which is quoted below:

“For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.” (NAS Bible)

In this single verse the entire belief of penance and any other “Christian rites of passage” (such as Catholic Baptism, Eucharist and “Last Rites.” is abolished because God says it is simply not the way to get to paradise.


One of the most core beliefs of Christianity is that God’s gift of eternal life and salvation is free, and that we can not earn it. The belief that God saved us, and that we can not work off our sins, is the foundation of Christianity. Due to this fact, it is obvious that Catholicism is governed by a dissimilar set of beliefs, and is a very different religion from common Christianity.




I have only pointed out 7 very fundamental differences between Catholicism and Christianity, but there are many more that I have not mentioned. (Like our perception of and relationship with God for instance)

I hope this has thoroughly and clearly displayed how very different our beliefs are, and that you will no longer be confused about the difference between the common, non-denominational Christian and Catholics.


Note: NAS Bible means New American Standard Bible

-Only 4 of the seven Sacraments were addressed here.


By Tabitha McLelland
June 13, 2007

Last edited by Tabris; 06-13-2007 at 01:12 PM.
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Old 06-13-2007, 01:30 PM   #3
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Re: Catholicism and Christianity

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Old 06-13-2007, 01:45 PM   #4
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Re: Catholicism and Christianity

oh... thank you *blush*
and thanks for moving it :P
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Old 06-13-2007, 04:41 PM   #5
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Re: Catholicism and Christianity

Damn, that's a lot to read. >.<;

Seems to me that there really isn't any major differences in what is believed between the two 'sects'. Most of these seem really, really minor. From my perspective you all believe the same basic thing, you just have different ways in practicing it...more or less.

Even the more major points you listed really aren't that conflicting. For example, I don't see how there being a hierarchy consisting of priests, bishops, cardinals, etc. prevents anyone from forming a personal relationship with God or Jesus, like you suggested.

Even the final point of penance isn't all that major, assuming those who follow your definition of the Christian faith also strive to lead good lives by avoiding sinning whenever possible. If so, both sects believe in Christ and strive to do good; and both will end up in the same place in the end. So even something like this is pretty petty.

And things like 'one believes the wine is actually the blood of christ, and other just sees it as a symbolic thing' are just kinda nit-picky, really. Besides, unless Jesus was a huge cracker filled with wine, the former belief is just kinda silly anyway. ^^;

And the dictionary says that Catholics are a sub-sect of Christianity. >.>

I could be wrong, but it does kinda seem like you're confusing your particular sub-sect of Christianity as the absolute representation of all Christianity. Again, totally possible that I'm wrong on this, but from what I've gathered it's entirely possible for Christains to hold dissimilar beliefs amongst themselves and still all be Christians because they believe that Jesus Christ is the son of the one true God.
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Old 06-14-2007, 02:02 AM   #6
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Re: Catholicism and Christianity

Quote:
Originally Posted by Miburo View Post
Damn, that's a lot to read. >.<;

Seems to me that there really isn't any major differences in what is believed between the two 'sects'. Most of these seem really, really minor. From my perspective you all believe the same basic thing, you just have different ways in practicing it...more or less.

Even the more major points you listed really aren't that conflicting. For example, I don't see how there being a hierarchy consisting of priests, bishops, cardinals, etc. prevents anyone from forming a personal relationship with God or Jesus, like you suggested.
the reason it prevents that thing, is because if you are not of a certain place in the system, as in a bishop or higher, you are not permitted to read the bible by yourself and build a relationship with God. with out this system, if every one was considered equal, they could all read the bible, but because of this crazy system there's no way for the lays (common catholics) to be with God.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Miburo View Post
Even the final point of penance isn't all that major, assuming those who follow your definition of the Christian faith also strive to lead good lives by avoiding sinning whenever possible. If so, both sects believe in Christ and strive to do good; and both will end up in the same place in the end. So even something like this is pretty petty.
the difference, my dear, is that in Christianity you get to heaven ONLY by accepting Gods power in your life, but in Catholicism, you have to accept Gods gift AND pay for it, by working off your own sins. a big part of christianity is depending totally and completely on God to save you, and in Catholisicm you have to depend on yourself instead of God. that's the difference i'm trying to point out there.

