Byakugan & Sharingan Theory

hyuga Jaque · 03-04-2009, 02:25 AM

I was just wondering..

Naruto season 2 episode 46
Kakshi speaks of how the Byakugan was here first, and eventually the
Sharingan came later from the hyuuga clan.
Reference I @ 1:26

So if the Sharingan came from the hyuuga clan, would there be a 2nd level to the Byakugan? Like a Mangekyou Byakugan?

Why would I ask this?

The insight of the Byakugan can look through solid matter and see the collection of atoms that make up that matter
i.e.->look through your skin, muscles, bones, organs and see your flow of chakra?

In Plain English:
The Byakugan can distort space/time
The Byakugan can see over great distances
The Byakugan can see chakra

All these things can be seen by watching Season 5 episode 116-117
Reference II (sorry it's hard to find sites that still have 116-117)

The Sharingan has these similar (or modified) traits

The Sharingan can distort space/time
aka slow down high speed movement Season 6 episode 133.
When Sasuke activates his 3rd tomae he can now see what naruto is about to do next
Reference III @ 7:18

&

The Sharingan can't see chakra but it can detect the required amount needed to correctly copy a move.

-An example would be: naruto Season 4 episode 82 when Kakashi copies Kisame's water shark Missile attack
Reference IV @ 1:29

--Another example would be when kakashi copied (PERFECTLY

) Zabuza's attack

It took me 1 hour to put all this research, questions & examples together on notepad. But 3 minutes to copy and past (and edit) it onto this post.

Man that's life I guess...

Ironclad · 03-04-2009, 03:05 AM

Genetically speaking the Sharingan and the Magenkyo Sharingan may actually be the natural evolution of the Byakugan. If the inheritance is divergent (as it seems that the sharingan has started an evolution on it's own) then the byakugan can be considered a dead end perhaps...or another evolutionary path.

it can go threeways. I will dig something up about this.

popion · 03-04-2009, 03:17 AM

Sharingan

Quote:

Abilities
The Sharingan's first and most well known ability is to memorize any technique that it witnesses. It can memorize Ninjutsu, Genjutsu, and Taijutsu with perfect accuracy, allowing the user to use the techniques as his own. In order to reproduce copied jutsu, however, one must have the necessary skill or ability to perform them. A prime example is Rock Lee's brand of Taijutsu. While Sasuke was able to copy some of Lee's moves, they put a much more significant strain on him since he hasn't trained physically nearly as hard as Lee has. In addition to physical skill, the Sharingan cannot allow the user to reproduce other Kekkei Genkai since the Sharingan user doesn't possess the same genetic trait. Additionally, Sharingan users cannot summon a creature which they have not made a contract with.

The Sharingan also grants the user incredible clarity of perception, allowing them to track fast-moving objects with ease and even predict the subsequent movements of those objects. The ability to track and predict movement is largely based on individual skill, as unskilled users have much more trouble tracking fast-moving objects. A fully-evolved Sharingan eye can track all but the quickest opponents, even if the user can't move at the same speed, (so even if the user can follow his or her opponents movements it doesn't necessarily mean their body will be able to react fast enough even though they saw the attack coming). This perception is also great enough to see through Genjutsu, depending upon the skill of the user, and the ability to observe the movement and flow of chakra, but not to the same extent or clarity as the Byakugan. Another ability of the Sharingan is the ability to see chakra as color, even through other objects. For example when Sasuke fights Deidara, he can see Deidara's bombs hidden under ground because of their chakra. Additionally, the Sharingan grants the user exceptional analytical powers, allowing them to instinctively pick up on various visual clues with little difficulty. In one instance, Kakashi had to shut his eyes to avoid accidentally reading Naruto's lip movements while he was spoiling the ending of one of Kakashi's Icha Icha books. Sasuke was also able to reproduce answers on another person's test by watching their pencil movements during the Chunin Exam.

