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Old 04-08-2010, 03:37 PM   #1
nasreddine
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Post [Theory] Naruto's seal and Kyuubi control

Hello everybody, im new to the forum so feel free to tear it up with your honest opinions, here goes

Part 1: What we already know
OK, first lets Start with what we DO kno about naruto's jinchuuriki control and seal and also compare it with a perfect host in killerbee. I wont go too in-depth on this part as most of you kno this already.

1. Now we all kno compared to KB naruto is a noob with controlling his beast evident by the fact that

1.he loses control when using a small number of tails(hes only 100% sane using 1 tail)
2. cant call on the tailed forms nor can he turn it off on his own
3. life is shortened and skin damaged by the 9 tails chakra
4. actually starts turning into the 9 tails as the tails increase
5. the kyuubi has to be behind a cage jus to protect naruto.
Id give exact pages, but im fairly positive we all kno this true


2. Now ill directly compare KB with each number I listed with naruto to show my point, u also kno this so feel free to skip

1. KB can release tails up to 7(possibly 8 depending on if it was an author mistake or not) instantly with his OWN chakra and be in full control. this was called version 1 seen here
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/471/14/
2. KB can turn it on and off almost instantly by again using his own chakra.
3. so far no negative effects have been shown when he uses his tailed forms even when in version 2 which is the hachibi giving bee chakra here and again he's still in full control
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/471/09/
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/471/10/
4. he can release up to 8 full tails and the biju remains contained while its said that naruto will be destroyed if he reaches 9 tails....for now...ill explain that cliffhanger later lol
5. while Kyuubi in a cage the hachibi is not, he is jus inside of bee's body and is a part of him 4 lack of a better explanation, they work as a team and have eachothers respect.

Part 2: why the kyuubi is sealed the way it is compared to the hachibi

Now heres theory time

I believe the Kyuubi is sealed the same way the hachibi is albeit a different way of doing it but the end result is the same, now let me explain the difference. I believe when killerbee first gained his biju it was behind a cage jus like the kyuubi to keep it in check and when he was ready to harmonize with his beast the seal on the cage was released and the seal on his stomach disappeared(purely my opinion) the result can go two ways, 1.the beast escapes from the body and the host dies(like in naruto's current case) or 2.the jinchuuriki tames it and truly becomes one with it and in turn enabling the host to fully transform into the beast as we saw in the kb vs taka fight. I think the 2nd one applies to kb. now on to naruto

U might say its dumb to think the seal has to be broken to fully wield the bijus power but think about these hints kishi leaves us.http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/439/14-15
/http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/439/16/
1. the cages structure. if u lock something up to be kept in forever why put the key right where naruto can rip it off as he was bout to do. the cages has doors that can be open, why is even like that? bc its meant to be opened at some point. just not now.

2. in the same pages u see the fox say "tear off this seal and ill give u all my power" clearly everyone knows if the seal is takin off the biju will be released so why does he even say "Ill give u all my power" like I said earlier with be I believe when the time comes to fully merge with the beast and use its power the seal MUST be broken but the beast still contained in the body.

3. to further prove my point ill bring in the toad key. now we kno the key is able to not only make the seal stronger it can also WEAKEN the seal. why do this? why doesnt the key only strengthen the seal and not weaken it? its bc naruto is meant to release it one day and jiraiya tried to give naruto more kyuubi than he was ready for by loosing the seal http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/370/11/
look carefully when the toad says naruto "isnt ready yet" I take this as he is not ready to release the seal and utilize the kyuubi fully like kb does hence why the seal can be strengthened if he needs more time. I say it once again NARUTO WILL BREAK THE SEAL with the toad key and either be destroyed by his biju or tame it be like bee. minato believes that naruto can fully control the kyuubi bc he is his son. the way kishi set up the plot is obviously pointing toward this happening esp with the key talk and intro of kb, he is showing what naruto could be.

