The Genius FC - Page 82

UchihaTaijiya · 01-20-2008, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shrike

You are right there about Jiraiya.
But I didn't like him being a sensei of AL. I wanted AL to be someone whose hype cannot be shaken that easily, showing him young and vulnerable. Madara is more that material - a guy who is ridiculously old, but isn't really aging. That is what type of AL I wanted.

Yet, even Madara's hype is shaken. Shodai defeated him, and him being part of the Uchiha clan is strait bad for me.
I didn't need more than 2 Uchihas in the story.

If I see AL saying:"If you had known my secret, you would have pwned me, Sensei."
I wanted warlord AL who would respect his opponent, but crush him without holding back, or having a god complex one moment and the other saying he would have died.

Now, I don't see anyone qualified enough to be a good main villain. Actually, I don't see any of these Akatsuki guys as much of a threat anymore. You can just gangband on them, and they are dead.

Eh, I liked seeing Nagato young and vulnerable. Just as I liked seeing Orochimaru contemplating at the grave site of his parents. It gives the villian another dimension... same with Sasori's fatal pause and Deidara's obsession with his art.

I like Madara. xD I know you can't agree, but I like how the main villian ties into the origins of Konoha... because even though he is an Uchiha, the Uchihas were Konoha's Police Force... so while the focus is half Uchiha, it is also half Konoha. Then you have Pein's vision of changing the world through unimaginable pain and suffering... So now the story's focus encompasses the entire world and the origins of Konoha and the Kyuubi (so it encompasses the past as well). Both Naruto and Sasuke are vital, and looking back, Kishimoto foreshadowed this with the VotE.

Madara being defeated by Shodaime doesn't bother me. If you look at Orochimaru, while he did stir up a lot of shit and take out a couple Kages, he never really won. So I do not mind that. Actually, I like it better than, say how Itachi was presented for such a long time, the guy that immobilize anyone just by looking at them. <.<

So I do think Madara is qualified as the ultimate villian. He makes it personal for both Naruto and Sasuke... (Kyuubi and Uchiha Massacre). I just want to see more of him. xD

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shrike

Madara ruined Pain and Itachi.
Both of those characters had endless possibilities of being crazy original characters. Both of them look funny now.

Pain, because of the reasons I already said.

Itachi for being mysterious for 380 chapters, and then be revealed as a henchmen is making me lol IRL. Seriously.
I didn't know Kishimoto enjoyed ruining his characters.

After the third party being involved in the whole brothers business, Itachi vs Sasuke is an empty battle. Itachi has no purpose, he is empty. A hollow. Dead thing.

Being as such, I dropped the manga for a while. I will maybe get interested later again. But for now, I absolutely have no interest in how Itachi vs Sasuke will end.

Itachi still has a purpose. He tried to destroy his brother's life. <.< Even though he may no longer have that universal impact that Madara does, it's highly personal between him and Sasuke. And for that, I am still totally interested in their match.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shrike

Malleable?
Yes, but! He is still the "destined child". Why couldn't he remain a dropout who will be the best with hard work?

Answer:Because every epic story has some kind of prophecy.
Question:But why does Naruto had to be unoriginal when it had a huge chance not to be so?
Answer:....

I believed in Naruto. I was so happy when he won against Neji. I was so happy when Neji changed himself. I was watching the anime with a smile on my face while Naruto changed people (which you don't find realistic, but I do like it because Kishimoto wrote it perfectly).

After I read about the Destined Child, I frowned. So much for that.

I love the scenes with Naruto empathizing and influencing his 'enemies'. But yes, I think realistically, it would take far more than that. xD (Team 07 and Hinata are the ones I find most realistic, because it took all of Part I for Sakura to see the real Naruto, Sasuke is still following his own path, Kakashi came to see Naruto's strength through observation/critical situations, and Hinata admired his characteristics but is still struggling with changing herself). Such things are, in the real world, processes that take time, and sometimes, take an entire life...

Though I was definitely able to accept Neji and Gaara's growth, because of the scroll Neji recieved from his father, and seeing how Gaara only wanted love and is also a jinchuuriki, so he and Naruto have that vital understanding.

I suppose having Naruto as the destined child, and Jiraiya as the mentor of both Pein and Naruto, it makes Pein personal to Naruto... Pein fights with multiple bodies, Naruto's signature move is the kage bushin... I think Pein is suited for Naruto... he sees himself as a God, as someone who has the authority to decide the fate of the world... Naruto would spit on that in a heart beat. And growth through ultimate suffering? Naruto knows all to well that pain and loneliness only lead to darkness, not salvation.