The Sharingan also is capable of a unique brand of hypnosis that involves suggesting actions and thoughts to the opponent through simple eye contact. When used in conjunction with the other aspects of the Sharingan, this allows the user to perfectly mimic every move their opponent makes, even before they do, making it appear as if the user can see the future. More advanced Sharingan users can take the hypnosis ability even further by tricking or even trapping their opponent within an illusion. The potency of the Sharingan's illusion is dependent on the user's knowledge and skill with implementing Genjutsu.

Mangekyo Sharingan

Quote:

Abilities
The Mangekyo Sharingan gives a user access to the most powerful and forbidden techniques of the Uchiha Clan. Itachi has demonstrated through his Mangekyo Sharingan mastery over Amaterasu, Susanoo, and Tsukuyomi. Kakashi has used his Mangekyo Sharingan to perform Kamui. Sasuke's Mangeyko Sharingan hasn't displayed any unique abilities aside from Amaterasu.

Byakugan

Quote:

Abilities
The Byakugan is the primary focus of the Hyuga's special arts. When the Byakugan is activated, their pupils become more distinct and the veins near their temples bulge. Once active the Byakugan gives the user a near 360º field of vision except for one blind spot at the back of the neck above the third thoracic vertebra. They also have the ability to see through solid objects, and can use a degree of telescopic sight. The distance and the degree of telescopic sight varies from person to person. In Part I, Neji Hyuga was able to see an area of 50 meters, but later he increases his visual range to at least 800 meters. During the hunt for either of the Uchiha brothers, Hinata was shown to be able to view Amaterasu's flames and the chakra in the area from ten kilometers away.

However, one of the greatest uses of the Byakugan is the ability to see the chakra circulation system inside of another's body. The Byakugan has also shown the ability to see what a person's chakra type is, by looking into someone's chakra points. It is from this particular ability that they are able to employ their ultimate attack style: Gentle Fist. Unlike the Strong Fist, which is focused on external injuries, the Gentle Fist style focuses on internal injuries. Each strike, when placed correctly, strikes along the Chakra Pathway System, which is the network of vessels that carry chakra. This network is closely intertwined with the functioning of the body's organs, and so when the keirakukei take damage, the organs suffer as well. There is no defense against the Gentle Fist, since one cannot train one's internal organs to become stronger. The only possible defense is to stop the Gentle Fist's hits from connecting.

Particularly skilled users of the Byakugan, which appear only rarely, such as Neji Hyuga, can take the Gentle Fist style one step further. Along the keirakurei are 361 pinprick-sized nodes called Tenketsu, or chakra points. When struck, these tenketsu will seal off, which close the opening points from which chakra is emitted. Thus, with precision, all those points along the victim's body can be sealed, stopping the chakra flow to those areas. Most of the Hyuga clan cannot even perform this because the Tenketsu are too small to see. Neji Hyuga is the rare exception, having taught himself the ultimate Hyuga technique, Eight Trigrams Sixty-Four Palms, along with Hinata Hyuga, who was not able to do 64 palms like Neji, but she is able to do Eight Trigrams 32 Palms, an slightly weaker version of Neji's, albeit only in the anime. Able to strike without force, and yet do more damage to a ninja than some of the most powerful Ninjutsu, the Gentle Fist is the greatest Taijutsu style known in all of Konoha.

if the byakugan where to have a 2nd stage like the sharingan, hiashi/asuma/neji would have droped some hints by now.
sharingan is only a variation of the byakugan, focused on visual percetion, rather than internal insight
byakugan can be taken a step further(from the basic gentle fist) trough training/talent (see neji).
sharingan is more a "lazy" doujutsu. his only presence can potentaly transform you in a powerfull ninja with the traits it grants (trough unlocking, 3 stages 1st then MS last).

aeondrift · 03-04-2009, 02:22 PM

Maybe someone from the clan broke the rule and married outside of the clan, which hence inadvertently resulted in the mutation from Byakugan into Sharingan...(?)

popion · 03-04-2009, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aeondrift

Maybe someone from the clan broke the rule and married outside of the clan, which hence inadvertently resulted in the mutation from Byakugan into Sharingan...(?)

could be
also it could be like in RL, random mutation
but ... i still belive that it's just a specialized version of the byakugan, developed trough training in that particular area (outside perception).

hyuga Jaque · 03-04-2009, 04:51 PM

Thanks for all the reply's.