Yes when naruto's seal weakened he could easily go 9 tails with enuff anger but he has no control of the chakra and what form it takes like how he goes version 2 after 4 tails and grows bones at 6(Bee could summon the bones when he wanted) and dies when releasing 9 tails. eventually when the cage is opened like bee he will be able to use version 1 up to 8(or 9) tails with his own already enormous chakra, borrow chakra from the fox to make version 2(without the side affects), and be able to completely summon the 9 tails like bee can do the 8 tails so to summarize this theory

1. the seal was actually meant to be broken by naruto with the key ,bc the weaker the seal the more kyuubi he can use, but only when he's ready, maybe by bee's help with possibly samehaha since I believe he went thru a similar sealing process(yes I believe this too lol) ive supported this accordingly in the theory

2. Kishi has been proving, hinting, and foreshadowing that naruto can do this us many times u jus have to look closely

3. the Kyuubi will not be taken out of naruto. the cage seal will just be broken. and naruto will have to tame the fox when it is. minato believes he can do it(which is why the key is entrusted to naruto to kno when to strengthen it and when to weaken it) Jiraiya believed he could(tho he miscalculated and almost died) and tho I didnt mention it against neji 3rd hokage commends naruto on controlling the chakra and being stable(consider he was just 12) and wonders who TAUGHT him this, find the chapter yourself.

thanks for reading this long theory and if u have any questions, info I forgot, or jus wana bash it Ill be a good sport about it, thanks
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Old 04-08-2010, 04:07 PM   #2
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Re: [Theory] Naruto's seal and Kyuubi control

HOLY SHIT!!!
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Old 04-08-2010, 04:22 PM   #3
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Re: [Theory] Naruto's seal and Kyuubi control

Quote:
Originally Posted by 01purple View Post
HOLY SHIT!!!
what dod you mean
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Old 04-08-2010, 04:23 PM   #4
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Re: [Theory] Naruto's seal and Kyuubi control

I think what you said is true, but it is kind of a fucked up way of learning to control the kyubi if you have to remove the seal first. It just looks like a big gamble to me (either Naruto controls the kyubi or kyubi takes over completely).

The seal will probably be getting weaker gradually by Naruto and someone that will keep his eye on him (Yamato, Kakashi or Killerbee). That someone has to know how to reinforce the seal back if Naruto loses control, or help Naruto suppress kyubi (Yamato or Sasuke lol) so that Naruto can gain the control more easily by himself.
The key however is for Naruto to keep his consciousness during the kyubi time and it has been said that Naruto's own evil emotions (hatred) fuse with kyubi's and you get something even more sinister that way (a kyubi - human evil hybrid), that's what you get when Naruto is 4 tails.
So Naruto has to have a clear mind and a clear heart, that is what he is going to achieve ofc. If I trained him to use kyubi, I would probably insult the shit out of him just to see if he can keep his cool and not "give in to hatred". Plus it seems like fun insulting someone and say it's a part of their training.
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Also Kin and Gin as substitute for kyuubi chakra (the greatest amount of chakra in Naruto world) is something Kishi pulled out of his ass. I lost major respect. It would be like near the end of LOTR there happens to be another slightly weaker ring and Sauron is like "that will do". It kind of shits on everything established up to that point. It kind of insults my intelligence.
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Old 04-08-2010, 04:24 PM   #5
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Re: [Theory] Naruto's seal and Kyuubi control

Nothing in particular, just felt like screaming.

And that is a long ass theory that took me like three minutes to read.
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Old 04-08-2010, 04:26 PM   #6
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Re: [Theory] Naruto's seal and Kyuubi control

haha ok it's good then
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Old 04-08-2010, 05:07 PM   #7
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Re: [Theory] Naruto's seal and Kyuubi control

First of all, let me welcome you to the forums as I see you've been posting a lot lately.

Your theory overall has some merit, but I believe some of your arguments may be a bit weak, such as this one:

Quote:
Originally Posted by nasreddine View Post
....
2. in the same pages u see the fox say "tear off this seal and ill give u all my power" clearly everyone knows if the seal is takin(sic) off the biju(sic) will be released so why does he even say "Ill give u all my power" like I said earlier with be I believe when the time comes to fully merge with the beast and use its power the seal MUST be broken but the beast still contained in the body.
...
Remember, that the Kyuubi has been shown time and time again that it is a caged beast. It is deceptive, manipulative, and all a around malevolent force. When the Kyuubi said that, you can probably see how he wouldn't want to join Naruto, as you might suggest. He wants out of his cage. He is preying on Naruto's lack of resolve at that time, and wants him to release him free.