But I would like to have more focus on Pein, so I can become more attached to his character, and not just his influence in the story. (Kinda like how I viewed Itachi, though Itachi's words are more interesting than Pein's, definitely).

But I do see where you're coming from, I really do. Just try to make the best of what's been revealed... don't quit the story! >.<

Shrike · 01-20-2008, 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UchihaTaijiya

Eh, I liked seeing Nagato young and vulnerable. Just as I liked seeing Orochimaru contemplating at the grave site of his parents. It gives the villian another dimension... same with Sasori's fatal pause and Deidara's obsession with his art.

I totally see what are you trying to say.
I would agree if the morals of this story weren't shaken already.

But even so, I wanted AL to be different material. I wanted him to be someone who in the start won't show any openings. Such a character would actually pose a threat. It would give us the "Wtf, how do you kill this guy?" reaction. That is what I wanted from AL and BH.
Not only that, but as you would try finding his weak spots you would stumble upon some of his connections with the story the way you never expected.
It could have been done. We all know what was going to happen after Jiraiya said he is going to the Rain Village.

Quote:

Originally Posted by UchihaTaijiya

I like Madara. xD I know you can't agree, but I like how the main villian ties into the origins of Konoha... because even though he is an Uchiha, the Uchihas were Konoha's Police Force... so while the focus is half Uchiha, it is also half Konoha. Then you have Pein's vision of changing the world through unimaginable pain and suffering... So now the story's focus encompasses the entire world and the origins of Konoha and the Kyuubi (so it encompasses the past as well). Both Naruto and Sasuke are vital, and looking back, Kishimoto foreshadowed this with the VotE.

Indeed, but the only problem with that is that we weren't given anything about it back in Part I.
So, if I focused on Sasuke and Itachi (which I somewhat did), I cannot enjoy that anymore. The theme of an avenger and a murderer is dispelled with adding of one character. Makes them both empty.

I am more dissatisfied with Itachi's development, of course.
But the whole overhyping Sharingan in Part II made me weary of Uchihas. I wanted it to end with MS, but there seems to be a way to control Kyuubi with it...

I wanted something new. You can connect anything with Konoha. Not only Uchihas.

Quote:

Originally Posted by UchihaTaijiya

Madara being defeated by Shodaime doesn't bother me. If you look at Orochimaru, while he did stir up a lot of shit and take out a couple Kages, he never really won. So I do not mind that. Actually, I like it better than, say how Itachi was presented for such a long time, the guy that immobilize anyone just by looking at them. <.<

Yeah, that's true.
Still, as I said above, I didn't like that. Still, Madara type of AL is much better than Pain ( if only he wasn't an Uchiha...)

Quote:

Originally Posted by UchihaTaijiya

So I do think Madara is qualified as the ultimate villian. He makes it personal for both Naruto and Sasuke... (Kyuubi and Uchiha Massacre). I just want to see more of him. xD

I am sure Madara is the final villain. If Zetsu doesn't take over somehow =D

Quote:

Originally Posted by UchihaTaijiya

Itachi still has a purpose. He tried to destroy his brother's life. <.< Even though he may no longer have that universal impact that Madara does, it's highly personal between him and Sasuke. And for that, I am still totally interested in their match.

For such a huge Itachi fan as I was, he is as good as dead.
A guy who has been shrouded in mystery for 381 chapters. I expected something major to his reason behind the massacre, and everything he has done. Not killing Orochimaru. Joining Akatsuki. Being Sasuke's goal.
He is now not the same character. He is not the one who he was until now.

It is true that Itachi/Sasuke battle is still personal, but we know nothing bad can happen to Sasuke. We know Sasuke has a new person to go after, Itachi is completely expandable.
That is why I hold no interest in this fight anymore.

Quote:

Originally Posted by UchihaTaijiya

I love the scenes with Naruto empathizing and influencing his 'enemies'. But yes, I think realistically, it would take far more than that. xD (Team 07 and Hinata are the ones I find most realistic, because it took all of Part I for Sakura to see the real Naruto, Sasuke is still following his own path, Kakashi came to see Naruto's strength through observation/critical situations, and Hinata admired his characteristics but is still struggling with changing herself). Such things are, in the real world, processes that take time, and sometimes, take an entire life...