I do wonder why there's no hint or anything else being mentioned about another level of the Byakugan. Honestly most of the cartoon seems to swirl around Naruto & Sasuke's "issues". So it's no surprise that the other doujutsu of the anime doesn't get any attention.

It'll be nice if Neji shows us a new Byakugan if he were to fight Pain.

Eventually there would have to come a time that it evolves (or adapts some new characteristics) to better allow a hyuuga to survive in combat. Unless it's a dead end like Ironclad mentioned.

Wow Professor popion That was a deep post.

popion · 03-04-2009, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hyuga Jaque

Thanks for all the reply's.

I do wonder why there's no hint or anything else being mentioned about another level of the Byakugan. Honestly most of the cartoon seems to swirl around Naruto & Sasuke's "issues". So it's no surprise that the other doujutsu of the anime doesn't get any attention.

It'll be nice if Neji shows us a new Byakugan if he were to fight Pain.

Eventually there would have to come a time that it evolves (or adapts some new characteristics) to better allow a hyuuga to survive in combat. Unless it's a dead end like Ironclad mentioned.

Wow Professor popion That was a deep post.

i geek lmao

if it where for the byakugan to have a 2nd stage, hiashi would have hinted that, of neji would have developed it already

byakugan is bassed on individual skill. just look at neji and hinata
neji the genious who tought himself the 64 palms (as he isnt alowed to learn it, cuz he is in a secondary branch), who beat a jounin in cs2 as a chunin, just by useing what he had properly.
hinata, avrege hyuga (when it comes to gentle fist), trough training she created those powerfull jutsus from the anime fillers

on the other hand we have sasgay.
sharingan. he sees lee taijutsu, he copyes it, after just a little traing he is almost as fast as lee, who trained years to achive that lvl.
kakashi shows him chidori, he copyes it and in a few days he is able to use it several times a day
in the fight vs haku, the danger makes his 2nd tomoe in 1 eye to aperar. he just got the power up needed to track haku. he uses dragon fire twice and he hits an oponent witch moves at the friging speed of light
vs naruto(valey of end) he get another tomoe, and he tracks naruto and predicts all him movements.

wtf uchiha can train by going in the batle unarmed/unarmored and if he returns he becomes great fighter, if he doesnt, who cares, he is dead

a hyuga has to train years to reach that lvl

kluang · 03-04-2009, 07:05 PM

Byakugan

Sharingan

Sharingan is a mutation. I think some of the none head family rebel a long time ago. And to rival the head honcos of hyuuga they stroke a bargain with the kyuubi. Since kyuubi is a bad bad kitty he curse and bless them with the sharingan and fire element trait.

Kyuubi knows about the sharingan more than Sasuke.

shippuuden101 · 03-04-2009, 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aeondrift

Maybe someone from the clan broke the rule and married outside of the clan, which hence inadvertently resulted in the mutation from Byakugan into Sharingan...(?)

Thats what I was thinking. Someone must have married outside of the clan who has some sort of bloodline limit causing a mutation.

It seems like the Sharingan is more advanced cuz it has more stages

SunXia · 03-05-2009, 08:51 PM

Wow, I do often wonder about this myself!! Kakashi did say the Byakugan was better for sheer insight but i don't know about anything else!!

Who's to say the Byakugan does not have a second state, after all, the Mangeko Sharingan is a rare occurance and only happens in those that are very strong Sharingan users and who do something traumatic like kill their best friend!! We haven't seen anyone do this in the Hyuga clan because its pretty strict with its members but you never know...maybe Neji can accidentally kill Tenten to find out!!