I'm still up in the air as to whether or not I believe KB has a "cage" for his Bijuu, but I'm inclined to think that he does. I can't imagine a person containing something, without a seal. You can't just merge with Bijuu, at least, from what I've seen-- You wouldn't be the same person anymore...

Lastly, let me just remind you that Hachibi gets a long great with KB. Or at least, from what we've seen. You'd imply that there is some sort of Symbiosis relationship going on there, and that Naruto is expected to do the same thing. This is where my thoughts differ on the matter: Kyuubi is evil, and cruel. He isn't going to just be "best friends" with Naruto, like KB and Hachibi seem to be. This is why in the latest chapters we realize that the Seal on Naruto allows him to extract Kyuubi chakra. But ever since the beginning, we've seen people refer to this chakra as foul, or malevolent chakra. This is probably because the Kyuubi chakra contained his "will" or evil influence. The only way Naruto is going to control the Kyuubi is through purity of mind/spirit, because the Kyuubi wants nothing to do with him.

Don't be discouraged, as I promote theories I realized you took a lot of time to write all this up, so I figured I'd give you a response.
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Old 04-08-2010, 06:06 PM   #8
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Re: [Theory] Naruto's seal and Kyuubi control

You have so many incorrect axioms that it is way to troublesome to correct them.

Sorry, but it is true. And since your axioms are incorrect...
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Quotes for noobs (learn how to break up a quote)
Quote:
Originally Posted by minato uchiha View Post
Ok Stubborn donkey, how do you break it up please and if your not willingly to tell me, then please DONT offer me no advice in future
So you can post the second bit and i shouldnt be allowed to if i dont tell you? Why be so rude?

Anyways, here is a quotes for noobs guide


1. A basic quote

[*QUOTE][*/QUOTE]

(the * need to be removed for it to work, I put them in so you can see the text) is a basic quote that just wraps something in a quote without saying who quoted it who quoted so

[*QUOTE]this is a quote[*/QUOTE] without any * would look like
Quote:
this is a quote

Edit: there is a button for this, it looks like a speech bubble. If you select text and then press the button the selected text will automatically be wrapped with the quote tag


2. A quote that says who said it

[*QUOTE=who said it][*/QUOTE] this adds who said the post, manually putting that there can be useful when quoting something external. Example:

[*QUOTE=Mangastream]Remember all you sexy bastards out there, Naruto, Bleach, OP, FT, etc. all on break this week. Feel free to take your rage out on us[*/QUOTE] without any * would look like
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mangastream
Remember all you sexy bastards out there, Naruto, Bleach, OP, FT, etc. all on break this week. Feel free to take your rage out on us
3. A quote that says who said it and links to the post where it was said

[*QUOTE=who said it;X][*/QUOTE]

Where X is the post number.

For the post that i originally quoted it would look like this

[*QUOTE=minato uchiha;2118164]Ok Stubborn donkey, how do you break it up please and if your not willingly to tell me, then please DONT offer me no advice in future[*/QUOTE]

That is what you get when you press the quote button.

4. Breaking up a quote

Now that you know how quotes work it all boils down to preference, how you want it to look like and how you want to do it.

One way of doing it is copying the latter part of the original quote [*/QUOTE] and then pasting it after each section you break up, write your reply, choose the text you want then paste it after that portion, repeat till you finish the go back and copy then paste the first part of the text at the beginning of each portion of text. Of course you can immediately copy and paste both parts of a poste so that you dont forget one in the end.

The end result would be something like this

[*QUOTE=minato uchiha;2118164]Ok Stubborn donkey,[*/QUOTE]
My reply 1
[*QUOTE=minato uchiha;2118164] how do you break it up please[*/QUOTE]
my reply 2
[*QUOTE=minato uchiha;2118164]and if your not willingly to tell me, [*/QUOTE]
my reply 3
[*QUOTE=minato uchiha;2118164]then please DONT offer me no advice in future[*/QUOTE]
my reply 4



Which without any * would look like

Quote:
Originally Posted by minato uchiha View Post
Ok Stubborn donkey,
My reply 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by minato uchiha View Post
how do you break it up please
my reply 2
Quote:
Originally Posted by minato uchiha View Post
and if your not willingly to tell me,
my reply 3
Quote:
Originally Posted by minato uchiha View Post
then please DONT offer me no advice in future
my reply 4


