Trey

First off, this doesn't have to apply to strictly the Rasengan, it can dabble into all the other countless jutsus in the Narutoverse, I'm just using the Rasengan as an example.

Let's be clear of what the "incomplete" Rasengan is: just a swirling mass of chakra that is kept intact by the user. It's as potent as the user's chakra control and the amount of chakra poured into it.

Now, the so called "complete" version of the Rasengan is the previous one, just with a nature manipulation added to it. So, in essence, there are 5 different Rasengans: Earth, Wind, Lightning, Fire, and Water. Therefore, does the damage the Rasengan unleash differ between the elements? It is a possibility.

Now, imagine what would happen if a person unlocked the Gates, then did Rasengan. How far would the power spike? Would it raise at all? So, if someone unlocked the final Gate which granted them peerless strength, how much damage would the Rasengan do? Would it become a whole new jutsu?

Now, what if Naruto mastered a second element, and could wield two differntly elemented Rasengans at one time? And he somehow combined them, and formed a new element like Yamato's Wood? What would Naruto's power be like then?

And, what would hand seals contribute, if at all? My figuring behind it is that hand seals redirect chakra, defining them in the process. Would the strength of the Rasengan be raised, or will hand seals help nothing in the ultimate power of the Rasengan.

So, in retrospect, figure: unlocked gates --> hand seals --> nature manipulation --> superb chakra control --> dual elemented Rasengans --> combined into a massive double elemented Rasengan = colossal chakra torrent of death Rasengan (Kyuubi has been omitted for variable reasons).

So, how far can the Rasengan really go? Figuring all the enhancers in the Narutoverse, I think it to be strange that nature manipulation is the peak of the Rasengan's power.

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MikeyM1979

Hm. Well, we know the wind rasengan is ubor powerful. The earth rasengan I think would be useless, the lightning one....would probably be like Sasuke's Chidori Nagashi, a spread out electric move. I can't see Naruto's rasengan piercing something. A fire rasengan I guess would be good for melting huge glaciers, and a water rasengan would be pretty cool. It'd probably not do THAT much damage, but it'd sure as hell toss an enemy far away.

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dfacto

Most likely Naruto's is the strongest possible. It's already been said that wind is the strongest close combat element because of it's cutting power, and since the Rasen-shuriken is a close combat jutsu it makes sense that Naruto's wind version would be better than any others.

It might make it super-powerful, but more likely it would simply not be conducive to mental focus (I believe one of the gates was called insanity gate?), making the bunshin/concentration part impossible for the user and the rasengan an impossibility. My gut feeling on the final gates is basically berserk power that raises the user's taijutsu through the roof for a short time, but kills them by burning the body from the inside out.

He couldn't wield two at once. He needs to concentrate on one hand to get a rasengan, and he needs two clones to mix in the wind chakra. I think at most he could have another clone to mix in the other element. If he mixed in fire then it would really boost the power of his jutus.

Probably useless.

Why? It's already been shown that Kyuubi's chakra can be used to make a powerful rasengan (valley of the end), so I'm sure it could be a big boost to the rasen shuriken.

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Nexus

Trey, in that case, maybe you should've changed the title to "How far can a jutsu go?" (Just my opinion, that's all...)

I somewhat agree with this statement. There's no complete version of the Rasengan, and with the way that things are going in the manga, it might not be for a very long time. To answer your question, I would say that the natures does change the effect of the Rasengan as the fire's purpose is to singe, wind is to cut, water is to drown, earth is to smother and lightning is to numb or pierce through the opponent. Imo, it's a possibility, but the other natures just doesn't seem appropriate combined with the Rasengan.

Unfortunately, we, and the user of the gates, wouldn't be able to realize that because they'll be dead after breaking the final gate. If that doesn't kill you, then the damage from the juiced up Rasengan may either leave you armless or severely fatigued.

In that case, Naruto will indeed reach a new plateau of brokenness because not only would he have unlimited plot protection and the Kyuubi to back him up, but also a bloodline limit = Naruto (the super Jesus of Shinobi).

Hand seal wouldn't work or be effective in improving the Rasengan because all the jutsu is chakra being spun into a sphere (that's it).

Don't you mean super Jesusness?

The Rasengan can go as far as Naruto takes it (which, imo, won't be that much further as an improved Rasengan won't be enough as he'll need more).

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Shrike

It can get atomically powerful, if you calculate all those >.>

BUT!

It doesn't need more power.
Naruto should have learned new jutsus instead of developing Rasenshuriken. Why? Because Rasengan was already one-shotting jutsu, like Chidori.
Getting new versions of Rasengan is just silly. Oodama Rasnegan as well. Bleh. I mean, common, a jutsu which requires you touch your target. That basically means you have to be faster than your target.
Okay, learning Rasengan was cool for Naruto, but he should have concentrated his training elsewhere. Learning new versions of Rasengan is just waste of training, if you ask me...

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Nexus

So, would you say that, right now, Yamato, Kakashi and Naruto should abandon the idea of completing the jutsu at this period in time?

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Shrike

Of course not. They should not have trained him to implement Wind into Rasengan as soon as he found out his elemental affinity. He should have learned some wind techniques first. And Jiraiya should have trained him a technique or two beside learning him to use Rasnegan which requires a clone to hit the target.

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dfacto

I think Rasenshuriken is rather overblown as well. While powerful, Naruto would really benefit from more wind training. Imagine him fighting Kakuza with the ability to cut things with his chakra (like he did with the waterfall). He could have used clones to cut all of kakuza's black vein things and give naruto a clear shot with a rasengan, or let him get close enough to slice Kakuza in two with blades like Asumas. Or Naruto could learn a cutting wind jutsu like Temari's, or something like that to act as backup to his close combat abilities.

Rasengan is being worked on because it's Naruto's signature jutsu and the manga goes about combat in rather simplistic manner (A number of fights aside). In reality he would really need to learn a lot more jutsus, and Jiraiya would have taught him wind manipulation a lot earlier, probably along with fire or water manipulation as well.

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Trey

I'm not talking about present Naruto; I shouldn't have personalized the Rasengan's user. I'm talking about a user adept enough to concentrate on two Rasengans.

Because, only one person that does the Rasengan has the Kyuubi. Hence the reason I omitted Kyuubi.

The person unlocking the final gate lives long enough to fight that particular battle.


Controlling two elements isn't a bloodline limit, since Yamato, Kakashi and apparently all the Jounins mastered two elements.

They use hand seals to channel chakra into their feet, what's the difference?

Well, Fyuuton RasenShuriken obliterates the target, regular Rasengan isn't anywhere near as powerul. Rasengan hardly kills as it is.

dfacto

Might not be possible, but that's up in the air.


Mixing them is though. So mixing wind+something else works, but actually combining them to create a new element and then infusing the rasengan with that would require a bloodline limit.



That's just theatrics though. When they fight on water they just do it automatically.

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Trey

The only thing Yamato has is the 1st's Wood abilities, I doubt the 1st had a Bloodline limit. If he does, link me to the proof.

That's stupid then, the hand seals must augment their channeling prowess.

dfacto

Go read the wind training chapters. Kakashi says that combining two elements to create a third is a bloodline limit. Yamato mixes water and earth to create wood, and that is the first's bloodline limit.

Consider it a concentration aid rather than a seal then. Honestly there are much dumber things in Naruto. :P

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HinataFanX

Yeah, like Ino. XD

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Trey

Add more to that, the mods'll infract you for spamming.