Konnaha_yellow_flash · 03-05-2009, 09:06 PM

Im hoping kishi will take the Byakuugan to another level. But, I doubt Kishi will do such a thing. Hes seems to busy developing Naruto and Sasuke IMO.

hyuga Jaque · 03-06-2009, 12:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shippuuden101

Thats what I was thinking. Someone must have married outside of the clan who has some sort of bloodline limit causing a mutation.

It seems like the Sharingan is more advanced cuz it has more stages

I believe the Sharingan is the product of a hard working Hyuuga that didn't want to train for years anymore to devlope/master jutsu's (see side story)->

[My side Story]
Hyuuga--"I wish I didn't have to train everyday..."
Hyuuga--"Oh wow look at the azz on that.....I gotta hit that."
Hyuuga--"Oh hey baby, those red eyes look good on you. But I know something else that would look better on you."
Lady--"What?"
Hyuuga--"Me!"

And then 9 months later a black eyed baby was born, years later that babies eyes turned red when it was almost killed by a Senju clan member. Years later that baby didn't want to be referred to as a Hyuuga anymore and started a clan called Uchiha.

The rest is history....

So if the Sharingan is a mutation of the Byakugan, then there should be a way for the Byakugan to counter the effects of the Sharingan. Because the Sharingan has (or had) some of the DNA of it's parent the Byakugan in order to mutate (hence why it's still a doujutsu and gets activated instead of being "on" all the time, just like it's parent).

well I guess that's another thing the 9 tails would know about. The history of the Sahringan (that kyuubi is starting to look like a living almanac).

Anyway, I wish Kishi would elaborate more on other clans besides the damn Uchiha's. I enjoy the story so far, but at times I'd like to find out more about the Byakugan.

dragonnik · 03-16-2009, 06:18 AM

By the way i don't think Byakugan is active all the time. It activates on the will of the user....
It might have been possible tht sum1 like Oro mst hav built sum kind of nasty potion, who thn injects into 100s of Byakugan's females..which may than have lead to "Sharingan"...

..And just to distinguish his new creativity he put red color pigment in tht potion..lol..

Katano · 03-16-2009, 07:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by popion

wtf uchiha can train by going in the batle unarmed/unarmored and if he returns he becomes great fighter, if he doesnt, who cares, he is dead

a hyuga has to train years to reach that lvl

uhm .. Dragonball Z -> Super Saiyans ?

Same theory. If they have a tough battle (nearly defeated or chanceless) they come out a lot stronger than when they entered.

03-04-2009, 02:25 AM	#1
hyuga Jaque Academy Student Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 16 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Byakugan & Sharingan Theory I was just wondering.. Naruto season 2 episode 46 Kakshi speaks of how the Byakugan was here first, and eventually the Sharingan came later from the hyuuga clan. Reference I @ 1:26 So if the Sharingan came from the hyuuga clan, would there be a 2nd level to the Byakugan? Like a Mangekyou Byakugan? Why would I ask this? The insight of the Byakugan can look through solid matter and see the collection of atoms that make up that matter i.e.->look through your skin, muscles, bones, organs and see your flow of chakra? In Plain English: The Byakugan can distort space/time The Byakugan can see over great distances The Byakugan can see chakra All these things can be seen by watching Season 5 episode 116-117 Reference II (sorry it's hard to find sites that still have 116-117) The Sharingan has these similar (or modified) traits The Sharingan can distort space/time aka slow down high speed movement Season 6 episode 133. When Sasuke activates his 3rd tomae he can now see what naruto is about to do next Reference III @ 7:18 & The Sharingan can't see chakra but it can detect the required amount needed to correctly copy a move. -An example would be: naruto Season 4 episode 82 when Kakashi copies Kisame's water shark Missile attack Reference IV @ 1:29 --Another example would be when kakashi copied (PERFECTLY) Zabuza's attack It took me 1 hour to put all this research, questions & examples together on notepad. But 3 minutes to copy and past (and edit) it onto this post. Man that's life I guess... __________________

