Beikoku Rikujin

Of course religion is subject to the laws of physics. EVERYTHING is subject to the laws of physics.

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RNB

And where is your proof for that? My gosh I can't find any. I wish you luck in your life-long quest.

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"Nature loves to be hidden."

- Heraclitus

knife man

how do plagues start? the city's conditions are shit, as they were in ancient Egypt, in fact all of the civilized world. Plagues seriously start as one guy from somewhere else that came in and people didn't have immunities. So just for an example, a trader from Asia comes over on a caravan. the trader isn't well, but well enough to make it to Cairo and die. the Egyptians who had to take care of the body contracted the disease and spread it to their families, who spread it to everyone else through numerous ways. it's exponential how stuff like that spreads, not a work of god.

ps. wonderful spelling and grammar, but who am i to talk, I'm not perfect either.

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props to Lonely Ninja

Tookaipai

Omfg are you kidding me?
way to back up your opinion
*thumbs up*
//sarcasm//

@BR- God can be neither proved nor disproved, no matter what you say, the church will always find a way to turn it around, it is a pointless battle.
Also, Religion should not be put under the laws of physics, just as science should not be put under religion...

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Literary Mary

Freshgrease

I'm not going to argue for or against the existence of God, but I want to give another view on it. Here are some notes from my Philosophy 281 class at Texas A&M University. Please forgive grammatical errors as my notes are unedited and taken from a professor that didn't give notes (it was a discussion class.)

Essentially, it is about the philosophers Thomas Aquinas and Pailey. It's in the form of an outline.

Attached Files

The Existence and Nature of God.zip (30.9 KB, 29 views)

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Shoot To Death

That's were you are wrong i don't believe in everything but a lot of the stuff i do. The plaques were hitting egypt when the jew were enslaved yes moses asked for them to be set free and the paroah said no that's when they started to take place.

How about when the romans attacked the temple of Israel they stole the menorah which is what the jews used back then to light the candles on hanukah.

That exists right the roman's have it and it's guarded by ppl,how do you explain that every night you go to sleep and wake up is that evolution to or is there some wacky theory as well because i haven't heard of any yet what makes yu wake up in the morning you obviously don't have an alram in your body that says wake up.

How do you wake up alive,how do people die in their sleep why doesn't it happen to all of us don't tell me about old ppl because something is keeping you alive not science but god.

@the person who said something about the plaques not you ln:dude explain to me how there were frogs all over the place explain to me how there was darkness that paralyzed you explain hw all water turned to blood explain how all the first born's of the egyption people died the day of passover science didn't do that and it sure as hell wasn't a coincidence,explain how the sea was split in 2 parts.

knife man

show me the proof of these instances and i will give a reason. Sadly, the Bible doesn't count as proof.
I personally like on of the more recent views from a game i just beat. What if there was a piece of something that had some power from god? Say this piece could control the minds of every person that the wielder wanted to control. So the wielder decides to make these people see occurances, like the ones you pointed out, in order to back up his religion. So in that sense, water didn't turn to wine, the blind man wasn't made to see; it was all but illusions. Because as Redneckboy pointed out, reality is what your mind makes of what it takes in.

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props to Lonely Ninja

Shoot To Death

even now with you having said that which means let's say they were illusion's like you say or might have been who made them science you see you try to counter the post but you keep giving more proof that god exists.

LonelyNinja

But you have your own beliefs. That was the point I was trying to get across to you. Also, plagues have happened throughout history, not because of a single event. The slums in cities are a breeding ground for disease, so when the slums get sick, then it spreads as the sick people move around town and it gets everywhere. That's how and why the Black Death was so devastating.

I learned something in English class about persuasive essay. There are persuasion techniques called "spin" and "slant." Basically, the authors highlight the desired information to give to the public. Also, my point with saying that authors of religions texts were half-assers because you were saying that scientists who came up with theories (like Big Bang, natural selection, etc.) were half-assers themselves, however I gave actual reasons as to why I think what I think (which is not what I necessarily think, but it was to prove a point).

Uh, what are you trying to say? Evolution isn't something that wakes me up or makes me go to sleep. Evolution is when a species adapts to a changing ecosystem. Also, when an organism is born, it's not going to evolve over the span of its lifetime. It will carry on traits to be passed on to its offspring, like, say, an immunity to a certain pathogen that kills off those who do not carry the gene. Now the offspring will survive while the rest die off, and they can continue the immune species. That's short-term evolution for you.

Also, there is such a thing as an "alarm" clock inside animals' bodies. Ya know birds, right? How do you think they know when to migrate? Internal clock, which is triggered by environmental cues, such as a lower amount of sunlight than normal. Also, ever hear of the "biological clock?" That's when females (don't know if males have one O_o) suddenly want to have kids, like, they really want to have kids due to hormonal imbalances.

Sorry if this doesn't answer your questions, but I couldn't really understand what you were trying to say.

I wake up alive because I am not dead. I'm not dead because my body has the energy to keep on living, it has proper amounts of sustenance, and it isn't fatally harmed. That's why I'm not dead. Yes, that is science. In fact, it's a specific science called "biology." People die in their sleep due to the opposite of one of more of the reasons I just listed. Again, that's biology.