Though I was definitely able to accept Neji and Gaara's growth, because of the scroll Neji recieved from his father, and seeing how Gaara only wanted love and is also a jinchuuriki, so he and Naruto have that vital understanding.

I suppose having Naruto as the destined child, and Jiraiya as the mentor of both Pein and Naruto, it makes Pein personal to Naruto... Pein fights with multiple bodies, Naruto's signature move is the kage bushin... I think Pein is suited for Naruto... he sees himself as a God, as someone who has the authority to decide the fate of the world... Naruto would spit on that in a heart beat. And growth through ultimate suffering? Naruto knows all to well that pain and loneliness only lead to darkness, not salvation.

Awesome points.
I need not add anything, you said it better than I could ever have.

The only thing I still don't like is Pain. He could have called himself Pain for other reason. This way, he is ridiculous to most of us Akatsuki fans.

Kakuzu showed much less emotion. And being a bad guy is all about being cold. Thus, so far Kakuzu>Pain.

Quote:

Originally Posted by UchihaTaijiya

But I would like to have more focus on Pein, so I can become more attached to his character, and not just his influence in the story. (Kinda like how I viewed Itachi, though Itachi's words are more interesting than Pein's, definitely).

I would like to see the real truth about him, but that is all.
I know he will fall for KB feint and a FRS like Kakuzu did.

Quote:

Originally Posted by UchihaTaijiya

But I do see where you're coming from, I really do. Just try to make the best of what's been revealed... don't quit the story! >.<

I quited for some time. I just don't want to spend every day checking spoilers and stuff.
I will come back to the manga later. When I hope some things will repair.

Jagen-san · 01-21-2008, 03:36 PM

Ok, so who do ya'll think is the smartest ninja strategy-wise?

MikeyM1979 · 01-21-2008, 06:54 PM

Hm. I'd say Shikamaru, then Kakashi, and (don't laugh) Naruto/Sasuke.

Shrike · 01-21-2008, 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jagen-san

Ok, so who do ya'll think is the smartest ninja strategy-wise?

Shikamaru.
Kakashi.

Obvious answers tbh.

Deidara had a potential to be one of better strategists, until Kishimoto implemented his hate for Uchihas. And in this manga, if you hate Uchihas, you are doomed to fail.

I'MNOTCRAZY · 01-21-2008, 07:35 PM

Shikamaru, Kakashi.... Sasuke... Temari... Shino... Naruto, Sakura... yeah...

MikeyM1979 · 01-22-2008, 12:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shrike

Shikamaru.
Kakashi.

Obvious answers tbh.

Deidara had a potential to be one of better strategists, until Kishimoto implemented his hate for Uchihas. And in this manga, if you hate Uchihas, you are doomed to fail.

Hm. Actually, I too would have to agree with Deidara. Though, he was blinded by his jealousy of Sasuke during his fight, his fight against Gaara was priceless.

Quote:

Originally Posted by I'MNOTCRAZY

Shikamaru, Kakashi.... Sasuke... Temari... Shino... Naruto, Sakura... yeah...

Temari? Hm. From her fight with Shikamaru?

Harrada · 01-22-2008, 01:26 AM

Hey guys can I join?

MikeyM1979 · 01-22-2008, 01:29 AM

Who's your favorite genius on the list?

Harrada · 01-22-2008, 01:32 AM

Shikamaru Nara

MikeyM1979 · 01-22-2008, 01:35 AM

Meh! Too many people like Shikamaru! >.> /added

Harrada · 01-22-2008, 01:38 AM

Thank you and I know why everybody likes him ... he rocks!

Shrike · 01-22-2008, 06:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeyM1979

Hm. Actually, I too would have to agree with Deidara. Though, he was blinded by his jealousy of Sasuke during his fight, his fight against Gaara was priceless.

Indeed, Deidara was very good in that battle vs Gaara.

Still, there are a few more good strategists - Shino seems to be good.
I am yet to see him fight again, but so far he was pretty good.

Neji isn't half-bad either. His fight with an opponent who was his natural enemy, a ranged attacked Kidomaru, was awesome.

That Dosu guy from the Sound Team during the Chuunin exams who served as a fodder to hype Gaara wasn't bad either. His usage of sound was very tactical.

UchihaTaijiya · 01-22-2008, 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shrike

I totally see what are you trying to say.
I would agree if the morals of this story weren't shaken already.