Another way of doing it would be to cut and paste the second part of the quote tag after the first section of text you want to seperate then write your reply select the second part and hit he quote button (it looks like a text bubble),if you do that without anything else the end result would be

[*QUOTE=minato uchiha;2118164]Ok Stubborn donkey,[*/QUOTE]
My reply 1
[*QUOTE] how do you break it up please[*/QUOTE]
my reply 2
[*QUOTE]and if your not willingly to tell me, [*/QUOTE]
my reply 3
[*QUOTE]then please DONT offer me no advice in future[*/QUOTE]
my reply 4

Which would look like

Quote:
Originally Posted by minato uchiha View Post
Ok Stubborn donkey,
My reply 1
Quote:
how do you break it up please
my reply 2
Quote:
and if your not willingly to tell me,
my reply 3
Quote:
then please DONT offer me no advice in future
my reply 4

To make it like the previous example (which wpuld be preferred, though not necessary ) copy the part that says who posted with the link to the post and paste it accordingly to the proper part in each first half of each quote tag. In my I would copy =minato uchiha;2118164 and paste it where the # is
[*QUOTE#] to get [*QUOTE=minato uchiha;2118164] (of course with the * removed)


Of course you can use any other method you like to get to the end result, but now that you know what the end rwsult looks like I think there shouldnt be any problems
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Old 04-08-2010, 06:21 PM   #9
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Re: [Theory] Naruto's seal and Kyuubi control

We don't know if Hachibi/KB relationship was as good as it is now. Nothing tells us if they were the same as Kyuubi/Naruto right now. Hachibi might have been evil before...
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Old 04-08-2010, 06:29 PM   #10
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Re: [Theory] Naruto's seal and Kyuubi control

Quote:
Originally Posted by UzumakiMat View Post
We don't know if Hachibi/KB relationship was as good as it is now. Nothing tells us if they were the same as Kyuubi/Naruto right now. Hachibi might have been evil before...
However evil he might have been, it can't come close to the Kyuubi.

Maybe the Hachibi got bored and decided to cooperate with KB. Heck, KB is (relatively) much older :P
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Quotes for noobs (learn how to break up a quote)
Quote:
Originally Posted by minato uchiha View Post
Ok Stubborn donkey, how do you break it up please and if your not willingly to tell me, then please DONT offer me no advice in future
So you can post the second bit and i shouldnt be allowed to if i dont tell you? Why be so rude?

Anyways, here is a quotes for noobs guide


1. A basic quote

[*QUOTE][*/QUOTE]

(the * need to be removed for it to work, I put them in so you can see the text) is a basic quote that just wraps something in a quote without saying who quoted it who quoted so

[*QUOTE]this is a quote[*/QUOTE] without any * would look like
Quote:
this is a quote

Edit: there is a button for this, it looks like a speech bubble. If you select text and then press the button the selected text will automatically be wrapped with the quote tag


2. A quote that says who said it

[*QUOTE=who said it][*/QUOTE] this adds who said the post, manually putting that there can be useful when quoting something external. Example:

[*QUOTE=Mangastream]Remember all you sexy bastards out there, Naruto, Bleach, OP, FT, etc. all on break this week. Feel free to take your rage out on us[*/QUOTE] without any * would look like
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mangastream
Remember all you sexy bastards out there, Naruto, Bleach, OP, FT, etc. all on break this week. Feel free to take your rage out on us
3. A quote that says who said it and links to the post where it was said

[*QUOTE=who said it;X][*/QUOTE]

Where X is the post number.

For the post that i originally quoted it would look like this

[*QUOTE=minato uchiha;2118164]Ok Stubborn donkey, how do you break it up please and if your not willingly to tell me, then please DONT offer me no advice in future[*/QUOTE]

That is what you get when you press the quote button.

4. Breaking up a quote

Now that you know how quotes work it all boils down to preference, how you want it to look like and how you want to do it.

One way of doing it is copying the latter part of the original quote [*/QUOTE] and then pasting it after each section you break up, write your reply, choose the text you want then paste it after that portion, repeat till you finish the go back and copy then paste the first part of the text at the beginning of each portion of text. Of course you can immediately copy and paste both parts of a poste so that you dont forget one in the end.