Ninja48

Explain to me, even in general, how the Big Bang Theory works. I bet you fucking can't. How about when you don't believe in something, make sure you know what that something is.


Also, on the idea of God in general:
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing?
Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able, and willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing?
Then why call him God?
Epicurus

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Shoot To Death

I like how you had no answer to the plaques i wrote the examples of them and decided to skip it which means there is a big flaw in science right there,.

LonelyNinja

Hm, maybe that's because you made that post while I was making that one? Ever think about that? And I think it's funny how you didn't try to counter any of my points, so there's a major flaw in religion.

Also, you added that part and it wasn't directed at me anyways, so why would I respond to it if a) I didn't see it and b) it wasn't directed at me?

RNB

I will give you my answers, but I do not know them to be true. They are just my own explanations. This is based off of my interpretation of who God is.

I believe God does not destroy evil because without a good and an evil how would humans be able to actually love God. If humans could only choose the good then they would always choose love thus it would not be true love between God and man.

I wouldn't consider him that way. Now what I am about to say may start some controversy, but I assure you that I do not believe this. It is simply a theory of mine.

You argue that if God does not get rid of evil then he must be evil. Well this is what I have to say. Think about what I previously said about true love between man and God and how the ability to choose between good and evil gives us choice in general. Well if you do not choose the good side then what are you? You would be pure evil. In a sinless environment that God has in store for Christians where must the pure evil go? To the pure evil environment, Hell. Is it God's fault if one chooses evil? It would only be a yes if you believe God was in control of who goes where and whatnot. This part I am still thinking about.

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"Nature loves to be hidden."

- Heraclitus

knife man

I couldn't completely understand what you were trying to say to me there.
First. I was giving a scenario.
Second. Illusions are not exclusively by a god either, ex: magicians.
Third. Where in this thread have i posted that i don't believe in god? I merely pointed out that a plague isn't a godly creation. I could be a religious zelot for all you know; but indeed i don't believe in god.


fine then, i will change my scenario.
There is an amazing magician that was helping (insert religious figure) to fool the masses into seeing what they wanted them to see. They don't control the minds of the masses, but they convince them. And those people convince other people, resulting in the religion.

i haven't given it much thought till now, but think of this scenario seriously. Lets go with Jesus, just for my sake. Say he had a group of men on his side and when he was nailed to the cross the nails were driven through places that had less blood vessels and pain sensors. Then when he was stabbed "in the heart" with the spear, what if they purposely missed and just missed the vitals? Thus when he was taken off the cross, he played dead and was put to rest in that cave(?). But in reality he was fully alive and it was an elaborate act that only a select few were in on. So then after he comes back says hi to a few people then goes away, he could have gone into hiding and started pretty much a cult that became Christianity and in his hiding spot, could write the bible and publish it. And why would someone do such a thing? to make money of course. Now i find this somewhat believable because i've seen things in history of governments going to extreme lengths to get money.



that is an amazing quote

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props to Lonely Ninja

LonelyNinja

I actually saw an episode of "Ripley's Believe It or Not" that debunked a few of the "great plagues." In Britain, there was a huge storm that happened, and guess what? It started to "rain" fish. If it can "rain" fish, then isn't it possible that it can "rain" frogs? Also, frogs move around on land, a luxury fish don't. So, the frogs traveled from a river or lake to the city. Also, ever think that maybe the Jews put the frogs there, ya know, to freak the Egyptians out? People are capable of deceiving one another and covering it up. Now, for the river turning to "blood:" In a town near the Nile River there was a dust storm of red sand. The sand blanketed everything in the town. The next few days it rained, and when people looked outside they said that it looked like everything was covered in blood. Now, to make the connection: Sand and sediment collect in rivers. When there's a certain amount of a colored sand, the water can change colors. So, it's possible that a boatload of red sand collected in the Nile River and made the river seem like it was full of blood.

As for the Egyptians' first born sons dying, it is not impossible that the Jews did that. Seriously, the Jews are human. Humans do unspeakable shit like that, regardless of their religion. Red Sea parting: Well, water levels raise and fall according to tide. Bottoms of seas aren't flat plains. There are valleys and mountains underneath the water, so in one spot there could be an underwater bridge that shows up when the tide goes down.

Now, for the overall explanation: The Bible/Koran/Torah are composed of different stories and fables, not necessarily facts. Sure, David and Goliath may have been real, but it's completely possible that Goliath suffered from a pituitary disorder that made him grow to an abnormal height (it's happened before, and if you don't believe me, look up the world's tallest man, he had the same thing going on). Then how did David kill Goliath with a single stone from his sling? When people have pituitary disorders, that means the pituitary gland is larger than normal, and this gland is behind the eyes, optic nerves. Strike a man with, say, a stone there and he'll fall over in extreme agony and possible blindness. Then David goes over and finishes the job. Also, people can make up stories. For example, I could write a story about a fox killing five people and turn it into some moral story and I can say that it's how the world was created. Ever think that the Bible/Koran/Torah is a big "This is how you should live" book, not a "Take everything little thing in here literally" book?