Remember, the idea that salvation is free is the foundation that Christianity is built on.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Miburo View Post
And things like 'one believes the wine is actually the blood of christ, and other just sees it as a symbolic thing' are just kinda nit-picky, really. Besides, unless Jesus was a huge cracker filled with wine, the former belief is just kinda silly anyway. ^^;
that section was more about the beleif that they were "re-sacrificing" jesus. they beleived that he was dieing over and over again everytime the recieved the eucharist, and Jesus said that's not the way it is.

also, eating live flesh is pretty creepy...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Miburo View Post
And the dictionary says that Catholics are a sub-sect of Christianity. >.>
but so is jahovahs wittness acording to the dictionary, and it's also WAY different (I for one do not go to peoples door all the time :P, lol just playin, that's not reallly a valid point)

in all technicality people do reffer to Catholics as Christians, but as you might have noticed, in my letter/essay thing i called them "Catholic Christians," because they do believe in christ; "CHRISTians." They just also beleive alot of extra hooey that ultimately devalues Christs God hood.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Miburo View Post
I could be wrong, but it does kinda seem like you're confusing your particular sub-sect of Christianity as the absolute representation of all Christianity. Again, totally possible that I'm wrong on this, but from what I've gathered it's entirely possible for Christains to hold dissimilar beliefs amongst themselves and still all be Christians because they believe that Jesus Christ is the son of the one true God.
it is possible, your right, that's why there are denominations, but in all of the non-Catholic denaminations we always use the Bible to find the answers, and to get close to God. When i talk about Christianity , i'm talking about, excuse the frase please, "real, bible beleiving, walk the wlak Christians," because "real Christians" follow what he Bible says instead of just disregarding it, or making their own rules and rituals.

you see, Catholisicm is a completely different religion, because instead of using the Bible to answer their problems, they make up answers (like purgatory, to cleanse you) and the manipulate the bible (extra books and leaving out verses for instance)

I understood when i wrote this that the differences i listed probably wouldnt' seem like much to anyone who isn't a Christian themselve, and thoroughly understood all the inside aspects of our religion, but i thought i'd try anyways. :P

my point, my main point when ever talking about Christianity and Catholics is that the thing that Christianity is based on that sets it apart from all other religions in the world, is that Salvation is free, and Catholicism doesn't have that as their foundation, hence they are a different religion, because they lack the defining feature of Christianity.
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Old 06-14-2007, 12:25 PM   #7
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Re: Catholicism and Christianity

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tabris View Post
the reason it prevents that thing, is because if you are not of a certain place in the system, as in a bishop or higher, you are not permitted to read the bible by yourself and build a relationship with God. with out this system, if every one was considered equal, they could all read the bible, but because of this crazy system there's no way for the lays (common catholics) to be with God.
Maybe I'm just reading it wrong, but their system doesn't prevent anyone from reading the Bible. They just can't make offically sactioned interpretations of the Bible, only priests, bishops, popes,etc. can do that. In other words, they can't say "According to the Bible, the Church believes blahblahblah...," or they can't speak for the Church. They can still pray, talk to Jesus/God, read the Bible, etc. That's how I took it, anyway.
Quote:
the difference, my dear, is that in Christianity you get to heaven ONLY by accepting Gods power in your life, but in Catholicism, you have to accept Gods gift AND pay for it, by working off your own sins. a big part of christianity is depending totally and completely on God to save you, and in Catholisicm you have to depend on yourself instead of God. that's the difference i'm trying to point out there.
Ah, yeah, I understand that. Just from my perspective it seems like you guys do the same things more or less, you just have slightly different reasons for doing them.

Quote:
my point, my main point when ever talking about Christianity and Catholics is that the thing that Christianity is based on that sets it apart from all other religions in the world, is that Salvation is free, and Catholicism doesn't have that as their foundation, hence they are a different religion, because they lack the defining feature of Christianity.
Not to nitpick, but even your salvation techniquely isn't free. You have to do something for it, even if it doesn't involve a whole lot of effort. So it's like those "Sign up for our shit, and get this free" things you see on TV. It's free...if you sign up. So for someone like me, who doesn't want to sign up, I can't get it.