03-04-2009, 03:05 AM	#2
Ironclad Jounin Join Date: Feb 2009 Age: 28 Posts: 832 Thanks: 37 Thanked 207 Times in 125 Posts	Re: Byakugan & Sharingan Theory Genetically speaking the Sharingan and the Magenkyo Sharingan may actually be the natural evolution of the Byakugan. If the inheritance is divergent (as it seems that the sharingan has started an evolution on it's own) then the byakugan can be considered a dead end perhaps...or another evolutionary path. it can go threeways. I will dig something up about this.

03-04-2009, 02:22 PM	#4
aeondrift Genin Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: England Posts: 292 Thanks: 25 Thanked 9 Times in 8 Posts	Re: Byakugan & Sharingan Theory Maybe someone from the clan broke the rule and married outside of the clan, which hence inadvertently resulted in the mutation from Byakugan into Sharingan...(?)

03-04-2009, 04:51 PM	#6
hyuga Jaque Academy Student Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 16 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Byakugan & Sharingan Theory Thanks for all the reply's. I do wonder why there's no hint or anything else being mentioned about another level of the Byakugan. Honestly most of the cartoon seems to swirl around Naruto & Sasuke's "issues". So it's no surprise that the other doujutsu of the anime doesn't get any attention. It'll be nice if Neji shows us a new Byakugan if he were to fight Pain. Eventually there would have to come a time that it evolves (or adapts some new characteristics) to better allow a hyuuga to survive in combat. Unless it's a dead end like Ironclad mentioned. Wow Professor popion That was a deep post. __________________

03-04-2009, 07:05 PM	#8
kluang One Punch Man Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 6,426 Thanks: 3,199 Thanked 4,699 Times in 2,111 Posts	Re: Byakugan & Sharingan Theory Byakugan Sharingan Sharingan is a mutation. I think some of the none head family rebel a long time ago. And to rival the head honcos of hyuuga they stroke a bargain with the kyuubi. Since kyuubi is a bad bad kitty he curse and bless them with the sharingan and fire element trait. Kyuubi knows about the sharingan more than Sasuke. __________________ To err is human, to forgive, divine. Humans aren't machines... they have souls, feelings. They live, they die, they love, they hate... And yes, they even make mistakes..... When kluang finds you creepy and wrong then you are beyond horrible. He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you. Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe. Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? Being Malaysian is about driving in a German car to an Indian restaurant for an Indonesian food, then travelling home, grabbing a Pakistani kebab on the way, to sit on Swedish furniture and watch American shows on a Japanese TV. Because we have no originality.

03-05-2009, 08:51 PM	#10
SunXia Chuunin Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Ireland Posts: 394 Thanks: 14 Thanked 72 Times in 51 Posts	Re: Byakugan & Sharingan Theory Wow, I do often wonder about this myself!! Kakashi did say the Byakugan was better for sheer insight but i don't know about anything else!! Who's to say the Byakugan does not have a second state, after all, the Mangeko Sharingan is a rare occurance and only happens in those that are very strong Sharingan users and who do something traumatic like kill their best friend!! We haven't seen anyone do this in the Hyuga clan because its pretty strict with its members but you never know...maybe Neji can accidentally kill Tenten to find out!! __________________ If becoming enlightened or intellectual means I must become arrogant and coldly cynical about the world around me, then I'd gladly remain a fool for the rest of my life.

03-16-2009, 06:18 AM	#13
dragonnik Genin Join Date: Jan 2009 Age: 29 Posts: 202 Thanks: 13 Thanked 19 Times in 19 Posts	Re: Byakugan & Sharingan Theory By the way i don't think Byakugan is active all the time. It activates on the will of the user.... It might have been possible tht sum1 like Oro mst hav built sum kind of nasty potion, who thn injects into 100s of Byakugan's females..which may than have lead to "Sharingan".....And just to distinguish his new creativity he put red color pigment in tht potion..lol..

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