The end result would be something like this

[*QUOTE=minato uchiha;2118164]Ok Stubborn donkey,[*/QUOTE]
My reply 1
[*QUOTE=minato uchiha;2118164] how do you break it up please[*/QUOTE]
my reply 2
[*QUOTE=minato uchiha;2118164]and if your not willingly to tell me, [*/QUOTE]
my reply 3
[*QUOTE=minato uchiha;2118164]then please DONT offer me no advice in future[*/QUOTE]
my reply 4



Which without any * would look like

Quote:
Originally Posted by minato uchiha View Post
Ok Stubborn donkey,
My reply 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by minato uchiha View Post
how do you break it up please
my reply 2
Quote:
Originally Posted by minato uchiha View Post
and if your not willingly to tell me,
my reply 3
Quote:
Originally Posted by minato uchiha View Post
then please DONT offer me no advice in future
my reply 4


Another way of doing it would be to cut and paste the second part of the quote tag after the first section of text you want to seperate then write your reply select the second part and hit he quote button (it looks like a text bubble),if you do that without anything else the end result would be

[*QUOTE=minato uchiha;2118164]Ok Stubborn donkey,[*/QUOTE]
My reply 1
[*QUOTE] how do you break it up please[*/QUOTE]
my reply 2
[*QUOTE]and if your not willingly to tell me, [*/QUOTE]
my reply 3
[*QUOTE]then please DONT offer me no advice in future[*/QUOTE]
my reply 4

Which would look like

Quote:
Originally Posted by minato uchiha View Post
Ok Stubborn donkey,
My reply 1
Quote:
how do you break it up please
my reply 2
Quote:
and if your not willingly to tell me,
my reply 3
Quote:
then please DONT offer me no advice in future
my reply 4

To make it like the previous example (which wpuld be preferred, though not necessary ) copy the part that says who posted with the link to the post and paste it accordingly to the proper part in each first half of each quote tag. In my I would copy =minato uchiha;2118164 and paste it where the # is
[*QUOTE#] to get [*QUOTE=minato uchiha;2118164] (of course with the * removed)


Of course you can use any other method you like to get to the end result, but now that you know what the end rwsult looks like I think there shouldnt be any problems
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Old 04-09-2010, 12:19 AM   #11
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Re: [Theory] Naruto's seal and Kyuubi control

Interesting theory, but as KatrinaKatt said, the Kyuubi only wants to be free. It's evil to the core and has pure hatred in it's heart. Which is why Naruto needs to find a way to use all the Kyuubi's chakra without succumbing to it's will. The fox is also cunning and decieving and he'll do anything to convince Naruto to release the seal. Like the time when Naruto almost became the Nine-tails when he gave into hatred. As Naruto said in chapter 490, he can't help fighting someone he has hatred for. It's part of being human. It's impossible to totally get rid of hatred but it's possible to not give into it. So in order for Naruto to fully control the Kyuubi's chakra, he has to master the hatred he has in his heart. He's shown that when he defeated Pain. Instead of giving into hatred, he chose to spare Nagato's life because of what Jiraiya taught him. Naruto knew that killing him won't bring his master back, and killing those who are connected to Nagato won't be true justice either.

It's the same for Sasuke. After he killed Itachi and learning the truth from Madara, he gave into his hatred and now wants to destroy the Hidden Leaf for crimes that only a few people committed. Yes those people deserved to be punished but killing them and everyone in Konoha won't bring his clan back. And even if he manages to destroy Konoha, he'll still find excuses to kill anyone else that stands in his way. He said so himself, if anyone chooses to deny him his way of life, then he'll kill everyone they ever cared about.

Hatred is now Sasuke's ninja way, and Naruto's ultimate test is to find a way to help Sasuke overcome his hatred and also overcome his own.

"War is mutually inflicted death, hatred and pain. But only the death of those closest to you is impossible to accept... So you fool yourself into thinking they're safe. Especially your generation... You've never known war... It's to be expected. You try to see a greater meaning behind the slaughter, but there is only hatred and pain and nothing you can do about it. Pointless death... Bottomless hatred... Unending pain... That is war. Naruto... It will be up to you to face it all..."
-Nagato

Last edited by Duncan33; 04-09-2010 at 12:28 AM.
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