And don't get me wrong, I acknowledge the differences between the different sects found in Christianity. I'm definitely not saying "Ah, fuck it, it's all the same exact shit" or anything. Just that Christianity is the blanket term that encompasses all the sects, from what I can tell. I just don't understand the dislike of the Catholic sect, honestly.
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Old 06-14-2007, 01:19 PM   #8
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Re: Catholicism and Christianity

oh, i see. i'm just hoping people will specify between Catholic Christians and the rest of Chrsitianity, because our "Way to heaven" is different. Christianity is total dependance on Christ, adn Catholisicm is total dependance on sanctifying yourself... for instance, "Christianity" means people of Christ, or people who beleive in a saviour. now the muslims have a saviour,a nd they beleive in him, so TECHICALLY they are also Christians... acording to the deffinition.
Christ=saviour.
for us it means jesus, for other christ means someone else.

If you don't sign up, then how does the company know you exist? :P It's like not telling anyone what you want for your birthday then yelling at every one and getting pissed cause none of them got you it.

i guess it's not a big deal if you don't understand, to a christian it is a big difference, but to someone looking in, meh, it's not that important i guess.

i just want to make sure people understand that we're nt all the same, and that Catholisicm is actually very different in it's beliefs and practices...

oh ya, and about prayer, all their prayers are recitations, instead of conversations with God, and that's way differentthan non-denominational Christianity.

But w/e, i'm jsut6 happpy i got to write this thing up :P
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Old 06-14-2007, 02:38 PM   #9
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Re: Catholicism and Christianity

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tabris View Post
oh, i see. i'm just hoping people will specify between Catholic Christians and the rest of Chrsitianity, because our "Way to heaven" is different. Christianity is total dependance on Christ, adn Catholisicm is total dependance on sanctifying yourself... for instance, "Christianity" means people of Christ, or people who beleive in a saviour. now the muslims have a saviour,a nd they beleive in him, so TECHICALLY they are also Christians... acording to the deffinition.
Christ=saviour.
for us it means jesus, for other christ means someone else.
I'm fairly certain that by 'Christ' they're referring to Jesus of Nazarath specificially.

Quote:
If you don't sign up, then how does the company know you exist? :P It's like not telling anyone what you want for your birthday then yelling at every one and getting pissed cause none of them got you it.
Heh, well if the company or your birthday guests are supposed to be all-knowing, all-seeing beings it kinda changes things up a bit. ; )

And not to take sides, but I'd root for the Catholic belief that you presented over yours to be true. At least that way I'm possibly not totally screwed. XD
Quote:

i guess it's not a big deal if you don't understand, to a christian it is a big difference, but to someone looking in, meh, it's not that important i guess.

i just want to make sure people understand that we're nt all the same, and that Catholisicm is actually very different in it's beliefs and practices...
Don't get me wrong, I understand that this stuff is important to some people. I'm not completely apathetic or anything. I totally get what you're saying.
Quote:
oh ya, and about prayer, all their prayers are recitations, instead of conversations with God, and that's way differentthan non-denominational Christianity.
I know Hail Marys and Our Fathers are like that, but that doesn't necessarly mean that they don't pray on a more personal level in addition to these types of prayers...does it? I doubt there's some type of rule that doesn't permit chit-chatting with God or whatever.

I'm not getting what you mean by "Non-denominational Christians" though. Are you referring to Christianity in general here? Or is there a specific sect of Christianity called "Non-denominational?" If it's the former than I don't understand. Because each sect has different beliefs, but they're all still Christians. If it's the latter, that I guess that makes more sense, still kind of a weird name to give yourselves though. ^^;

What I'm saying is that you can't be referring to Christianity in general, since Roman Catholics would fall under that term and they have different beliefs as you clearly have shown. For them to fall under the term 'Christian' they'd have to adhere to the definition of Christianity, afterall.

So you must be talking about a specific sect within Christianity for your argument to make sense. Since different sects don't have to have all the same beliefs. I'm just wondering what specific sect you're actually referring too, that's all.

Last edited by Miburo; 06-14-2007 at 02:39 PM.
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