But even so, I wanted AL to be different material. I wanted him to be someone who in the start won't show any openings. Such a character would actually pose a threat. It would give us the "Wtf, how do you kill this guy?" reaction. That is what I wanted from AL and BH.
Not only that, but as you would try finding his weak spots you would stumble upon some of his connections with the story the way you never expected.
It could have been done. We all know what was going to happen after Jiraiya said he is going to the Rain Village.

I understand, but I suppose Madara is intended to be the villain that stirs such a reaction... someone Itachi idolizes, was there at the founding of Konoha, could control Kyuubi 'like a pet', gives orders to Pein, etc.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shrike

Indeed, but the only problem with that is that we weren't given anything about it back in Part I.
So, if I focused on Sasuke and Itachi (which I somewhat did), I cannot enjoy that anymore. The theme of an avenger and a murderer is dispelled with adding of one character. Makes them both empty.

I am more dissatisfied with Itachi's development, of course.
But the whole overhyping Sharingan in Part II made me weary of Uchihas. I wanted it to end with MS, but there seems to be a way to control Kyuubi with it...

I wanted something new. You can connect anything with Konoha. Not only Uchihas.

It's true that there are other ways Kishi could have connected the main villain to Konoha, other than through the Uchihas. But this is the focus, Konoha, Kyuubi, and Uchiha. =/ I think it is a bit too late for Kishi to expand into another aspect entirely... he's already having trouble giving his characters justice, it would be a terrible shame if he failed the story as well, with just having too much to cover... at least right now, there is still a chance for him to tie everything up decently or even surprisingly well.

But it was hinted at in Part I with the revelation of a secret concerning the Uchihas. We've known about that since the Invasion Arc. I mean, I always knew the Uchiha clan would have a major role in the story... and honestly I like that. xD Holds a lot of interest for me...

I can see where your coming from with Itachi's role of murderer becoming less vital/empty, but I don't think it detracts from Sasuke's role of avenger. It actually widens his role as one and prolongs it. And now, his role will take him to the very origins of the clan, Konoha, and perhaps Kyuubi.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shrike

For such a huge Itachi fan as I was, he is as good as dead.
A guy who has been shrouded in mystery for 381 chapters. I expected something major to his reason behind the massacre, and everything he has done. Not killing Orochimaru. Joining Akatsuki. Being Sasuke's goal.
He is now not the same character. He is not the one who he was until now.

It is true that Itachi/Sasuke battle is still personal, but we know nothing bad can happen to Sasuke. We know Sasuke has a new person to go after, Itachi is completely expandable.
That is why I hold no interest in this fight anymore.

Sasuke could still fail in defeating Itachi, because of his own mind-set and use of CS. But you are right, Sasuke's role is much more secure than Itachi's as of now. (of course, it always was... from my pov)

But yes, atm I sort of regret rating Itachi a 7 in the character threads. He got two points from me for expectation/mystery.. and now that he has started to reveal his stance/intentions, I find my interest/expectation rising for Madara and falling for Itachi... so yeah, I completely understand why this bothers you. =/

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shrike

Awesome points.
I need not add anything, you said it better than I could ever have.

The only thing I still don't like is Pain. He could have called himself Pain for other reason. This way, he is ridiculous to most of us Akatsuki fans.

Kakuzu showed much less emotion. And being a bad guy is all about being cold. Thus, so far Kakuzu>Pain.

Why thank ya xD

lol. I never had much interest in Kakuzu, but his dynamic with Hidan was more interesting than Pein's with Konan (so far), so yeah. xD lol

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shrike

I quited for some time. I just don't want to spend every day checking spoilers and stuff.
I will come back to the manga later. When I hope some things will repair.

Ah, well it is your choice, of course. =/
T_T

MikeyM1979 · 01-22-2008, 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shrike

Indeed, Deidara was very good in that battle vs Gaara.

Do you also agree with me that Deidara would have won that fight, even if Gaara didn't choose to protect his village?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shrike

Still, there are a few more good strategists - Shino seems to be good.
I am yet to see him fight again, but so far he was pretty good.

Shino....I take it you mean his fight against Kankuro?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shrike

Neji isn't half-bad either. His fight with an opponent who was his natural enemy, a ranged attacked Kidomaru, was awesome.

I loved that fight!

Even if Neji nearly died. He's very analytical.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shrike

That Dosu guy from the Sound Team during the Chuunin exams who served as a fodder to hype Gaara wasn't bad either. His usage of sound was very tactical.

Would that be the Sound dude who looked like he had a hunched back, and a semi-covered face, with that forearm sound device? If so, I was never impressed with him. Ninjas shouldn't rely solely on devices like that.

01-21-2008, 06:54 PM	#1219
MikeyM1979 Hokage Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: New York Age: 33 Posts: 6,907 Thanks: 15 Thanked 604 Times in 577 Posts	Re: The Genius FC Hm. I'd say Shikamaru, then Kakashi, and (don't laugh) Naruto/Sasuke. __________________ Mikey's deviantART Owner of the Naruto Debating FC Member of the Akatsuki FC Proud co-owner of the Dragonball FC Proud owner of the Genius FC

01-21-2008, 07:35 PM	#1221
I'MNOTCRAZY ANBU Join Date: May 2007 Location: MD Age: 21 Posts: 1,993 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	Re: The Genius FC Shikamaru, Kakashi.... Sasuke... Temari... Shino... Naruto, Sakura... yeah... __________________ want to see what FC's I'm in? click V you have a lot of these to go nope not here either you have a couple more more like 20 jk. here they are: Co-Owner: Naruto RPG FC Hagane Mukuge awesome RPing posts: 1. http://forums.narutocentral.com/show...&postcount=656 2. http://forums.narutocentral.com/show...&postcount=675 3. http://forums.narutocentral.com/show...&postcount=773 Member:NaruHina FC Super Smash Bros. FC The Genius FC Avatar: The Last Airbender FC

01-22-2008, 01:26 AM	#1223
Harrada Jounin Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Konohagakure Posts: 934 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: The Genius FC Hey guys can I join? __________________ Owner of: People live their lives bound by what they accept as correct and true. That's how they define reality. But what does it mean to be "correct" or "true?" merely vague concepts... their "reality" may all be a mirage. Can we consider Them to simply be living in their own world, shapes by beliefs? The warrior protects and defends because he realizes the value of others. He knows that they are essential to society and, in his gift of service, recognizes and values theirs... When faced with a woman or child in a situation in which they are vulnerable, there are two types of people: those who would offer succor and aid, and those who would prey upon them.

01-22-2008, 01:29 AM	#1224
MikeyM1979 Hokage Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: New York Age: 33 Posts: 6,907 Thanks: 15 Thanked 604 Times in 577 Posts	Re: The Genius FC Who's your favorite genius on the list? __________________ Mikey's deviantART Owner of the Naruto Debating FC Member of the Akatsuki FC Proud co-owner of the Dragonball FC Proud owner of the Genius FC

01-22-2008, 01:32 AM	#1225
Harrada Jounin Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Konohagakure Posts: 934 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: The Genius FC Shikamaru Nara __________________ Owner of: People live their lives bound by what they accept as correct and true. That's how they define reality. But what does it mean to be "correct" or "true?" merely vague concepts... their "reality" may all be a mirage. Can we consider Them to simply be living in their own world, shapes by beliefs? The warrior protects and defends because he realizes the value of others. He knows that they are essential to society and, in his gift of service, recognizes and values theirs... When faced with a woman or child in a situation in which they are vulnerable, there are two types of people: those who would offer succor and aid, and those who would prey upon them.

01-22-2008, 01:35 AM	#1226
MikeyM1979 Hokage Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: New York Age: 33 Posts: 6,907 Thanks: 15 Thanked 604 Times in 577 Posts	Re: The Genius FC Meh! Too many people like Shikamaru! >.> /added __________________ Mikey's deviantART Owner of the Naruto Debating FC Member of the Akatsuki FC Proud co-owner of the Dragonball FC Proud owner of the Genius FC

01-22-2008, 01:38 AM	#1227
Harrada Jounin Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Konohagakure Posts: 934 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: The Genius FC Thank you and I know why everybody likes him ... he rocks! __________________ Owner of: People live their lives bound by what they accept as correct and true. That's how they define reality. But what does it mean to be "correct" or "true?" merely vague concepts... their "reality" may all be a mirage. Can we consider Them to simply be living in their own world, shapes by beliefs? The warrior protects and defends because he realizes the value of others. He knows that they are essential to society and, in his gift of service, recognizes and values theirs... When faced with a woman or child in a situation in which they are vulnerable, there are two types of people: those who would offer succor and aid, and those who would prey upon them.

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